# Harry Potter Mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [June 25, 2010, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429 "2010-06-25T01:13:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2010, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/281 "2010-07-04T17:40:12Z")
Updated List of Players: Alive 1. Freudian Slit 2. ShadowFacts 3. OneandOnly Wanders 4. Little Plastic Ninja 5. tiltawhirl 6. Jimmy Chitwood 7. Chipacabra 8. Rysto 9. Pedescribe 10. Inner Stickler 11. Zeriel 12. Meeko 13. Red Skeezix 14. Guiri 15. Storyteller Dead: **Omi no Kami – Antonin Dolohov(Death Eater)** **Drain Bead – Harry Potter(Order of the Phoenix Occlumens and Chosen One)** **NormalPhase – Severus Snape (No Chosen Allignment - Had 1 Optional Night Kill)** ---
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2010, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/282 "2010-07-04T17:54:45Z")
OK, so the way I’m reading this, \*\*NormalPhase \*\*was a non-compulsory Vigilante who could choose which side to be on at some point in the game. In my view, having him die is a net positive for Town, because: 1. If he chose scum, they would get one extra night kill, which would suck hard. 2. Even Town-aligned Vigilantes have a bad record of killing Town, in my experience. So, even though we lost our investigator and a lynch, by the numbers we’re still at 1 Town dead vs. 1 Scum dead, which is actually not bad for this point in the game. I am not as despondent as I was just yesterday 😛 I need to review **Omi no Kami** before I comment on **Rysto’s** post. I shall do so now. ---
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2010, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/283 "2010-07-04T18:00:37Z")
For the record, and since there are so few, here is every non-fluff post **Omi no Kami** made on Day One. I think we should read over them carefully to see what we can glean: > [@Omi\_no\_Kami](#): > > I agree with the spirit of what _Rysto_ has to say, but I think following any strategy to a fault can be dangerous. Regarding the disclosure of information, I’ve always personally felt that information about your role, or gleaned from your special abilities (e.g. a real mason hearing a false mason’s claim) should be kept close to the chest until 1) You’re in immediate danger of being lynched, 2) you think you’ve gleaned all you can about Scum with your info. > > I know that #2 is where I get frustrated- real masons can watch fake masons to see if anyone is defending them or backing their claim up with unusual fervor, fake doctors and cops will sometimes have another Scum buddy come to their aid, or protect scum from the temporary trust they can earn until they’ve been debunked… that sort of thing. > > I just get frustrated when a townsperson makes a great information coups/deductive leap and posts it immediately, without trying to milk the knowledge for all he can learn about the scum. > [@Omi\_no\_Kami](#): > > Does that really happen? I would think that the hard-line people on both sides would be in some trouble: I’ve only played 2-3 games of mafia, but I would’ve guessed that the least suspicious people would be middle-of-the-road players: if you’re too vocal scum can always find _something_ in your posts that looks suspicious, and if you lurk you’ll probably be called out for it, especially as the game goes on and the other players start realizing that they know nothing about you. > > Given that, wouldn’t it make the most sense for the players who discuss things avidly but tend to be hesitant to put themselves out on a limb to convince everyone else of their opinion to be the likeliest to be Town? It seems like giving your opinion and then letting the group make up their own minds is the best approach. > [@Omi\_no\_Kami](#): > > Gah, I hate first day votes: I’m almost never confident about anyone, and while I acknowledge that we have to “push” people and that voting can be a good way of both eliciting behavior and seeing who behaves strangely under pressure, I always end up feeling like I’m being a jerk by accusing potential townies of villainy based on (usually) small evidence. > > In any case, I’ve been nursing a few idle suspicions: > > I was initially concerned about **Rysto** when the semantic debate bubbled up in the wake of his post on information disclosure, especially when it went on for a bit, but he defended and clarified his points in a pretty no-nonsense way, and while I thought he was a bit antagonistic toward some of the critics, at this point I see nothing suspicious about the