# Harley moving some production outside of US due to EU tariffs **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [June 25, 2018, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698 "2018-06-25T12:57:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/21 "2018-06-26T13:51:33Z")
> [@Donald Trump](#): > > Early this year Harley-Davidson said they would move much of their plant operations in Kansas City to Thailand. That was long before Tariffs were announced. Hence, they were just using Tariffs/Trade War as an excuse. Shows how unbalanced & unfair trade is, but we will fix it… I saw above where someone posted that the KC plant was going to close and move to York, PA, but here’s Trump telling millions of his followers something different just a couple of hours ago. [Cite](https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1011568906992017408). > [@](#): > > Trump in February 2017 met with Harley-Davidson executives and union representatives at the White House. He thanked the company for building in America and predicted its operations would grow. > > “I think you’re going to even expand — I know your business is now doing very well, and there’s a lot of spirit right now in the country that you weren’t having so much in the last number of months that you have right now,” Trump said. He added that impending changes to “taxing policies,” health care, tariffs, and trade would only make things better. Huh; Trump said all that barely 18 months ago. How did his sure-fire strategy of tariffs and tax cuts lead to this??? :dubious::rolleyes:😛 ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/22 "2018-06-26T13:57:02Z")
Golly, I wonder if Trump supporters are going to buy the corporate line or the presidential misinformation. ---
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/23 "2018-06-26T14:01:52Z")
It’s not just HD. Mid-Continent Steel and Wire in Poplar Bluff, MO employed 500 people at the start of June. It’s the largest nail manufacturers left in the US. The company imports steel from Mexico. Due to the tariffs, their costs have gone up, and naturally their orders have fallen. By 50%. They’ve just laid off 60 temporary workers and fear they may have to lay off 200 more workers in July and may be out of business by the end of the summer. Poplar Bluff is in rural Butler County in Southeast Missouri. Almost 80% of Butler County voters pulled the lever for Trump. > **[Trump Steel Tarrif Could Slash 200 Jobs in Missouri](https://www.newsweek.com/trump-steel-tariff-nail-industry-992834)** > > Mid Continent Nail Corporation in Poplar Bluff, Missouri is one of the last remaining nail producers in the U.S. [https://www.ozarksfirst.com/news/local-nail-company-says-they-are-suffering-under-trump-administration-s-tariffs/1261330184](https://www.ozarksfirst.com/news/local-nail-company-says-they-are-suffering-under-trump-administration-s-tariffs/1261330184) > **[Missouri Election Results 2016: President Live Map by County, Real-Time...](https://www.politico.com/2016-election/results/map/president/missouri/)** > > POLITICO's Live 2016 Missouri Election Results and Maps by State, County and District. Includes 2016 Races for President, Senate, House, Governor and Key Ballot Measures. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/24 "2018-06-26T14:09:25Z")
According to your first cite, Mid-Continent Steel is a Mexican company, so I doubt Trump cares that much if they go out of business. And considering that there’ll be a huge gap that needs to be filled when they go OOB, I bet one of Trump’s cronies is standing by with cash ready to buy up their assets and start a new company, whereby the steel tariffs for this business will miraculously be lifted. It’s all about the graft. ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/25 "2018-06-26T14:23:09Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Golly, I wonder if Trump supporters are going to buy the corporate line or the presidential misinformation. > [@asahi](#): > > People are underestimating the power of a skilled populist to frame reality for people who are more than willing to have it framed for them. My cynical side making the correlation - hope I ultimately turn out wrong on that. ETA: **Bobot** - I realise you’re suggesting the latter; I just wanted to emphasize voter gullibility. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/26 "2018-06-26T18:11:20Z")
Confused in Baja Canada writes: I am a bit perplexed, I read Trump’s thing about how Harley D will be taxed like never before, but I thought he meant that they would be taxed more by Europe, not by US? Anybody got that nailed down? ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/27 "2018-06-26T18:31:56Z")
According to this Guardian article (Yeah, I know, pinko Euro-trash fake news), Trump is saying that the US will tax them for being wusses: “Harley must know that they won’t be able to sell back into U.S. without paying a big tax!” > **[Trump threatens Harley-Davidson with 'big tax' over its tariff response](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/jun/26/trump-threatens-harley-davidson-tariff-big-tax)** > > Motorcycle maker to move production abroad after EU levies tariff but president says move ‘will be the beginning of the end’ That seems to suggest that he thinks Harley is moving its production out of the US to sell in the US market, when it’s that they plan to produce bikes outside of the US to sell to Euro-folk, but as always with the Trumpeets, it’s not very clear. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/28 "2018-06-26T18:39:13Z")
In case it wasn’t obvious, the EU tariffs on motorcycles and bourbon are aimed specifically at the constituencies of Ryan and McConnell. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/29 "2018-06-26T18:50:31Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Confused in Baja Canada writes: I am a bit perplexed, I read Trump’s thing about how Harley D will be taxed like never before, but I thought he meant that they would be taxed more by Europe, not by US? Anybody got that nailed down? I think he means that if Harley Davidson build motorcycles abroad and brought them to sell in the US, he would charge import taxes on them. I understand that is not what they mean to do, they will build and sell abroad. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/30 "2018-06-26T20:38:33Z")
OK, because I was thinking it was like “Oh, you don’t like it here, wait till you find out how much those socialist Yurpeens are going to tax you!”. Maybe that _was_ it, and he changed it to be more aggressive when they chose to bite the hand rather than bend the knee. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/31 "2018-06-26T21:40:21Z")
