# Gun shot wounds
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856
**Category:** Factual Questions
**Created:** [October 4, 2002, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856 "2002-10-04T16:25:26Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@poissongrand69](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/poissongrand69)
#### Post date: [October 4, 2002, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/1 "2002-10-04T16:25:26Z")
Been a lurker for a long time, but finally decided to register and post a questions which has got my curiousity.
Death from gunshot wounds… I assume unless its a direct hit into the head or heart, humans die from blood loss and shock from them???
Technically, you get shot once or twice and fall down do people pass out due to the pain, and their basically still alive but just out of it, and then die from blood loss etc…???
I guess the main question is, what happens when someone gets shot in the chest area… Since when people get shot in the arms or legs their still conscious… I assume. Thanks!!
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### Author:  [@mr.greg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mr.greg)
#### Post date: [October 4, 2002, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/2 "2002-10-04T16:38:58Z")
If you are not hit in the heart then you die from either blood loss or lung congestion due to a build up of blood. That is if you get hit in the chest. There is also an excruciating pain associated with this because the bullet is red hot when it enters. Getting shot anywhere other than the heart or head is probably one of the worst ways to die.
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### Author:  [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)
#### Post date: [October 4, 2002, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/3 "2002-10-04T18:00:11Z")
It’s a little more complicated than that, mr.greg.
From: [http://www.wmems.org/gunshot.htm](http://www.wmems.org/gunshot.htm)
Wounding Mechanisms:
Blast injury
Cavitation
Crush
Embolization
Fractures
Laceration
Perforation
Complications:
Compartment syndrome
Hematoma
Infection
Pneumothorax
Peritonitis
Rhabdomyolysis
Organ failure
Functional incapacity
system-specific complications:
Breathing
Pneumothorax
Hemothorax
Flail chest
Pulmonary contusion
Circulation
Hemorrhage
Hypovolemia
Cardiac Tamponade
Embolus
Deficits
Nerve damage
Head injuries
Bone and ligament injuries
And no, the pain is not due to “red hot bullets”. Icicles would be bad too, if impacting on your body at the speed of sound.
QtM, MD
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### Author:  [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)
#### Post date: [October 4, 2002, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/4 "2002-10-04T18:01:46Z")
Also, if the hydrostatic shock is great enough, a bullet wound to the hand will also kill. Certain weaponry and ammo is designed specifically to kill when impacting on extremities.
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### Author:  [@Max\_Torque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_Torque)
#### Post date: [October 4, 2002, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/5 "2002-10-04T18:07:27Z")
Remember those factoids that “the human body is 97% water” and such? Well, I don’t know what the exact number is, but the body **is** mostly water. And, as you might remember from high school physics, water doesn’t compress.
This means that when a bullet hits your body, which is basically an upright sack of mostly water, there are far-reaching effects as hydro-shock waves radiate outward from the source of impact. It is possible for a bullet that hits an arm or a leg to cause far-reaching effects, including organ failure.
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### Author:  [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)
#### Post date: [October 4, 2002, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/6 "2002-10-04T20:31:56Z")
Not to mention that some bullets are designed to split apart when they hit. These bullets shred the inside of the person they go into. They can leave a softball size hole on the inside of a person.
Mega-ouch.
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### Author:  [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)
#### Post date: [October 4, 2002, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/7 "2002-10-04T21:10:11Z")
Didn’t Cecil answer this very question?
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### Author:  [@drachillix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drachillix)
#### Post date: [October 4, 2002, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/8 "2002-10-04T21:31:50Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Mahaloth \*
> \*\*Not to mention that some bullets are designed to split apart when they hit. \*\*
Unless you are referring to Glaser safety slugs. Cite please?
[http://www.safetyslug.com/GelatinTest.htm](http://www.safetyslug.com/GelatinTest.htm)
gives a little picture of bullet impacts on gelatin. Gives you an idea of the path of damage from a bullet.