way he behaved during that discussion. > > Moving on, we have the **Red Skeezix** / **Chipacabra** dustup. **Red** got way too bent out of shape over the initial accusation, especially considering that it came on the first day. His immediate, subsequent posts gave me the feeling that he was “scrambling” a bit to establish a front of innocence, and even though he since seems to have evened out, the fact that his initial reaction was so out of whack with that of the other players is a huge, blaring sign. > > **Chipacabra** , on the other hand, just annoys me-his initial voting behavior was not atypical of day 1 players, openly voting to provoke a response, but the way he admitted that he was voting without having a clear suspicion in mind irks me: if you vote for someone, you need to be willing to back that vote up, and his comments sounded to me like he was trying to get a free pass- vote for people to see what happens, but since you’ve already admitted that you don’t have a logical basis for voting beyond your general strategy, if the person you vote for ends up being a townie you can expect yourself to be held blameless. I think this entirely defeats the purpose of voting, as randomly harassing players might help find scum, but it makes it really difficult for us to examine YOUR voting record and reach any conclusion about your behavior and possible undisclosed alliances from it. > > Finally, **Freudian Slit** hasn’t done anything to make me suspicious, but he is borderline-lurking, and being on the verge of ending a day with close to no idea about where he’s at annoys me. > > Lurkers almost always draw the group’s ire eventually, and this is only the first day, so I’m happy to give Freudian more time to play and establish a track record. > > Between **Red Skeezix** and **Chipacabra** I honestly don’t know: I find them both highly suspicious, and honestly if one of them were to be lynched on day 1 I would still keep an eye on the next one on day 2, because I think they’ve both shown cracks, and neither has done a sufficient job of convincing me of their guilt or innocence. > > However, at this time I think **Chipacabra** has been more detrimental to overall progress: he’s dominated the group’s attention with the disclaimer-filled rapid-fire voting, and frankly I’m so sick of hearing him re-hash the same points without progress in either direction that my eyes practically glaze over whenever I log on to find another long wall of quotations and text. Both he and **Red** look shady, but at this point I think **Chipacabra** has done a lot more to hurt the Town’s effort: he’s dominated a lot of the day’s discussion, and in doing so prevented us from hearing (and evaluating) more from a greater range of players. > > Because of that, I’m going to > **Vote Chipacabra** > Off the boarding school > [@Omi\_no\_Kami](#): > > I don’t see the connection between the case you’re citing and my complaint: I hate voting on day one because I’ve never, to my recollection, had a strong opinion about any of the players. I assume that’s frequently the case for everyone else as well, but it does honestly irritate me to pick at minutiae and build mountains out of molehills just to see who jumps and who shrugs it off. > > As far as I can recall, and as you’ve summarized, the case you’re talking about involved a player revealed (in large part due to his slipup) to be Scum by making that before the lynchee’s affiliation was revealed. > > I prefaced my analysis because a) it happened to be true, and b) I was worried that someone might try to attack me by picking apart a flaw in my analysis and then claiming that, as I had made such a big deal out of a minor point, I must have had some ulterior motive for wanting that particular player lynched-no truly objective player would reach those conclusions, yadda yadda yadda. By clarifying that I didn’t have a strong feeling or evidence toward any one player, and was simply coming up with the best conclusion I could based on the evidence and my own personal feelings, I hoped to head off that sort of thing pre-emptively. > > So I guess I’m just wondering where you see my decision to vote for **Chip** on the basis that among the early suspicious players he’s been the most disruptive to Town discussion even remotely resembling a Scum slipup indicating foreknowledge of his candidate’s allegiance. > [@Omi\_no\_Kami](#): > > I actually agree with you on this one, and I’m much happier to have you voting for me that **Drain**. For my part I can’t do much beyond justify my argument from my own point