# Hail the US troops, change membername in YELLOW RIBBON. Or get banned. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 25, 2004, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600 "2004-12-25T18:24:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/321 "2004-12-28T19:13:00Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Well, if said resistance is fighting on behalf of al-Queda and/or Saddam Hussein’s regime, then I agree it is not OK. What if they’re not? And anyway, so what if they are? By extension, should a member get banned if they speak out on behalf of al-Qaeda? Should a member get banned if they express support for Saddam Hussein? After all, support for these organizations does imply support for their practices. Such support would be repugnant, of course–but not in a banworthy fashion. People with hideous political beliefs are allowed around here all the time, and that’s a good thing. But even if you want to ban people for their political beliefs in certain cases, your post above is, as **Aldebaran** has pointed out, a canard: many of the resistance are just fighting to remove what they see as an oppressive regime, aren’t fighting on behalf of Hussein or bin Laden. They just want Iraqis to be able to decide their own fates, and they genuinely believe the US isn’t going to allow them to do that. Are they wrong? I can’t say. Are they wrong to pick up guns? I believe they are. But then, I believe that any US soldier in Iraq has got the strongest possible moral duty to drop her weapons and refuse to fight any more, either. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Tan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/charlie_tan/32/12582_2.png) [@Charlie\_Tan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Tan)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/322 "2004-12-28T19:22:11Z")
I can’t help but wonder if our dear conservative minority would’ve had the same attitude to the war, had it been wagered by a Democrat president. I have a strong feeling that the attitude would’ve been that the US should keep to itself, and not get involved trying to bring democracy to a “backwards” part of the world… Why, maybe that _would_ be the case: [Link](http://www.antiwar.com/maringop.html) [Link](http://www.cnn.com/US/9903/22/u.s.kosovo/) [Link](http://www.pbs.org/newshour/shields&gigot/may99/sg_5-7.html) [Link](http://www.nytimes.com/library/world/europe/061099kosovo-spend.html) [Link](http://slate.msn.com/id/27730/) [QUOTE=By Stanley Meisler Los Angeles Times WASHINGTON (1995)] Accepting the argument by Secretary of State Warren Christopher that the issue is now “an acid test of American leadership” in the world, Senate Majority Leader Bob Dole (R-Kan.) and other congressional Republicans on Thursday reluctantly endorsed President Clinton’s planned deployment of 20,000 troops to enforce the peace agreement in Bosnia.[cite](http://www-tech.mit.edu/Issue/V115/N60/dole.60w.html) [/QUOTE] ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/323 "2004-12-28T19:34:24Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > …I might take the protests of those so deeply committed to human rights in the Middle East a tiny bit more seriously if they condemned the abuses of the former regime in Iraq in the same terms they condemn the invasion that overthrew it. But I don’t see that very much… Well, gee, **Shodan** , how about we set up a standard disclaimer, just for you! Everytime we broach any sort of criticism, we will start out with “Of course, I really, really don’t like the Hussein regime, and we are glad that he’s gone **but!** …” Or better still, why don’t _you_ just assume that we are all quite sane, thank you very much, and really don’t feel the need to belabor the stunningly obvious. > [@](#): > > …The problem with **Aldebaran** ’s posts is the same as it has generally been. If any proportion of those in the Middle East are as big a bunch of screaming hysterics as he is, no wonder you folks kill each other so much. And also no wonder that true democracies in the region are few and far between… And you wonder why they don’t love us. You do, you really do, you just can’t figure out why those ignorant, benighted slobs aren’t simply gushing with gratitude to have us come in and sort things out for them. In case its escaped your attention, true democracies are few and far between in the whole friggin’ world. Except, perhaps, for our true blue buddy Pakistan, which stands in the very front ranks of military dictatorships when it comes to committment to democracy and freedom. And Uzbekistan, now there is a veritable showcase… > [@](#): > > …Here’s hoping for another meltdown-followed-by-banning in the New Year. There’s probably no rule about hoping somebody gets banned. So I suppose I could as well. I won’t, of course, not being an asshole. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/324 "2004-12-28T19:38:11Z")
> [@The Gaspode](#): > > I can’t help but wonder if our dear conservative minority would’ve had the same attitude to the war, had it been wagered by a Democrat president. I have a strong feeling that the attitude would’ve been that the US should keep to itself, and not get involved trying to bring democracy to a “backwards” part of the world… > > Why, maybe that _would_ be the case: > > [Link](http://www.antiwar.com/maringop.html) > [Link](http://www.cnn.com/US/9903/22/u.s.kosovo/) > [Link](http://www.pbs.org/newshour/shields&gigot/may99/sg_5-7.html) > [Link](http://www.nytimes.com/library/world/europe/061099kosovo-spend.html) > [Link](http://slate.msn.com/id/27730/) Yep and Bush ran on ‘no nation building’ but I can’t imagine any reason, any event since then that could have possibly changed their mine. Nope coming up blank. Must be hypocrits. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/325 "2004-12-28T19:46:33Z")