You might need to whip out a medical dictionary but **Quadgop** hit on several effects I had never heard of as an EMT who did see a few gunshots in his day. Learn new stuff all the time
Curious what bullet hits look like…
WARNING: DETAILED PICS OF ACTUAL GUNSHOT WOUNDS AND THEIR IDENTIFICATION BY WEAPON TYPE/RANGE
[http://www.forensicmed.co.uk/firearms.htm](http://www.forensicmed.co.uk/firearms.htm)
**Quadgop** I can see how hydrostatic pressure could cause serious damage elsewhere from extremity hits however could you elaborate on bullets _designed_ to create that specific effect on extremity hits…
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### Author:  [@bdgr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bdgr)
#### Post date: [October 4, 2002, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/9 "2002-10-04T21:40:10Z")
Ive been shot before, it didnt hurt all that bad at first. Felt kinda like getting wacked in the side with a 2x4 at first. Put me on crutches for a while, but wasnt as painful as you would expect. I have definately been in more pain. The mylagram I had for my back surgery, or the time the urologist ramed that damn video camera up Mr. Happy come to mind.
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### Author:  [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)
#### Post date: [October 4, 2002, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/10 "2002-10-04T22:09:23Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Max Torque \*
> \*\*Remember those factoids that “the human body is 97% water” and such? Well, I don’t know what the exact number is, but the body **is** mostly water. And, as you might remember from high school physics, water doesn’t compress.
>
> This means that when a bullet hits your body, which is basically an upright sack of mostly water, there are far-reaching effects as hydro-shock waves radiate outward from the source of impact. It is possible for a bullet that hits an arm or a leg to cause far-reaching effects, including organ failure. \*\*
Well [this](http://civic.bev.net/shawnee/digress.html) guy claims hydrostatic shock is a myth (read part II)…
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### Author:  [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)
#### Post date: [October 4, 2002, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/11 "2002-10-04T22:40:41Z")
The Master speaks
[http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1\_203b.html](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_203b.html)
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### Author:  [@John\_Harrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Harrison)
#### Post date: [October 4, 2002, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/12 "2002-10-04T23:34:21Z")
> [@](#):
>
> Large bullets, and small bullets that travel very fast, such as those from an M-16 rifle, can kill almost instantly, mainly by reducing the region of impact literally to hamburger.
This has been proven to be false. Just ask many vets that were involved in Somalia (Black Hawk Down) where bullet design reduced the effectiveness of the .223 bullet. The bullets were designed to penetrate body armor but would only stop if they hit skeletal structure. Basically many times a person was hit up to 4 or 5 times and could still get up to return fire.
QUOTE]Also, if the hydrostatic shock is great enough, a bullet wound to the hand will also kill. Certain weaponry and ammo is designed specifically to kill when impacting on extremities
[/QUOTE]
I haven’t seen any proof on the “hit in the arm and killed” theory, especially were the .223, or any other rifle round was concerned.
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### Author:  [@TBone2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBone2)
#### Post date: [October 5, 2002, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/13 "2002-10-05T14:20:37Z")
Even the Great One gets things wrong sometimes…
There is no one single factor that is the most important in the field of terminal ballistics (other than, maybe, hitting the target…). Shape, size, and weight (actually, mass) of the projectile and its terminal speed (NOT the widely-quoted “muzzle velocity”), as well as location of impact are all factors of importance.
There most certainly IS a thing called “hydrostatic shock,” though I wouldn’t agree with the overall effects often attributed to the phenomenon. And contrary to the offhand comments of several posters, water and other liquids are most definitely compressible, though not as easily compressed as, say, air. It is this very compressibility, NOT the lack of it, that enables the pressure waves that comprise hydrostatic shock to exist in the first place. It also explains ripples in a pond, tidal waves, sonar, and a host of other things. But I digress…
Also, a bullet is not “red-hot” when it strikes a target, nor at any other point in its travel. Were this the case, the relatively soft metals most bullets are made of would melt, and the bullet would disintegrate shortly after leaving the muzzle.
**Qadgop** was kind enough to supply a comprehensive list of possible results of a gunshot wound that would cause death, but most of these can be classified in the general categories of tissue damage, blood loss, shock, and infection.