of view, and if I survive, wait to see if **Chip** and **Red’s** affiliation. For my own part, the reason I brought up continuing to suspect **Red** is that I think he has a better chance of being Scum than **Chip** does: his reaction was way too strong when **Chip** voted for him, and while it was possibly the reaction of an inexperienced townie (sorry **Red** , I don’t know how much experience you have in the game), it’s generally better not to presume innocence. > > _However_, in spite of that he wasn’t being nearly as disruptive or single-minded in selling his own argument, and since **Chip’s** single-mindedness bothered me almost as much as **Red’s** flinch, I felt that given how much time and focus he was sucking into his own issue, he was the greater potential threat. > > I can’t say anything about the provisios you’re (rightly) pointing out in my voting post, though: I’m naturally a very cautious speaker IRL and when writing, and I tend to fairly punctuate anything I write with qualifiers to make sure I’m not claiming something that I can’t back up. I can make an effort to quit it for the purposes of the game, but my non-mafia board history supports this and there’s really nothing I can do about it beyond making a point of being more clear-cut in my statements here. ---
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2010, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/284 "2010-07-04T18:42:19Z")
Looking back at **Omi’s** vote for \*\*Chipa \*\*(post 199), here was the situation: \*\*Red \*\*and \*\*Chipa \*\*were tied at two votes apiece with 24 hours left in the Day. \*\*Omi’s \*\*vote put \*\*Chipa \*\*in the lead 3-2. I think we can all agree that **Omi’s** vote post was a non-masterful bit of conditional-filled waffling. (It was so clumsy, in fact, that I fell victim to the “Scum would never say that” fallacy :smack: ). So what does that mean? What are the scum motivations for that vote? 1. \*Assumption: **Red Skeezix** is scum and \*\*Chipa \*_is Town_ - \*\*Omi \*\*sees that there’s only 24 hours left and wants to get a wagon rolling on \*\*Chipa \*\*to take the heat off **Red**. This is what \*\*Rysto \*\*is suggesting above. The conditionals in **Omi’s** post (e.g. “Red seems scummy, BUT…”) serve to insulate him a bit from blame if/when \*\*Chipa \*\*comes up Town. I find this to be a plausible scenario. 2. \*Assumption: **Red Skeezix** is Town and \*\*Chipa \*_is Town_ - \*\*Omi \*\*wins either way here, and picks one to get a wagon rolling on. The conditionals in this case could be a way to set up \*\*Red \*\*for a Day Two lynch. For example, when \*\*Chipa \*\*comes up Town, \*\*Omi \*\*says, “Crap, I got that wrong, but that means I was probably right about **Red** , since he was riding \*\*Omi \*\*so hard, etc.” In other words, by suggesting that they are both scummy, he sets up town vs. town for two days. I find this to be plausible as well, though I wonder why \*\*Omi \*\*would go out on a limb with the “\*\*Red \*\*is scummier, but \*\*Chipa \*\*is more annoying” choice, which was clearly more dangerous. 3. \*Assumption: **Red Skeezix** is Scum and \*\*Chipa \*\*is Scum. \* **Omi’s** vote makes no sense in this scenario. He would have voted for someone else entirely - with so many other votes still to come, there was no danger in choosing a different target. I find this to be totally implausible. 4. \*Assumption: **Red Skeezix** is Town and \*\*Chipa \*_is Scum._ I suppose \*\*Omi \*\*could have suspected that \*\*Chipa \*\*was doomed and decided to bus him early, but on Day One with so few votes out, I don’t regard this as very likely at all. Not very plausible. Conclusions: [ul] [li]By far the two most plausible scenarios have \*\*Chipacabra \*\*as Town. I am personally putting \*\*Chipa \*\*on my “Likely Town” list. [/li][li]If either \*\*Chipa \*\*or \*\*Red \*\*are scum, the other is 99% likely NOT to be scum.[/li][li]I find #1 above more plausible than #2 above. #2 would indicate a subtlety and long-term thinking that, in hindsight, \*\*Omi \*\*clearly did not demonstrate. [/li][/ul] Given the slight suspicions I already had yesterday added to the above, there is no way that I cannot: **Vote Red Skeezix** ---