> [@The Gaspode](#): > > I can’t help but wonder if our dear conservative minority would’ve had the same attitude to the war, had it been wagered by a Democrat president. I have a strong feeling that the attitude would’ve been that the US should keep to itself, and not get involved trying to bring democracy to a “backwards” part of the world… …and you would be quite wrong! This conservative, and most of the others I know, have been quite scornful of the wimpy way Democrat presidents try to deal with situations calling for the use of the military. Johnson fought a pulled-punches war in Vietnam, one we could easily have won had it not been for his fear of pissing off China. It’s like getting into a fight with someone and not wanting to hit them too hard for fear they’ll really get mad. Carter was perhaps the biggest wimp of them all, and was so concerned that we not use more force than the absolute minimal amount that might get the job done, that he sent an undermanned and under-equipped helicopter mission to try to rescue our hostages and would up with a disaster on his hands. And then we have Clinton throwing a few ineffectual missles at Bin Laden and bypassing opportunities to grab or kill him when he had the chance because his advisors deemed such action politically inexpedient. I would have had a hell of a lot more respect for all these guys had they done what Bush is doing, and fighting a fight in order to win it instead of just for appearances’ sake or to try to get by without pissing anybody off. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/326 "2004-12-28T19:54:26Z")
> [@treis](#): > > Yep and Bush ran on ‘no nation building’ but I can’t imagine any reason, any event since then that could have possibly changed their mine. Nope coming up blank. Must be hypocrits. Yeah. Because, you know, all those Iraqis who took part in 9/11, right? ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/327 "2004-12-28T19:56:31Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Yeah. Because, you know, all those Iraqis who took part in 9/11, right? Yeah becuase thats exactly what I said. A major attack on the U.S. just _might_ change some isolationists minds doncha think? ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/328 "2004-12-28T20:02:16Z")
> [@treis](#): > > Yeah becuase thats exactly what I said. > > A major attack on the U.S. just _might_ change some isolationists minds doncha think? Maybe I’d buy that as a cause if we’d actually gone after another country that had ties to the 9/11 hijackers. Like, say, Saudi Arabia. But instead we swept through Afghanistan (justified) and swept out again right into a country that had nothing to do with anything that happened that day. And now we’re in the middle of Hell because of it, with no exit strategy. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/329 "2004-12-28T20:04:31Z")
**Starv** : Well, we are definitely not doing that, by gum! We have certainly made it clear that we ain’t worried about pissing people off, nosiree! We are the tough guys. We get attacked by Morocco, and we feel like invading Belgium to retaliate, we’re just gonna go right ahead and do it! We don’t care, we don’t _have_ to care, we’re the Americans! And by the way, thanks for the Golden Oldie, the ol’ “we would have won in Viet Nam, but those wimpy liberals wouldn’t let us!” canard. Haven’t seen that particular line of bull pucky, kinda miss it. But just as you say, GeeDubya is a firm and forceful leader. So was Custer. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/330 "2004-12-28T20:06:42Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Maybe I’d buy that as a cause if we’d actually gone after another country that had ties to the 9/11 hijackers. Like, say, Saudi Arabia. But instead we swept through Afghanistan (justified) and swept out again right into a country that had nothing to do with anything that happened that day. And now we’re in the middle of Hell because of it, with no exit strategy. Then call them hypocrites for that line of reasoning. But to say look how some Republicans didn’t want to go to war and now they do while ignoring a logical reason why they would change their mind is stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Tan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/charlie_tan/32/12582_2.png) [@Charlie\_Tan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Tan)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/331 "2004-12-28T20:24:40Z")
> [@Starving Artist](#): > > …and you would be quite wrong! You didn’t check the links, did you? > [@](#): > > And then we have Clinton throwing a few ineffectual missles at Bin Laden and bypassing opportunities to grab or kill him when he had the chance because his advisors deemed such action politically inexpedient. Um, and … hm… Yeah, that’s right, **bombing Iraq** ([cite](http://slate.msn.com/id/11384/)), but that was of course just wagging the dog, so that doesn’t count… and deploying troops to former Yugoslavia… to… ahem… secure peace, democracy and ousting a dictator guilty of genocide…hmmm that sounds really familiar… since they’ve been the arguments of the conservatives when the box with WMDs was found to be empty… only back then, the GOP opposed it… The war in Iraq has shit all to do with 9/11, other than as a pretext. It gave the Bush admin. an excuse to drop the isolationist tendencies, but it wasn’t the reason. Had Gore been in office, the same conservatives who now denounce **Alde** for his rage, would have been stark raving mad at Gore for being in Iraq instead of Afghanstin or Saudi-Arabia. In my book, morality is an absolute and doesn’t change depending on who is setting the policy. Either something is right and just or it isn’t, and it doesn’t matter who is saying it. Anything else is _realpolitik_. I would’ve had a lot more respect for Bush, had he said: “Once we’re finished cleaning up Afghanistan and settling things with the Saudis, we’re gonna go over to Saddam and take care of him. He’s not playing by the rules set down by treaties, he’s murdering his own people and we _do_have an interest in seeing that the resources of the country can be helped to ballance the power the Saudis sway over the region. To help us, we have a group of Iraqi exiles, as advisors. Besides, we have a moral obligation since my dad left Saddam in power.” ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/332 "2004-12-28T20:35:54Z")
