# Gun owners, what is your favorite? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [December 12, 2002, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318 "2002-12-12T20:05:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![FallenAngel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@FallenAngel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FallenAngel)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2002, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/61 "2002-12-16T23:35:38Z")
**Susanann** , my experience in teaching several people to shoot, many of them women and one a small teenager, is that if I approach the recoil issue from the beginning, let them know it will happen but that it’s not any big deal and that they won’t drop the gun, lose control or have anything bad happen, they approach it as a natural thing and don’t get flinchy. That being said, I can’t deny that there are certainly benefits to including a .22 into the matrix. That’s why I recommend using a “full-size” handgun along with a .22. Ideally, the person I’m teaching will have a .357 and a .22 LR in similar sizes. S&W and Rugers both make both calibers on the same frames, which is great for inculcating “feel”. As a result, I have them start with .50 rounds out of the .22, put 100 through the .357 and then finish with 50 .22s. Unfortunately, I’ve only had a couple people I taught who had both guns, but renting one or the other at the range was just as effective. While every student is different and will respond differently, I’ve never had a bad or flinchy shooter come out of teaching them with a full-sized weapon. It’s just a matter of paying attention to the problems they’re having as they progress and addressing them before they become habits, just like teaching anything else. That being said, I’m very glad you’re teaching people to shoot, and it sounds like you’re very conscientious. Stylistic differences or no, thank you for teaching responsibility and accuracy. When I get static for carrying a 9mm (particularly when Mrs. FA carries a .45), I remind people that placement is what counts, and I’d gladly put the performance of a 147 hydra-shok to the heart or teeth against a 230 hyrda-shok to the thigh or shoulder any day. Keep your powder dry. ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2002, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/62 "2002-12-17T03:49:29Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Riboflavin \* > \*\*It’s really sad to see hoplophobes like Cartooniverse jumping into a thread with people discussing their lifestyles to demonstrate his lack of tolerance by wishing suffering on those who make different lifestyle choices than he does, and I certainly wouldn’t be surpsied if he supports the comission of hate crimes against gun owners like many of his ilk. His intolerance leads him to take joy in and wish for inuries on those who have made lifestyle choices he doesn’t approve of, and to project his own insecurities about his penis onto gun owners, much like Fred Phelps and pals do with regards to homosexuals and AIDS. \*\* How amusing, yet wrong. 1. I’ve had both family and friends murdered by people carrying the guns you are glorifying. It’s not a lifestyle. It’s glorifying weapons of death. Have some guts and admit it. I’m intolerant of people who glorify murder. Yep. I sure am. Who cannot get enough of keeping themselves surrounded by weapons that are SOLELY manufactured to chew through as many human bodies in 30 seconds as it can. I’ve spent enough time with highly trained and skilled marksmen to know the difference between using a gun to hone ones skills at target work, and collecting weapons so astonishingly deadly that they can cut an adult in half in 3 or 4 seconds. 1. I in NO WAY condone any acts of violence. While I might have written something that sounded like I do, the real life truth is that anyone who suffers an act of violence doesn’t deserve it, and has my sympathies. 2. I don’t know who Mr. Phelps is. I’m pretty close to a lot of gays. I’m not interested in your turning the gun thread into a gay bashing thread. At least I presented an opposing point of view that somehow related to the O.P. 3. This is the Straight Dope. You don’t need my approval. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2002, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/63 "2002-12-17T03:51:29Z")
Indeed, **Crafter**.The Founding Fathers had a very hard time with the Quakers. Read your History Book sometime. You want to know where the American Pacifist Movement began? It began at Old Friends’ Meetinghouse. VERY close to Constitution Hall in Olde City, Philadelphia. Me, I take your words as high praise, and thank you for them. ---
**Author:** ![Tony\_Montana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/278dde/32.png) [@Tony\_Montana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tony_Montana)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2002, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/64 "2002-12-17T04:21:52Z")
_what_ is that weapon the former USSR was working on to replace the AK until the country collapsed? ---