**Author:** ![Rysto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecccb3/32.png) [@Rysto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rysto)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2010, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/285 "2010-07-04T18:49:06Z")
[quote=“ShadowFacts, post:284, topic:544429”] [li]I find #1 above more plausible than #2 above. #2 would indicate a subtlety and long-term thinking that, in hindsight, \*\*Omi \*\*clearly did not demonstrate. [/li][/QUOTE] I briefly considered #2 myself, but I reject it because of the way that **Omi** phrased his vote. He was clearly trying to drum up support for a **Chipa** lynch specifically. If he was going for a 2-for-1 deal, he wouldn’t have had to push so hard against **Chipa** when it was pretty clear that he felt that the evidence was worse against **Skeezix**. ---
**Author:** ![storyteller0910](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecae2f/32.png) [@storyteller0910](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/storyteller0910)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/286 "2010-07-05T02:55:14Z")
OK. So all due apologies for my absence yesterDay. In some ways it’s sort of helpful, though, because it allows me to take a look at the events of the Day without prejudice; I was a nonparticipant and not reading live, so my perspective is perhaps somewhat different from that of others (at least, for the moment). With that in mind, time for my favorite thing – Day One vote analysis, or The Passion of _Omi No Kami._ We start with a bit of early back-and-forth about information sharing and whatnot, which eventually morphs into further back-and-forth about scum slips and whether they happen and so on. From my perspective, this stuff, while interesting, is not really relevant to how it came to pass that Omi died, so I am skipping it and jumping straight to Page 3, Post #136, in which **Chipacabra** votes for **tiltawhirl** as a prod/placeholder vote. **Skeezix** jumps on and votes **Chip** in response, at #139. His reasoning is fair – basically, he’s saying that Chip’s vote was a zero accountability vote, and one he (Chip) could use to affect the final count if tilt happens to swing without really being “responsible” for it. It’s thin, but for Day One as reasonable as it gets. Chip’s (almost immediate) response at #140 is similarly reasonable, and nothing about this exchange pings me particularly. Chip unvotes and then votes for me as an inactive player. At #152, **ShadowFacts** goes after **Skeezix** for leaving out the “prodding” aspect of Chip’s vote for tilt. I don’t really agree with Shadow here. Leaving out part of an argument in order to discuss another part is sometimes necessary; otherwise we’d be blathering even more than we usually do (Jimmy agrees with this at #158). I also dislike “prodding” votes, because I don’t think they work; I, for example, was unable to participate until now, and Chip’s vote didn’t affect that one bit in either direction. But I don’t see anything untoward in Shadow’s argument (not agreeing with it doesn’t mean it’s scummy). **Chip** votes for **Skeezix** at #165. I don’t like this vote. He says that skeezix has “talked himself into this vote,” but I don’t really understand why. Skeez restated his argument, essentially, at #163, and it hasn’t changed substantively since #139. I don’t understand what Skeez said at #163 that was worth a vote, that _wasn’t_ in the post at #139 that _didn’t_ draw a vote from Chip. Don’t like this vote, but think it’s a pretty good possibility that it’s textbook OMGUS – which I have come to view as a null tell. Chip clarifies a bit at #168, though, and honestly at this stage I see both Red and Chip as neither Scummy nor non-Scummy, and have almost literally no read on anyone else. **Rysto** votes for **Freudian Slit** at #186. Basically Rysto doesn’t like that Slit has made two posts but not really said much. I tend to agree – it’s the kind of lurking Scum actually do, versus the sort of actual disappearing that happens to Scum and Town with proportional frequency. **Meeko** votes for **Chip** at #193. Essentially the reasoning is that Chip is voting for lots of players with minimal justification, basically allowing him to be voting, and move freely, settling where he needs to without having to justify it (this is my understanding of Meeko’s vote; if Meeko would like to correct me, I hope he’ll do so). I don’t see his argument, at its heart, as particularly different from the one Skeezix has made. VOTE COUNT **Chipacabra(2):** Red Skeezix, Meeko **Red Skeezix(2):** ShadowFacts, Chipacabra **Freudian(1):** Rysto **Omi** votes for **Chip** at #199 (third vote! Woo hoo!). His post seems to reference a great choice between Chip and Skeezix, but until Omi’s vote there really isn’t a vote leader at all. Given what we now know of Omi’s alignment, the timing and placement of this vote