**Gaspode** : Nope, I didn’t read the links. Busted. (In my defense though, my time here is often limited and fragmented because of the needs of others in the household to use the computer.) **jayjay, luci, Gaspode** : Your entire premise throughout the recent discussion is false. We didn’t, and no one ever said we did, invade Iraq because they flew planes into the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. **Gaspode** : You posed the belief that conservatives would have objected to any military action taken by Democrats. I refuted it, at least as far as I’m concerned. You ignore this opinion and turn right around and assert still that we would have. Why pose the question if you’re going to supply your own answer? ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Tan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/charlie_tan/32/12582_2.png) [@Charlie\_Tan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Tan)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/333 "2004-12-28T20:47:44Z")
Fair enough, **SA**. I apologize. I do not think there is a conservative hive mind here, but the comment from **treis** > [@](#): > > Yep and Bush ran on ‘no nation building’ but I can’t imagine any reason, any event since then that could have possibly changed their mine. Nope coming up blank. Must be hypocrits. and > [@treis](#): > > > [@jayjay](#): > > > > Yeah. Because, you know, all those Iraqis who took part in 9/11, right? > > Yeah becuase thats exactly what I said. > > A major attack on the U.S. just _might_ change some isolationists minds doncha think? got mixed in with my reply to you. So he **did** bring 9/11 into the mix. I’m not sure about his political leanings, though. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/334 "2004-12-28T21:00:01Z")
> [@Starving Artist](#): > > **Gaspode** , **jayjay, luci, Gaspode** : Your entire premise throughout the recent discussion is false. We didn’t, and **no one ever said we did** , invade Iraq because they flew planes into the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. What’s this from [Richard Myers](http://www.defenselink.mil/transcripts/2004/tr20041222-secdef1861.html) then? > [@](#): > > This attack, of course, is the responsibility of insurgents, the same insurgents who attacked on 9/11, the same type of insurgents who attacked in Beirut, the same insurgents who – type of insurgents who attacked the Cole, Khobar Towers, and the list goes on. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/335 "2004-12-28T21:41:17Z")
> [@Mojo](#): > > > [@Gaudere](#): > > > > Mehitabel, the hassling of Alerbaran is getting pretty tiresome to everybody but you, it seems. > > Not to me either, but that’s cus I’m in the same boat as her. I’m tired of his shit. His OP is the perfect example of his willful misunderstanding. This isn’t language barrier shit, this is his way of avoiding true debate or taking responsibility for what he’s said. If you can find a way to honestly interpret what Gaudere said as “Shut up, support the US invaders, let your life be endangered, let your friends be killed; without any comment on this, or be banned from the SDMB?” please let me know. Keep in mind this is after he misintepreted the OP as well. Damn right. Willful misunderstanding, outragous hyperbole, arguing with everyone (including those who _agree_ with him) even if it means _inventing_ arguments, stereotyping citizens of the United States - all typical **Aldebaran** SOP. And people still wonder why he’s so disliked? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/336 "2004-12-28T22:06:35Z")
> [@Left Hand of Dorkness](#): > > And anyway, so what if they are? By extension, should a member get banned if they speak out on behalf of al-Qaeda? Should a member get banned if they express support for Saddam Hussein? After all, support for these organizations does imply support for their practices. Sure, ban them. > [@Left Hand of Dorkness](#): > > But even if you want to ban people for their political beliefs in certain cases, your post above is, as **Aldebaran** has pointed out, a canard: many of the resistance are just fighting to remove what they see as an oppressive regime, aren’t fighting on behalf of Hussein or bin Laden. They just want Iraqis to be able to decide their own fates, and they genuinely believe the US isn’t going to allow them to do that. In a word, horseshit. If they were genuinely interested in “Iraqis deciding their own fate”, pretty much by definition they would support the removal of Saddam, who prevented them from anything of the kind. And they would not be acting to kill and terrorize their fellow Iraqis to prevent them from staging and participating in elections in Iraq. > [@Squink](#): > > What’s this from Richard Myers then? A slip of the tongue, I imagine - notice the correction from “the same insurgents” to “the same type of insurgents”. Terrorists, in other words, are terrorists. Given that someone claiming to be bin Laden spoke recently appointing Zarqawi as his chief lieutenant in Iraq, I think these kinds of connections are fairly clear and well-established by this time. Terrorists hate us. Some of the terrorists crash planes into the WTC, some invade Kuwait, some stage bombings in Madrid to try to force the Spanish out of Iraq, and some work to disrupt free elections in Iraq. What they have in common is that they are all terrorists, and all enemies of freedom. And therefore all enemies of the US in particular and the West in general. Anywhere that secular government and respect for human rights and the rule of law predominate. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Aldebaran](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Aldebaran](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aldebaran)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/337 "2004-12-28T22:07:48Z")