**Author:** ![Berkut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a88e57/32.png) [@Berkut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Berkut)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2002, 7:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/65 "2002-12-17T07:15:31Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Cartooniverse \* > \*\*How amusing, yet wrong. > > 1. I’ve had both family and friends murdered by people carrying the guns you are glorifying. It’s not a lifestyle. It’s glorifying weapons of death. Have some guts and admit it. I’m intolerant of people who _glorify murder_. > > 2. I in NO WAY condone any acts of violence. While I might have written something that sounded like I do, the real life truth is that anyone who suffers an act of violence doesn’t deserve it, and has my sympathies\*\* I’m sorry you have had loved ones killed. BUT… You are accusing us of glorifying murder? That is a pretty harsh thing to say to someone, even on a message board. This whole thread has been about safe and responsible firearm use and ownership, with one notable exception: \*My favorite kind of gun is the kind where the owner struts around like he’s got the biggest damned killer phallus in the world at his disposal, then inadvertently discharges it while it’s tucked into the waistband of his Levis just like Starsky and Hutch used to, severing his spinal cord and moving his life experience closer to Larry Flint than to Mark David Chapman. That’s my favorite kind of gun.\* I think you are out of line, and I find it shocking that you have had friends and family murdered and can still post something like you did above. You have far exceeded any of us in advocating gun violence. You don’t like my hobby? Fine. But don’t accuse me of glorifying murder. ---
**Author:** ![Riboflavin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Riboflavin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riboflavin)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2002, 8:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/66 "2002-12-17T08:58:06Z")
[QUOTE] \*Originally posted by Cartooniverse \* > [@](#): > > 1. I’ve had both family and friends murdered by people carrying the guns you are glorifying. So, the guns just got up one day and magically shot someone? That’s really fucking amazing, usually a person commits murder, not an object. And I’m really amazed > [@](#): > > It’s not a lifestyle. Owning guns is at least as much a lifestyle as homosexuality is. > [@](#): > > It’s glorifying weapons of death. Have some guts and admit it. I’m intolerant of people who glorify murder. Who glorified murder in this thread, or even posted in this thread but glorified murder elsewhere? You’re the only one who wished injury on anyone, though projection is not exactly uncommon for hoplophobes. Face it, you’re simply a sick person who needs to get help for a phobia. > [@](#): > > Yep. I sure am. Who cannot get enough of keeping themselves surrounded by weapons that are SOLELY manufactured to chew through as many human bodies in 30 seconds as it can. Cite, please. I want a cite that shows that even a single one of these weapons is designed to the standard you listed above. Otherwise it’s just another lie from you. > [@](#): > > I’ve spent enough time with highly trained and skilled marksmen to know the difference between using a gun to hone ones skills at target work, and collecting weapons so astonishingly deadly that they can cut an adult in half in 3 or 4 seconds. Now you’re just babbling. > [@](#): > > 1. I in NO WAY condone any acts of violence. While I might have written something that sounded like I do, the real life truth is that anyone who suffers an act of violence doesn’t deserve it, and has my sympathies. So, you don’t support ANY acts of violence against gun owners, including those committed by various police and tax collection agencies? Somehow I doubt that. Also, you EXPLICITLY wished injury and suffering on gunowners when you went on about wanting us to have severed spinal cords. It may not be ‘violence’ by your definition, but it still shows off your sickness. > [@](#): > > 1. I don’t know who Mr. Phelps is. I’m pretty close to a lot of gays. I’m not interested in your turning the gun thread into a gay bashing thread. Why am I not suprised at yet another lie from a hoplophobe? Can any of you even get through a single thread without lying? I didn’t attempt to turn the thread into a gay bashing thread as you allege, I pointed out the similarites between your gun owner bashing and gay bashing. Can you point out a single negative thing I said about gays? No, of course not, it’s just another lie. > [@](#): > > At least I presented an opposing point of view that somehow related to the O.P. An “opposing point of view” based solely on your own sick hatred of inanimite objects, projection of your personal penis issues onto others, and blatant ignorance. > [@](#): > > 1. This is the Straight Dope. You don’t need my approval. 🙂 \*\* Putting a smiley on the end of the post doesn’t change the fact that you’re a sick individual spewing forth lies and ignorance. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2002, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/67 "2002-12-17T17:13:42Z")
**Cartooniverse** : It is apparent your personal experience has clouded your judgment. This need not be the case. As an example, I have a co-worker who will forever be wheelchair-bound due to a firearms accident that occurred when he was a juvenile. Guess what his favorite hobby is nowadays? Shooting machine guns. Fear of firearms is abnormal. If you have a problem with firearms in the hands of peaceful Americans, I suggest getting some counseling. ---
**Author:** ![Susanann](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7ab992/32.png) [@Susanann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Susanann)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2002, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/68 "2002-12-17T22:52:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Cartooniverse \* > \*\*How amusing, yet wrong. > > 1. I’ve had both family and friends murdered by people carrying the guns you are glorifying. It’s not a lifestyle. It’s glorifying weapons of death. > 2. I don’t know who Mr. Phelps is. I’m pretty close to a lot of gays. I’m not interested in your turning the gun thread into a gay bashing thread. At least I presented an opposing point of view that somehow related to the O.P. > > 🙂 \*\* 1. I had a very close relative murdered last year. Yet, I did NOT try to outlaw the kind of weapon that he was killed with, nor did I hold anything against the weapon itself, it was an inanimate object. It was the killer that I had the problem with, not the weapon. My relative was murdered by a frying pan, an iron one, and he was repeatedly beaten with that pan in his head. I never once considered joining “Frying Pan Control”, or any other organization that wants to outlaw frying pans , just because some criminals misuse them. Many more people die from cars, and I dont believe in outlawing cars either. 