Clubs, maces, etc. are designed to kill or disable through damage by external impact, often relying on the victim’s own bones to supply penetration of internal organs or tissues. Edged weapons, such as swords, spears, knives, arrows, etc. are designed to kill or disable through penetration, causing organ damage, massive bleeding, or both. Bullets are designed to kill or disable through the delivery of a fairly large quantity of energy to a target, enabling it to wreak havoc randomly, in a number of ways. (I refer again to **Qadgop** ’s list.)
Hunting bullets are carefully designed to maximize damage to a living target, _primarily by insuring that the kinetic energy of the bullet is transferred as completely as possible to the target_. Most military bullets are not so designed, partly because of the emphasis placed on penetration of armor, partly due to restrictions dictated by international conventions. Thus, while every M-16-toting grunt carries magazines full of full-metal-jacketed rounds, no hunter would be seen in the field packing FMJ’s. Enemy soldiers habitually hide in buildings, behind obstacles, in vehicles, etc. and the penetrating abilities of an FMJ bullet are often advantageous in battle. But you seldom see a whitetailed deer driving an armored personnel carrier; extreme penetrating power is not needed when hunting animals.
Gee, I’m windy sometimes!
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### Author:  [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)
#### Post date: [October 5, 2002, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/14 "2002-10-05T14:29:37Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by drachillix \*
> **WARNING: DETAILED PICS OF ACTUAL GUNSHOT WOUNDS AND THEIR IDENTIFICATION BY WEAPON TYPE/RANGE**
That is a site with absolutely horrifying pictures. I strongly urge those at work or those with any sort of weak stomach to NOT click on that link.
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### Author:  [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)
#### Post date: [October 5, 2002, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/15 "2002-10-05T14:44:00Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by TBone2 \*
> But you seldom see a whitetailed deer driving an armored personnel carrier; extreme penetrating power is not needed when hunting animals.
You should read more NRA literature.
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### Author:  [@John\_Harrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Harrison)
#### Post date: [October 5, 2002, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/16 "2002-10-05T17:32:58Z")
> [@](#):
>
> You should read more NRA literature.
Please enlighten us.
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### Author:  [@cdhostage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cdhostage)
#### Post date: [October 5, 2002, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/17 "2002-10-05T17:41:22Z")
Hmm. I wonder what a very small, very fast bullet would do. Anybody read the Diamond Age by Neal Stephenson? There’s an idea called the Skullgun, which fires a very small bullet at Mach something-or-other. If you shoot one, your head cracks back. Shoot two, harder. Shoot three, breaks your neck if it isn’t reinforced. Never mind the shock waves through your grey matter.
Anywhoo, let’s take a 1 gram projectile moving at Mach 5. Does anyone know what happens to it going through various media?
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### Author:  [@Slugworth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slugworth)
#### Post date: [October 5, 2002, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/18 "2002-10-05T18:26:44Z")
Well, there’s always the railgun test that the… Army? Navy? someone did, where a pretty small (relatively) shell folded a tank in half…
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### Author:  [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)
#### Post date: [October 6, 2002, 11:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/19 "2002-10-06T11:17:09Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by John Harrison \*
> \*\* Please enlighten us. \*\*
Sigh.
I’m being sarcastic, of course, playing with the image of an NRA spokesman campaigning for looser restrictions on armor-piercing rounds and military ordance. A much funnier example was on an episode of _Futurama_ when Professor Farnsworth was talking to a representative of the National Ray-gun Association (a futuristic descendant of the modern NRA):
Farnsworth:So, what are you doing to protect my constitutional right to bear Doomsday devices?
Rep: Well, first off, we’re gonna get rid of that 3-day waiting period for mad scientists.
F: Damn straight! Today, the mad scientist can’t get a Doomsday device; tomorrow, it’s the mad grad student. Where will it end?
R: Amen, brother. I don’t go anywhere without my mutated anthrax [holds up small green vial and whsipers], fer duck huntin’.
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### Author:  [@trader\_of\_shots](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/trader_of_shots)
#### Post date: [October 6, 2002, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-shot-wounds/130856/20 "2002-10-06T12:41:13Z")
Anthracite - wish you posted that before the link … hope i don;t get fired ( and can sleep tonight) … ofcourse i click on the click guns first like a fool
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