> [@treis](#): > > Aldebaran could have said he wanted to go join the resistance, go fight the occupation or something to that effect. What you cannot do in any circumstances is directly say that you want to go and shoot a board member. What ridiculous hypocritical crap. I said nothing else then " reading posts like xxxx made me **feel** like xxx". So what? When US soldiers come here and state they are a) In Iraq b) going to Iraq What are they going to do there? Throw tomatoes at the Iraqis who don’t like it all that much to have them acting like they own the country?. They are going there/are there to kill if ordered to kill, or even to kill simply because they feel “threatened”. They are shooting at Iraqis, they are tortruring Iraqis, they are rounding up Iraqis, they break into their homes, they kill wounded men, the murder a wounded young boy and call it **“mercy killing”** as if they talk about an **animal** , they\*\* act as if they OWN the damn country.\*\* Now a question for you, fool: How can **you** know that I am never there, hence exposed to all the violence of these very soldiers stating on this very message board that they are in Iraq or are leaving for Iraq? How can you know that nobody of my family is ever there? **All** the above is voicing and posting a **direct** threat to **me**. ME as in \*\*member of this message board. \*\* An other question for you: I have **friends** who were **born there**. It is **their** country. I know a little girl that **was killed** there. Can you tell me she was not killed by any of the soldiers who post here? I see members advocating invasions of other nations in my region, “nuking” my region, killing all Muslims. You know what, fool? That is also posting a **direct** threat to **me**. ME, as member of this message board. If I see soldiers posting here, people here cheering them, calling them “heros” and supporting them attacking Iraqis, calling the civilians killed “collateral DAMAGE” or even EGGS, defending "mercy killing of an Iraqy boy as if thery talk about an animal. In all that I am reading what they say about that little girl I knew. I am also reading what they would say about **me** when I would be killed by your damn Heros. You know what? **Fuck you and all the other damn hypocrite pigs posting here.** ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Tan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/charlie_tan/32/12582_2.png) [@Charlie\_Tan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Tan)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/338 "2004-12-28T22:16:10Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Terrorists hate us. Nah. ---
**Author:** ![Aldebaran](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Aldebaran](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aldebaran)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/339 "2004-12-28T22:41:26Z")
They don’t need to go far to be instigated. Reading, collecting and distributing the sickening arrogant, self rightheous racist hypocritical posts on US message boards is as far as they need to go to have an abundance of useful propaganda material. Salaam. A ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600/340 "2004-12-28T22:43:52Z")
**Aldebaran** , a sincere question for you: Ever since my daughter was born 24 years ago, little girls have been my favorite people in the world. I adore them and I can certainly see why you would be infuriated to learn that a little girl you had been close to had been killed. I would be, too. However, on a broader scale, are you not pleased to think that for every Iraqi death occurring today it is likely that ten, fifteen or twenty would have occurred under Hussein? Are you not pleased that, overall, many, many, fewer Iraqis are dying daily than under Hussein? And are you not pleased that once Iraqis are able to assume control of their own destiny and run their country themselves, it is virtually certain Iraqis won’t be dying as a result of their government at anywhere near the rate they would have under Hussein, or even worse, one of his sons? I am not having a problem at all with your being incensed that innocent Iraqis are dying during the war in Iraq. But I’m very puzzled as to why you don’t seem to be pleased that overall many fewer innocent Iraqis are dying now, and even fewer will die in the future, than would have been the case had the U.S. action not occurred. In other words, is it better for a great many more innocent Iraqis to die at the hands of other Iraqis than it is for a great many fewer to die at the hands of Westerners? I know you probably don’t normally think of the situation in these terms, but when you do what would your answer be? Respectfully, **SA** [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600.md?page=16) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hail-the-us-troops-change-membername-in-yellow-ribbon-or-get-banned/281600.md?page=18)