1. Being homosexual or heterosexual, has nothing to do with guns. There is an organization called the Pink Pistols - which is a homosexual group that firmly and totally supports the Second Amendment, and the right to carry firearms. There is nothing in the Second Amendment that prevents homosexuals, jews, gentiles, gypsies, brown eyed people, men with beer bellies, or people with red hair from carrying guns. All americans can choose to be either defenseless, or to be able to defend themselves. Why shouldnt homosexuals carry concealed weapons too? That young kid from Laramie Wyoming should have been packing, if he had, we wouldnt have had our newspapers and tv stations cluttered up with the trial of his murderers. Just as an armed woman cannot be raped, an armed homosexual cannot be beaten to death. ---
**Author:** ![Susanann](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7ab992/32.png) [@Susanann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Susanann)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2002, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/69 "2002-12-17T23:08:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by FallenAngel \* > \*\*\*\*That being said, I can’t deny that there are certainly benefits to including a .22 into the matrix. That’s why I recommend using a “full-size” handgun along with a .22. Ideally, the person I’m teaching will have a .357 and a .22 LR in similar sizes. S&W and Rugers both make both calibers on the same frames, which is great for inculcating “feel”. As a result, I have them start with .50 rounds out of the .22, put 100 through the .357 and then finish with 50 .22s. > While every student is different and will respond differently, I’ve never had a bad or flinchy shooter come out of teaching them with a full-sized weapon. It’s just a matter of paying attention to the problems they’re having as they progress and addressing them before they become habits, just like teaching anything else. > > I remind people that placement is what counts, . \*\* Placement is everything. Flinching- Are you sure? …do you test for it with every student? Do you test for it more than just once or twice? Flinching is the biggest problem in accuracy. I have seen way too many flinching problems. This is something I always test for periodically, by leaving one, or more, of the chambers open occasionally, to see if there is a flinch, any movement at all in an empty shot, and it happens quite a bit. All instructors should be testing for this of all students. If someone has not shot a big gun for too long, it is easily corrected by steadily increasing the number and frequency of empty chambers, or even have the students dry fire until all flinching is gone, then making the chambers loaded, instead of unloaded, until they never flinch again. I can teach any "new "shooter to not flinch, and be deadly accurate. You sound more like a general instructor, I am a personal trainer- one on one(a la Paxton Quigley). 200 rounds is fine for a general instructor with a large class. None of my students gets by without many thousands of rounds - another reason to use .22’s. I do about 200 rounds in the “one handed training” part of the class, loading and firing with just one hand, and I have them do it for both hands. ---
**Author:** ![BF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b5ac83/32.png) [@BF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BF)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2002, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/70 "2002-12-17T23:59:37Z")
> [@](#): > > Placement is everything. Ah, a Cooper disciple. Although it’s probably been written before, welcome to the boards **Susanann**!! I look forward to seeing some more of your work. ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 11:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/71 "2002-12-18T11:40:33Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Crafter\_Man \* > \*\ ***Cartooniverse** : It is apparent your personal experience has clouded your judgment. This need not be the case. As an example, I have a co-worker who will forever be wheelchair-bound due to a firearms accident that occurred when he was a juvenile. Guess what his favorite hobby is nowadays? Shooting machine guns. \*\* Gee, talk about penis issues. And you say I HAVE clouded judgement? :eek: > [@](#): > > \*\*Fear of firearms is abnormal. If you have a problem with firearms in the hands of peaceful Americans, I suggest getting some counseling. \*\* \<-------laughing hard here. You MUST make a living as a counsellor. You really think I’m alone in my intense distaste of pistol-packing NON-LAW-ENFORCEMENT people in this country? ( Caps added lest anyone be stupid enough to attack me for lumping the only people in the country who should be carrying, in with the rest of the crowd ). I need counselling? Oh, lemme call that local N.R.A. office, no doubt they’ll be glad to counsel me. -smirk- ---
**Author:** ![Winston\_Smith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e95f7d/32.png) [@Winston\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Winston_Smith)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/72 "2002-12-18T13:53:00Z")
Vote with your feet. ---
