# Harley Davidson's Motorcycles are Too Damn Loud! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 3, 2002, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-davidsons-motorcycles-are-too-damn-loud/135139 "2002-11-03T22:27:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Doc\_Nickel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5fc32e/32.png) [@Doc\_Nickel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doc_Nickel)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2002, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-davidsons-motorcycles-are-too-damn-loud/135139/41 "2002-11-06T03:29:33Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Macro Man \* > \*\* > > This is bullshit. The OEM exhaust engineers spent their time designing a muffler that provides a good compromise between acceptable, legal noise levels, cost-effectiveness, and power tuning. The difference is that the first two imperatives are probably foremost to the OEM designer. An aftermarket exhaust does away with the first two imperatives, and allows the aftermarket exhaust manufacturer’s engineers to concentrate on the third. HDs are still relatively simple machines, compared to imports, and can still benefit from basic hotrodding techniques. \*\* -That may be true to a certain extent for full automotive type exhaust systems (not just “mufflers”, an individual component) or even exhaust _systems_ for motorcycles (though it’s been my experience with 2-stoke bikes and snowmachines that the stock pipes are _very_ good, and aftermarket units merely move the HP/torque peak up or down the RPM band) but for the “straight pipes” on a Harley? Please. A straight pipe- the point of the OP, by the way, as any sort of baffling at all tends to reduce the noise considerably- loses most of the antireversion effects and almost negates any cylinder scavenging effects, leading to conditions like spent-gas contamination of the incoming charge. Top-Fuel racers are about the last to use “straight pipes”, but these are supercharged engines running nitromethane- practically an explosive. Pro-Stock classes and the majority of the bracketracer classes show racers using full exhausts including mufflers specifically designed for the RPM ranges. Mainly because they’ve found that they can gain X fraction of a second and X extra couple of horsepower with proper exhaust tuning. So yes, in a way you’re right- a well designed _exhaust system_ can indeed add a small percentage of horsepower over the stock system. (Though often at the expense of power elsewhere in the band.) But straight pipes aren’t an “system”- They’re rarely tuned to any degree at all. They’re typically jsut formed, cut, polished and chromed so they look good, who cares how much power the provide. And that’s the point of the original post. ---
**Author:** ![unclviny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e274bd/32.png) [@unclviny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/unclviny)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2002, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-davidsons-motorcycles-are-too-damn-loud/135139/42 "2002-11-10T22:58:34Z")
long time motorcycle rider here and a long time member of the motorcycle industry (on a retail level, british bikes mostly). the “loud pipes save lives” argument has been shown to be bs about 1,000 times, try asking the ama ([www.amadirectlink.org](http://www.amadirectlink.org)). motorcycle exhaust systems are designed by engineers to provide a reasonable spread of power AND to control noise so that the thing meets EPA approval and can be sold in the country. in all fairness, changing exhaust (and rejetting the carbs) is a relatively cheap way to extract more power (you get a lot of bang for your buck), BUT there is a limit, engines are designed to run with a measured amount of back pressure in the exhaust and if you do away with said pressure the performance, mileage and longevity of your engine suffer. in my personal dictionary motorcycles are fast, handle well and stop quickly, harley’s do not do ANY of the above, they are “butt jewelry”, most riders are in the “look how cool i am” club (if you don’t believe me look at their back tires (if they are “worn square” the bike never goes around corners, we call these “chicken strips”) and/or look at the odometer (a 5 year old bike with 3,800 miles, you do the math). if these moron’s don’t change themselves, the government is gonna come down on ALL motorcycles, so these idiots are risking MY rights. loud pipes risk rights unclviny ---
**Author:** ![unclviny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e274bd/32.png) [@unclviny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/unclviny)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2002, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-davidsons-motorcycles-are-too-damn-loud/135139/43 "2002-11-10T23:14:47Z")
from the link above, see “protecting your right to ride” Consumer Modifications The EPA recognizes the tendency of owners to modify their motorcycles to enhance performance and style. It cited the Clean Air Act section 203(a) as the legal authority that makes it illegal “for any person to remove or render inoperative any device or element of design installed on or in a motor vehicle or motor vehicle engine in compliance with regulations under this title…after such sale and delivery to the ultimate purchaser…” The EPA stated: “We use the term “tampering” to refer specifically to actions that are illegal under the Clean Air Act section 203; the term, and the prohibition, do not apply generally to the wide range of actions that a motorcycle enthusiast can take to personalize his or her motorcycle, but only to actions that remove or disable emission control devices or cause the emissions to exceed the standards.” The EPA further stated: “Owners would still be free generally to customize their motorcycles in any way, as long as they do not disable emission controls or cause the motorcycle to exceed the emission standards.” unclviny ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2002, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-davidsons-motorcycles-are-too-damn-loud/135139/44 "2002-11-10T23:44:37Z")
I can appreciate a loud bike, even if I understand that others hate them. But if I hear a shitload of noise, the bike producing it better be fucking fast. A screaming Ninja will get my thumbs-up any day of the week, but a friggin’ _Harley_ that shatters my eardrums through my ful-face helmet? No way. I’m just glad my stock Yamaha Diversion can easily accelerate away from those idiots. No offense to any stock-Harley riders. They do have their appeal. But these loud pipes aren’t part of it. ---
**Author:** ![Craneop2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Craneop2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Craneop2)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2002, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-davidsons-motorcycles-are-too-damn-loud/135139/45 "2002-11-11T02:54:27Z")
I have riden bikes almost all my life . But sorry guys I can’t go along with the loud pipes save lives argument. Actually the loud pipes occur at the rear of the bike and the biker should have already passed whatever danger that may be inherent? Seems to me that competance and wariness saves more lives than loud pipes ever would!! ---
**Author:** ![Kirkland1244](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dc4da7/32.png) [@Kirkland1244](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kirkland1244)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2002, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-davidsons-motorcycles-are-too-damn-loud/135139/46 "2002-11-11T21:03:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by GusNSpot \* > \*\*Remember rules are double edged. Be real careful what you wish for. > > You ready for it to be illegal to have a radio in an convertible? Noise laws are not just applied to motorcycles ya know.\*\* Fine by me. Second to assholes on motorcycles who think its “cool” to drown out all conversation within a twenty mile radius with those obnoxious should-be-illegal machines are assholes who play their hideous music so loud in a convertible or with their windows rolled down that they pull up next to me and I can’t hear my OWN radio, in my car, with my windows rolled UP. That should be illegal. I should be able to shoot those people. If you want to listen to music loud in a car, roll your God damn windows up. If you’re stupid enough to ride a motorcycle, have the basic decency not to make so much fucking noise that it bothers those around you. Kirk ---
**Author:** ![BoBettie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4af34b/32.png) [@BoBettie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BoBettie)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2002, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-davidsons-motorcycles-are-too-damn-loud/135139/47 "2002-11-11T23:24:54Z")
I agree with your rant, and just want to add: > [@](#): > > If you’re stupid enough to ride a motorcycle A big, hearty FUCK YOU! ---
**Author:** ![unclviny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e274bd/32.png) [@unclviny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/unclviny)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2002, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-davidsons-motorcycles-are-too-damn-loud/135139/48 "2002-11-12T18:57:08Z")
kirkland1244, how can i say this with proper decorum and respect? BLOW ME BUTTMUNCH!!! UNCLVINY ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2002, 9:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-davidsons-motorcycles-are-too-damn-loud/135139/49 "2002-11-13T09:27:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Craneop2 \* > Seems to me that competance and wariness saves more lives than loud pipes ever would!! Hear, hear! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-davidsons-motorcycles-are-too-damn-loud/135139.md?page=2)