Thanks for all of your input, everybody. Gives me food for thought.
Watch this!
Is that gentleman from Louisiana? 
Talk about a novelty pistol. Those go for $5000 per and don’t do anything better than a regular 1911 except spend your money on ammunition.
Still, it’s very well-made and looks neat.
They make two very large holes in a fellow, but the second one isn’t needed.
IMHO a Rock Island is a pretty solid first 1911. They’re known to be pretty reliable and are able to be upgraded/modified to suit the user. The cheapest guns, especially 1911s, have issues with reliability (magazines, ammunition, etc.) that will make them much less fun to shoot even if it’s just plinking.
On the Glock vs. Hi-Point thing…I’ve fired and seen fired thousands of rounds from Glocks with maybe one or two failures that weren’t ammunition or technique (limp wrist) related. I’ve been around 3 HPs, a 9mm, a .40S&W and a .45 ACP and seen a lot of malfunctions (with ammo my own guns would fire all day) and spraying of rounds. It’s not just that the gun is inherently inaccurate (though the loose tolerances do suggest that) but the heavy, gritty trigger pull make it extremely difficult to be accurate with.
My point is that even if your goal is to just have a gun to plink with it’s not suggested to get the cheapest thing going. It’s also not necessary to buy the fanciest, most expensive gun either. Buy from a reputable manufacturer and you’ll probably be pleased.
I would think that if you plink with a .45 you would have enough money to not buy the least expensive pistol.
More like “If you can afford to plink with a 45, you can probably afford to not buy the least expensive pistol.”
That’s why I got a 9mm, even way back in 1998 when ammo was relatively cheap; even then .45 ACP was quite a bit more expensive than most other pistol ammo.
Locally the least expensive Remington .45 ACP ammunition is from Walmart.
I don’t understand the fascination with 1911s. I mean, I do get it, but I think they are overrated. It’s like a fad, a what’s happening trend, maybe the coolness factor, with some history and tradition tossed in, too. But it is old technology and old action, and most I know who have them also have needed (maybe wanted?) work done to them.
The first pistol I ever fired was the 1911 during military qualifications. I was in just before the Beretta 9 replaced the 1911. Sure the 1911 is pretty and traditional, but I like out-of-the-box reliability and accuracy. Dependability. Because of its features I chose the HK USP. Pure stock, with no work done to it, it has reliably shot tens of thousands of rounds through it with any flavor of ammo from the cheap stuff on up.
Maybe eventually I’ll add a 1911 to my collection, but my first .45acp was the HK. I liked it so much that when I bought a 9 it was also an HK USP.
Imagine yourself walking into a gun shop and knowing absolutely nothing about guns, just that you want one, bigger is better, and it’s not like you’re going to use it for anything other than occasional plinking and some vague idea of self-defense which consists of throwing it into a drawer and forgetting all about it. A sub-$200 gun looks pretty solid at that moment, because hell, a gun’s a gun, right?
That’s the market Hi-Point is aimed at, the people who don’t know anything about guns but are price-conscious.
I recommend for anyone wanting to buy, to find a range that rents a variety and test out a few. You may find out what you like and what you don’t.
What are WWII German pistols (like a Luger) like? Are they reasonably accurate?
The Lugar P-08 was well noted for accuracy. Unfortunately, it’s toggle action was complex and prone to failure, especially with the larger 9x19mm chambering, and the pistol cannot tolerate modern +P (high pressure) ammunition. It is single action with no exposed hammer, so it cannot be decocked. It is prized by collectors (even the low quality late model production and knockoffs) and commands a premium price
The Walther P-38 pistol, which replaced the P-08 and is often confused for it, is a significantly more robust pistol and (I believe) was the first to use the locking block design now used in the popular Beretta 92 pattern pistols, and also featured a double action trigger and decocking safety. It is reasonably accurate and quite reliable if kept clean and away from contamination, and can probably survive a limited diet of +P ammunition (but as with all pistols made before manufacturers started uploading the 9x19mm, it isn’t recommended). This pistol was carried by German police into the 'Eighties and was one of the most popular large caliber autoloading pistols (along with the 1911, Browning Hi-Power, and Walther PPK) in the West before the adoption of autoloading pistols for US law enforcement in the 'Eighties which lead to a plethora of new designs and high capacity “wondernine” pistols like the Beretta. Police and military surplus pistols used to be widely available, and because of the wear marks and low capacity (8+1) it could often be had for about the same price as a cruder straight blowback pistol like the Hi-Point or Raven.
