# "Happy Birthday"! Judge rules that it is out of copyright!
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [September 23, 2015, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353 "2015-09-23T23:48:01Z")
**Posts on this page:** 19
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)
#### Post date: [September 23, 2015, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/1 "2015-09-23T23:48:01Z")
I actually just discovered this on YouTube, while looking for a suitable video to send to a friend whose birthday is today: U.S. District Judge George H. King has ruled that the song is out of copyright.
> **[“Happy Birthday” Copyright Ruled to Be Invalid](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/business/business-news/happy-birthday-copyright-ruled-be-826528/)**
>
> A judge grants summary judgment to a filmmaker challenging Warner/Chappell’s copyright to a song more than a century old.
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### Author:  [@D18](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D18)
#### Post date: [September 23, 2015, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/2 "2015-09-23T23:54:48Z")
Wow! Hollywood Squares will never be the same!
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### Author:  [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)
#### Post date: [September 24, 2015, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/3 "2015-09-24T00:46:22Z")
At long last I can publish my cover version without legal liability.
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### Author:  [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)
#### Post date: [September 24, 2015, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/4 "2015-09-24T00:54:32Z")
You’re infringing on the copyright of an earlier thread - [Happy Birthday song is now public domain! - Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share - Straight Dope Message Board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=769649)
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### Author:  [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)
#### Post date: [September 24, 2015, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/5 "2015-09-24T01:20:29Z")
> [@Telemark](#):
>
> You’re infringing on the copyright of an earlier thread - [Happy Birthday song is now public domain! - Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share - Straight Dope Message Board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=769649)
Well then, I’m going to countersue, because that thread should have been posted in Cafe Society, where I searched thoroughly to make sure somebody else hadn’t already posted about this. 😃
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### Author:  [@Johnny\_Angel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Angel)
#### Post date: [September 24, 2015, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/6 "2015-09-24T01:53:29Z")
It wasn’t affecting me much, of course, because I don’t produce any media. But it always stuck in my craw that this bit of traditional folk music was being held in copyright. Next up: Free the Great Gatsby!
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### Author:  [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2015, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/7 "2015-09-25T00:31:54Z")
Does this mean restaurants can now replace the annoying song the staff sings to birthday guests with the staff annoyingly singing the real thing? Coolcoolcool.
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### Author:  [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2015, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/8 "2015-09-25T01:34:12Z")
I still prefer [this Birthday song](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLIOc4MIetk).
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### Author:  [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2015, 7:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/9 "2015-09-25T07:42:34Z")
My favorite birthday song is still this French dude, Julien Neel, doing a one-man barbershop quartet version of the Dapper Dans birthday song:
Oh yeah, and today was my dad's 71st fucking birthday, and I couldn't find his damn phone number ...
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### Author:  [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2015, 8:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/10 "2015-09-25T08:44:27Z")
> [@MovieMogul](#):
>
> I still prefer [this Birthday song](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLIOc4MIetk).
I like [this one](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATyHIT5LV8g).
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### Author:  [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2015, 9:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/11 "2015-09-25T09:00:47Z")
It’s not just “out of” copyright, i.e. the copyright didn’t expire (wouldn’t have until about 2030), it was ruled that the copyright claim was _never_ valid in the first place. So the gazillions of dollars they have likely collected in royalties over the years (since 1935) turned out to be just a big scam, basically.
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### Author:  [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2015, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/12 "2015-09-25T11:28:06Z")
To be precise, the court ruled that Warner/Chappell had never acquired the rights to the lyrics. There is a possibility (unlikely, perhaps) that someone else might have a legitimate claim.
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### Author:  [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2015, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/13 "2015-09-25T16:59:08Z")
I just checked. Master Shake’s _Spirit Journey Formation Anniversary_ is still under copyright.
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### Author:  [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2015, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/14 "2015-09-25T17:27:47Z")
Can people sue them to get the money back from the past licensing now that it was ruled they never had it?
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### Author:  [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2015, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/15 "2015-09-25T18:10:58Z")
> [@YogSosoth](#):
>
> Can people sue them to get the money back from the past licensing now that it was ruled they never had it?
The original declaratory judgment complaint seeks both class certification and restitution.
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### Author:  [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2015, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/16 "2015-09-25T18:34:06Z")
No no no, [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZaZib6axjuA) is the best birthday song. (There is a naughty word in it, so turn your volume all the way up if you’re at work.)
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### Author:  [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2015, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/17 "2015-09-25T21:01:00Z")
> [@Acsenray](#):
>
> To be precise, the court ruled that Warner/Chappell had never acquired the rights to the lyrics. There is a possibility (unlikely, perhaps) that someone else might have a legitimate claim.
The legal principle of [laches](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laches_(equity)) applies here. Anyone with a better claim than the one Universal had should have filed a lawsuit years ago. (And anyone with a worse claim is out of luck.)
This principle has been used in music copyright cases. One I recall (but can’t find again) involved the children of a musician seeking royalties on an old song that had been “borrowed” 30-40 years ago. The judge ruled they had taken too long to file even though the parent had recently passed. The dad should have filed earlier.
There are usually statues of limitations on damages in such cases. E.g., one can only recover damages going back 3 years before filing.
Stephen Colbert joked about this on his show the other night. He mockingly sang the substitute song the restaurant he once worked at required them to sing instead. But that is presumably under copyright and the show has to pay royalties for him singing that!
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### Author:  [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)
#### Post date: [September 25, 2015, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/18 "2015-09-25T21:18:32Z")
Laches is a tricky concept in copyright law. In a situation in which Warner/Chappell (and Summy and Summy-Birchard) has been asserting and enforcing its copyright claim since the 1930s. So all this time unauthorized users would not have been surprised to be faced with a copyright claim. That knocks out some of the equitable basis of the doctrine of laches. So I can’t say I know for sure how it would play out.
Of course the three-year statute of limitations would still apply.
It’s a weird situation.
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### Author:  [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)
#### Post date: [September 26, 2015, 6:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/happy-birthday-judge-rules-that-it-is-out-of-copyright/732353/19 "2015-09-26T06:46:56Z")
> [@ftg](#):
>
> The legal principle of [laches](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laches_(equity)) applies here. Anyone with a better claim than the one Universal had should have filed a lawsuit years ago. (And anyone with a worse claim is out of luck.)
>
> This principle has been used in music copyright cases. One I recall (but can’t find again) involved the children of a musician seeking royalties on an old song that had been “borrowed” 30-40 years ago. The judge ruled they had taken too long to file even though the parent had recently passed. The dad should have filed earlier.
IIRC, Country Joe MacDonald was saved by this principle, and may be the case of which you speak/write. His “Feel Like I’m Fixin to Die Rag” allegedly contained somebody’s parent’s walk up, from some jazz tune from 1930, or so, that coincided with the ‘One-Two-Three’ of the chorus. The plaintiff filed too late, and had to pay something like 250K in court costs.