# Handicapping the 2012 GOP presidential nomination **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [February 12, 2011, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160 "2011-02-12T21:14:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 38
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2011, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/741 "2011-10-13T17:00:07Z")
> [@The\_wind\_of\_my\_soul](#): > > As someone who attended this summit and voted for Ron Paul, I have a few things to say about this. > > If you want to talk about fixing a vote, the whole premise of the Values Voters Conference is set up to be fixed. The “Values” in the name stands for Evangelical Christian values. The speeches delivered were not about stabilizing the economy and balancing the budget, they were about preserving the sanctity of marriage and dismantling Planned Parenthood. > > Out of all the presidential candidates who are routinely invited to primary debates, every single one was invited to speak at this event, with the exception of Jon Huntsman. Rick Santorum typically polls only a single percentage above Huntsman, but at this summit he polled 16 percentage points above Huntsman. > > At the voting station, we were given the choice to choose from many, many politicians for vice president, including some whose name I did not recognize. Presidential candidate Gary Johnson, who is pro-choice and in favor of legalizing marijuana, was not even listed as an option, despite participating in two primary debates and sometimes polling in the same range as Santorum and Huntsman. > > This summit was clearly intended for a Christian audience, and they did not receive the outcome that they wanted. To say that this is fixed because their ploy to attract only religious conservatives did not work strikes me as petty and insulting. As noted on [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=627268), the GOP likes to trot out “small government” propaganda while carrying water for the “values voters” big-government faction. It’s hardly surprising that actual small-government believers would resent being treated as suckers, and would respond by making a mockery of their little game. ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/742 "2011-10-21T00:06:00Z")
As I watched the Republican ‘debate’, all I could do was wonder - ‘is this the best America has to offer for the office of President’. If this clown show represents the cream of the crop then the country is in real trouble. The Republicans should clean off the slate and offer us some real candidates. Crane ---
**Author:** ![Da\_Mikster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bb73d2/32.png) [@Da\_Mikster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Da_Mikster)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/743 "2011-10-21T00:28:10Z")
> [@Crane](#): > > As I watched the Republican ‘debate’, all I could do was wonder - ‘is this the best America has to offer for the office of President’. No, but just the way the primaries are rigged in favor of the hardcore partisan and lunatic fringe + unlimited monies for attack ads, means not many folks who could/would do a good job are actually dumb enough (or have big enough egos) to WANT it. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/744 "2011-10-21T14:30:24Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > Well, you’re right: there is, of course, money in politics. But the work-to-cashflow ratio is much more favorable for what she’s doing now. Riding around in a bus and saying stupid shit to gullible people is much easier than, say, addressing the trade imbalance. My point is that if she doesn’t do the work of running for office, people will lose interest in her, and her cash flow will dry up. The work-to-cashflow ratio may work for her now, but by this time next year, she may have next to no cashflow to speak of. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/745 "2011-10-21T15:04:53Z")
> [@Crane](#): > > As I watched the Republican ‘debate’, all I could do was wonder - ‘is this the best America has to offer for the office of President’. If this clown show represents the cream of the crop then the country is in real trouble. The Republicans should clean off the slate and offer us some real candidates. > > Crane [shrug] Show me a country with a better class of politicians. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/746 "2011-10-21T15:07:45Z")
I’m pretty certain there’s no other developed country where evolution deniers can be plausible candidates for the highest elected offices. Most countries have much bigger problems with institutional corruption and such than us, but it’s hard to beat America’s politicians for pure stupid. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/747 "2011-10-21T16:07:03Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Most countries have much bigger problems with institutional corruption and such than us, but it’s hard to beat America’s politicians for pure stupid. We’re number one! We’re number one! ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/748 "2011-10-21T16:15:20Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > developed country where evolution deniers can be plausible candidates for the highest elected offices. It’s actually much worse than you are saying: this merely impliles that Americans are unusually tolerant, genial, generous people. In fact, what we are is small-minded imbeciles, or at least that’s the wagon that Republicans have hitched themselves to: to be a Republican nomnee for President in this time means you MUST affirmatively assert that you deny evolution. That is SOME serious lack of integrity, especially since (I hope) every Republican candidate is smart enough to grasp the basics of evolution, and secretly accept it in his heart. Well, maybe not Palin. Nor Bachmann. uh, not Herman, neither. Okay, I hope SOME Pubbies are that smart. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/749 "2011-10-21T16:24:38Z")
That’s a bit much. Last time around, out of the 10 candidates only Sam Brownback, Tom Tancredo and Mike Huckabee were willing to admit their stupidity. McCain won the nomination and did not. I’m not sure which of the current candidates would do so, other than Bachmann and Perry (has the question been asked in any of this year’s debates?) ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/750 "2011-10-21T17:31:19Z")