As a PR customer base item risking the Trump attack is interesting. I don’t think it is coincidental that HD has been for several years now working on expanding the customer base [beyond the middle aged white guy.](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-harleydavidson-boomers-analysis/analysis-as-boomers-age-harley-hunts-for-younger-riders-idUSBRE95K0GU20130621) > [@](#): > > … several CEOs ago, the company began an effort to attract buyers born after 1964. An outreach program was launched to gain favor with women and minorities; products were redesigned. > > Harley-Davidson regularly claims the effort has been a success - and trots out supportive research from RL Polk, a leading provider of auto industry data, which shows Harley has been the market leader among riders ages 18 to 34, as well as women, African-Americans and Hispanics, for five years running. But that despite that [sales](https://www.foxbusiness.com/markets/harley-davidson-seeks-new-crop-of-riders-as-u-s-sales-stall) in the U.S. have continued to slow, while the importance of the EU market has grown. Put very simply, Trump’s misinformation will be believed … by those who are not going to be buying Harleys in any case and who are not the growth segment the company is targeting for the future. The potential younger riders with enough money to buy one, women, minorities of various sorts, and the growing EU market that they cannot afford to be priced out of … they are not the ones who believe whatever Trump says. But Trump will be able to declare victory over HD: after his threats they will not be importing any motorcycles built in the EU into the U.S.! Go Trump! (Really, just go.) ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/32 "2018-06-26T21:57:19Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > But Trump will be able to declare victory over HD: after his threats they will not be importing any motorcycles built in the EU into the U.S.! Go Trump! (Really, just go.) For the record, Trump is also doing an awesome job protecting our coastal cities from kraken attacks! 😛 ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/33 "2018-06-26T22:09:50Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > According to this Guardian article (Yeah, I know, pinko Euro-trash fake news), Trump is saying that the US will tax them for being wusses: > > “Harley must know that they won’t be able to sell back into U.S. without paying a big tax!” > > [Trump threatens Harley-Davidson with 'big tax' over its tariff response | Donald Trump | The Guardian](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/jun/26/trump-threatens-harley-davidson-tariff-big-tax) > > That seems to suggest that he thinks Harley is moving its production out of the US to sell in the US market, when it’s that they plan to produce bikes outside of the US to sell to Euro-folk, but as always with the Trumpeets, it’s not very clear. He doesn’t care where they sell – he wants those jobs to stay here and he wants to exploit the situation for political reasons. He probably doesn’t actually give a shit what Harley does as long as they end up making some kind of concession and putting a giant mural of Trump on the front of their headquarters. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/34 "2018-06-26T22:13:34Z")
[https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/something-important-about-the-harley-situation-and-trump](https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/something-important-about-the-harley-situation-and-trump) Of interest, this insight from Josh Marshall, of _Talking Points Memo_. Because of papers that Harley D filed, the current statements from Il Douche mean that they are breaking the law. Such that if what he says is true, then Harley D committed fraud of a specifically illegal kinds. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2018, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/35 "2018-06-26T23:31:24Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > [Something Important about the Harley Situation and Trump - TPM – Talking Points Memo](https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/something-important-about-the-harley-situation-and-trump) > > Of interest, this insight from Josh Marshall, of _Talking Points Memo_. Because of papers that Harley D filed, the current statements from Il Douche mean that they are breaking the law. Such that if what he says is true, then Harley D committed fraud of a specifically illegal kinds. By Occam’s Razor, it’s more likely that Trump is — shall we say — _mistaken_. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/36 "2018-06-27T05:49:36Z")
From Josh Marshall: > [@](#): > > If you hide something or make a claim that is false it’s a big deal. So is the same thing on a SF-86 questionnaire. Tell me again how much Trump cares about lying. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/37 "2018-06-27T13:02:15Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Such that if what he says is true, then Harley D committed fraud of a specifically illegal kinds. A statement that begins “If what the Trumpster Fire says is true…” has as much bearing on the real world as one that begins “If all the oxygen molecules in this room randomly congregate in the far corner…”. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/38 "2018-06-27T14:38:34Z")
> [@Steve\_MB](#): > > A statement that begins “If what the Trumpster Fire says is true…” has as much bearing on the real world as one that begins “If all the oxygen molecules in this room randomly congregate in the far corner…”. Don’t joke about that. Happened to me once. Very scary! ---
**Author:** ![iamthewalrus\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/258eb7/32.png) [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/39 "2018-06-27T17:52:22Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > [Something Important about the Harley Situation and Trump - TPM – Talking Points Memo](https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/something-important-about-the-harley-situation-and-trump) > > Of interest, this insight from Josh Marshall, of _Talking Points Memo_. Because of papers that Harley D filed, the current statements from Il Douche mean that they are breaking the law. Such that if what he says is true, then Harley D committed fraud of a specifically illegal kinds. This seems like a pretty lame insight. HD have made multiple statements, all consistent with each other, and one which carries a penalty of fraud if not true. Trump, known to be full of shit an incredible amount of the time, has made some shit up that contradicts those statements. Film at 11. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698/40 "2018-06-27T21:09:01Z")
Josh Marshall is just as smart as me, and knows more about this shit. Can’t recall him steering me wrong, and I would, because I can be very resentful. Thing as far as I grasp it, is that if Trump is telling the truth…hey, it could happen!..then HD was duping investors. Not shattering news, but somewhat relevant to the discussion. YMMV. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harley-moving-some-production-outside-of-us-due-to-eu-tariffs/816698.md?page=1)