The Walther PP/PPK is a piece of shit. Despite being popularized by Ian Fleming’s Bond in novels and later in movies featuring his creation, it is neither reliable, particularly accurate, or comfortable to shoot. Many of the similar pattern guns like Bersa Thunder or Sig 232 are much better pistols.
Stranger
It is sexy, though. Sexy to hold and look at. I’ve never shot one though.
Why don’t you just give us some *more *impossible standards!
You’ll see what I mean if you shoot one. It has the ergonomics of a wire coat hanger, trigger pull like walking a corgi in heat, sights that are only adequate to scratch an itch on your temple, and a tendency to cut your hand when fired only matched by a dyspeptic feline.
Fleming, like his avatar anti-hero, knew a little about women, but not much about guns. He actually had Bond originally armed with a skeletonized Beretta 418, an anemic and inaccurate 6.35mm pocket pistol suited only to shooting rats, if that. Although he was famously advised by fan Major Geoffrey Bothroyd (who became the inspiration for Major Bothroyd, the Armorer of Q Branch and otherwise known as “Q”) to use the 7.65x17mm (.32 ACP) chambering in the Walther PPK, which that character in the book and film describes as “having a delivery like a brick through a plate glass window” this was only at Fleming’s insistance that his agent had to carry an automatic pistol; Bothroyd actually recommended a S&W compact .38 Special (Centennial Airweight if I recall correctly) for concealed carry and a .357 Magnum for heavy work rather than the “long barrelled Colt Army Special .45” (generally assumed to be some variation of a Colt Single Action Army in .45 LC but actually just a long-barreled 1911 pattern pistol in .45 ACP). John Gardener (who published a series of original Bond novels well after Fleming’s death) changed the carry pistol to a H&K P7M8 in 9x19mm (a very reliable, accurate, and concealable pistol) and the heavy pistol to a Ruger Super Redhawk in .44 Magnum (instead of the more common S&W Model 29/629 or the excellent Dan Wesson 715 with swappable barrels).
Back on topic, there are a number of excellent service-grade firearms at various reasonable price ranges plus a buyer’s market of used pistols, all of which are vastly more reliable, accurate, and safe compared to the Hi-Point without getting into the four figure semi-custom racegun and collectable/status gun market. The Hi-Point, with its unreinforced plastic frame and the heavy, straight blowback pot metal slide, is in a completely different class of firearms, is in a different category altogether, one that we not-so-affectionally call a “widowmaker”. The medical bills from having a firearm blow up in your hand or a slide fracture and release heading straight back at your face will more than exceed the difference between this marginally functional overbuilt cap pistol and a decent and reliable duty sidearm like those offered by Springfield Armory, Glock, Ruger, H&K, Sig Sauer, et cetera.
Stranger
Bolding mine.
I use a couple P-08s for military pistol shoots and with a little practice and patience you can work around the failure to feeds the toggle can be accused of causing. What you can’t work around is the safety issue. It goes further than just the hammer; most of the mechanics to fire and operate are basically on the outside of the frame. You MUST carry it on an empty chamber or risk shooting yourself; end of discussion. Using something like a pen, there are at least three ways of making it fire just from pressure on the right point and two of them will work with the safety on. So forget any kind of armpit holster, inside the belt, or fancy wire rigs - stick to the military and even then keep it on an empty chamber until you need to fire.
PS – if you shop around, prices have been coming down again on them; especially on the .30 Luger models. At 75 bucks a box for 50 rounds folks just don’t care about the “shooters” as much as they did say 15 years back.
What’s the difference between an expensive 45 and a good quality cheaper 45?
It’s like the difference between a high-end escort and a street hooker. They’ll both give you a happy ending; it’s just that the escort will give you a happier ending than the hooker.
Ironically, I prefer ancient hookers with rotting teeth and oozing cankers, because they’re dirt cheap. The money I save purchasing economy happy endings allows me to afford an expensive 45 which I can use to blow out my brainstem in case people I care about find out I sleep with street hookers.