It’s pretty funny to me that the first time the Republicans find themselves capable of saying “Yes,” they say it in Hebrew, and to a _schvartzer_\*. I wouldn’t be astonished to find that becoming a staple of his moronic campaign rhetoric, too. “They call us the party of No, but my name means Yes, in Hebrew, and I say ‘Yes!’ to America, yes to jobs, yes to simplicity in tax codes, yes to abortion–uh, maybe that last one, not so much, let me get back to you on that…” - polite word for “black person” in Yiddish, nothing derogatory. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/751 "2011-10-21T20:47:23Z")
Whose name is that? ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2011, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/752 "2011-10-22T15:48:51Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Last time around, out of the 10 candidates only Sam Brownback, Tom Tancredo and Mike Huckabee were willing to admit their stupidity. Let’s be fair. Brownback [wrote a clarification letter for the N.Y. Times](http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/31/opinion/31brownback.html), giving a slightly different opinion to its readers than he gave to his less intellectual audience: > [@](#): > > If belief in evolution means simply assenting to microevolution, small changes over time within a species, I am happy to say, as I have in the past, that I believe it to be true. (Personally, this grudging reference to “microevolution … within a species” left me amazed he bothered to submit this “retraction” at all. :smack: ) ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2011, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/753 "2011-10-22T16:00:08Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Whose name is that? Beats me. Cain means spear in Hebrew, and Herman is derived from Germanic languages. OK, what he’s saying is that yes in Hebrew is “ken” which is pronounced similarly to Cain. High marks as a pun. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2011, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/754 "2011-10-25T01:27:01Z")
I thought Cain was the _founder_ of Godfather’s pizza. Now people are telling me that no, he simply took over the chain and then slashed the workforce to improve the bottom line. If that’s the case (if you don’t mind confirming that for me, 'dope), not only do I have to retract some of the nice things I said about him but I have to add that in terms of professional behavior, this makes him pretty much exactly the same as Mitt Romney. I still think Cain is the most charismatic guy in the field. But- meh. Not as genuine as I thought. As for Romney, tell me if this position is a case of religious discrimination or simple common sense: The fact that this dude believes such wildly false claims about American history renders him disqualified for President. It is the same way a person whose religion claimed 2+2=5 would be disqualified from nuclear engineering- sorry, you need to be on board with certain facts to get the job. The really interesting thing about this field is that one of them has to win. What a silly caucus this year! ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2011, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/755 "2011-10-25T05:00:06Z")
Even if Romney does believe everything in the Book of Mormon literally, that’s a portion of American history of very low relevance to anything that’s significant to politics. That the Latter-Day Saints were persecuted in the east and went west to establish their own community in Utah is of some small historical significance. Whether or not they actually made this move according to inspiration from the Angel Moroni is pretty much moot. And whether Jesus came to pre-Columbian America is no more relevant than whether he came to pre-Columbian Israel. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2011, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/756 "2011-10-25T05:46:54Z")
Is it possible to contrive a circumstance in which a Mormon President, in an effort not to ‘blow their cover’ as buying into counter-Mormon evidence, as a consequence screws up terribly? ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2011, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/757 "2011-10-25T12:17:46Z")
Mormon Doctrine states that God established the Constitution of the United States in order to found the LDS religion. That’s a novel frame of reference for a US President. Crane ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2011, 11:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/758 "2011-10-31T11:20:36Z")
> [@Crane](#): > > Mormon Doctrine states that God established the Constitution of the United States in order to found the LDS religion. > > That’s a novel frame of reference for a US President. But does Romney even believe that? Replace “to found the LDS religion” with “wage war with Gog and Magog in preparation for the Final Days” and you have a zany doctrine that [a recent President actually believed.](http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/andrewbrown/2009/aug/10/religion-george-bush) Many of these guys, if campaigning to direct a book club, would be laughed off the stage. Instead they’re serious contenders for the U.S. Presidency. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2011, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/759 "2011-11-12T22:57:05Z")
Cain, Gingrich and Romney are sharing the margin of error for leadership in the polls. Perry has predictably self-destructed. Bachman has flat lined and the others are road kill. Tonight’s debate topic is National Security and Foriegn Policy. Cain is clueless on both. Romney is marginally better. Experience may pay off for Gingrich tonight. This could be an optimum opportunity for Gingrich to take the lead. Crane ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2011, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160/760 "2011-11-12T23:37:21Z")
> [@Crane](#): > > Mormon Doctrine states that God established the Constitution of the United States in order to found the LDS religion. Whoever said that obviously has been doing too much LDS. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160.md?page=37) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/handicapping-the-2012-gop-presidential-nomination/571160.md?page=39)