**Author:** ![Tony\_Montana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/278dde/32.png) [@Tony\_Montana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tony_Montana)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/73 "2002-12-18T15:39:28Z")
> [@](#): > > talk about penis issues. I was wondering when that one would come along also. Its a fav amoungst the anti gun,SUV,fast car,etc,etc,… crowd. ---
**Author:** ![Kalashnikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/2bfe46/32.png) [@Kalashnikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalashnikov)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/74 "2002-12-18T15:55:40Z")
Its funny how the homopobes are obsessed with anuses, and the hoplophobes are obsessed with penises. Maybe they should get together. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Tony\_Montana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/278dde/32.png) [@Tony\_Montana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tony_Montana)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/75 "2002-12-18T16:11:53Z")
I mean if its a female with a gun(or SUV or fast car,etc) she’s got “penis-envy” if its a male he’s got “penis-issues” Leave my willy out of it already (free willy!)… ---
**Author:** ![lieu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c2a13f/32.png) [@lieu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lieu)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/76 "2002-12-18T16:21:48Z")
Back to the OP… My Ruger M77 in a 22-250 is just unbelivably accurate and flat shooting out to many hundreds of yards. We periodically have to do varmit control at the ranch and this is by far our weapon of choice, even more so than a 243. I’m getting a Ruger #1 in a 270 for Christmas, maybe it’ll soon be the favorite. ---
**Author:** ![Riboflavin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Riboflavin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riboflavin)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/77 "2002-12-18T17:02:23Z")
FYI, Susanann, the only mention of homosexuals was to point out the rather large similarity between homophobes like Fred Phelps and hoplophobes like Cartooniverse. His whining about not wanting this to turn into a gay-bashing thread is just an attempt to decieve people about what I said, which is normal for his kind. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Cartooniverse \* > \<-------laughing hard here. You MUST make a living as a counsellor. You really think I’m alone in my intense distaste of pistol-packing NON-LAW-ENFORCEMENT people in this country? ( Caps added lest anyone be stupid enough to attack me for lumping the only people in the country who should be carrying, in with the rest of the crowd ). And as is usual for your kind, you are always happy to spew forth absurdities like the above on inappropriate forums. Why are you such a pathetic wimp that you can’t even discuss the topic in, say, Great Debates or the Pit? Oh no, just like your other pathetic cohorts, you make your hate-filled comments in GQ or IMHO where you know a mod will eventually tell everyone to drop the debate part so you won’t have to actually support any of your lies. You’ve already admitted that you’re a coward but just posting into a forum appropriate for your comments doesn’t take physical courage so could you at least try to manage that? Oh no, it’s much safer to hijack threads that happen to mention guns than to actually argue for whatever it is that you believe. ---
**Author:** ![Winston\_Smith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e95f7d/32.png) [@Winston\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Winston_Smith)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/78 "2002-12-18T17:30:22Z")
Rally 'Round, folks. If we can just hold this Thread 'till nightfall, I think we’ll be OK! Seriously, though. This is not an OP about Gun Control, The Second Amendment, The First Amendment, Sexuality, Pee-Pee Size, or Bum-Holes. Please re-read the Thread Title if you are unsure. If you want to debate Gun control, I’m _pretty_ sure there’s a Forum for that kind of thing. This Forum is for **O** pinion **P** oles, and this is an Opinion Pole. Please re-read the Thread Title if you are unsure. An appropriate response to this Poll would be something like this “My favorite Gun is my AK 47. \.” Not “Blah blah blah. I think Guns are bad m’kay?.” You’re entitled to your opinion, but I think it’s inexcusable to try to turn this OP into something it isn’t. What started out as a fair and friendly exchange of ideas now has the potential of becoming some kind of pointless Flame War because you have an axe to grind. **cartooniverse** , I think you owe everyone in this Thread an apology. Furthermore, if you want to debate Gun Control, open your own Thread in Great Debates. Your responses thus far have nothing to do with the OP on the table, and have been intentionally disruptive. ---
**Author:** ![Winston\_Smith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e95f7d/32.png) [@Winston\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Winston_Smith)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/79 "2002-12-18T17:31:48Z")
Ha! I said **Pole**. Freudian Slip? heh-heh. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_of\_Graymatter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/74df32/32.png) [@Baron\_of\_Graymatter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_of_Graymatter)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318/80 "2002-12-18T17:42:39Z")
Handgun: Auto-Ordnance M1911A1 clone .45 ACP with Cienar .22 conversion and spare barrel in .400 Cor-Bon Rifle: Tie - No.1 Mk III SMLE and Krag carbine Scattergun: 20 bore flintlock fowler [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-what-is-your-favorite/142318.md?page=5)