surely does look bad for **Skeezix**. Votes start to fall on Omi. Drain starts (we know she is unaligned). Jimmy follows on, and frankly Jimmy’s vote seems most likely to be Town as any of the voters. Chip says this (#209): > [@](#): > > Like, maybe I’m just thinking about this game differently, but I think my actions wouldn’t be a very good idea for a scum player. This is a ping for me. It always makes me raise an eyebrow when someone tries to point out how what they’re doing is something scum wouldn’t do. I’m usually tempted to say things like this when I _am_ Scum, but I’ve done something that I genuinely believe to be pro-Town, and it’s driving me nuts that someone is riding me for something that I’m actually doing to appear more Town. Does that make sense? Anyway, the quote pings me. There’s also this: > [@](#): > > 'm a little disappointed with Omi’s vote logic. You suspect Red more than me, but vote me because I’m more disruptive? That seems backward. I can’t decide if it’s suspicious or just short sighted, though. 😕 Which, in light of Omi’s eventual alignment and the tenuous spot Omi was suddenly in (if Chip switched his vote from Skeez over to Omi, it’d have put Omi in a very precarious spot and tied with Chip himself. **Wanderers** and **Guiri** jump on **Omi** fast nonetheless. Omi’s in trouble here, trouble exacerbated by the vote from **Little Plastic Ninja** which comes in. At #219, we get this, from **ShadowFacts** : > [@](#): > > his run on Omi No Kami is giving me serious deja vu. I’ve seen it before: a player says something really stupid, lots of people jump on that player shouting “OMG Scum!,” they get lynched, and it turns out they were Town. [Note for clarity: I am NOT saying that Omi No Kami is Town - I am explaining something I’ve seen in previous games]. Everyone left alive shrugs and says “But they said X - how could we not vote for them???” And we get a dead townie and learn little about those who voted for him/her. Does this sound familiar to anyone else? > > Is there anything we can do to shake up this familiar story? Here’s why we should consider it: this is exactly the kind of situation I tried to get in on with my vote when I have played as scum. It’s the perfect vote hiding place. IF Omi is Town, then I can almost guarantee that there is one or more scum voting for him/her (?) already. The safe thing to do, of course, is just to let the day take its course and if Omi gets lynched and turns up Town, take a hard look at those who voted for him/her. But the deniability I talked about above makes that unlikely to yield any real fruit. A more out-of-the-box, shake things up idea would be to spend the last 3 hours of the game looking at the Omi voters hard and voting for one of them instead. At this moment, (again assuming Omi is Town for a second) I would say there is a 20-40% chance of hitting scum in that group just on random chance alone, and that ain’t bad for Day One. > > OK, that’s all I have time for right now. I’m sure I’ll take some flak for this idea, but I’m tossing it out there, and I hope Town will take it seriously and think hard about it. Maybe it’s a terrible idea, but maybe, just maybe, I’m a genius. I struggle to believe that a Scummy ShadowFacts would make this post, knowing, as he would that Omi was going to turn up Scum. Why bother? To buy an evidently vanilla Scum a Day or Two, at best? After Omi’s statements, he was going to swing eventually. What benefit sticking your neck out that far to try to save him? Wow. Well, that’s a lot of typing, for the following: 1. I am not nearly as convinced of Chip’s Townieness as some others appear to be. 2. I see Omi’s vote as the only evidence we have of Red’s Scumminess. That said, it’s pretty interesting evidence. 3. I have Town pings from Jimmy and ShadowFacts. 4. I agree with Rysto’s perspective on Freudian Slit, a player who usually manages to get into deep controversy pretty quickly and pretty much avoided any kind of controversy whatsoever on Day One. No vote yet. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/287 "2010-07-05T04:04:23Z")
> [@storyteller0910](#): > > Votes start to fall on Omi. Drain starts (we know she is unaligned). We know that **Drain** was a town power role, actually; the protagonist of protagonists. **Normal Phase** , who didn’t even get to play, the poor bastard, _nee_ **ColdPhoenix** , was the one who could have swung either way. A couple of points about the events since our last day: I don’t think I agree with all the doom and gloom, and certainly not now that it appears the Death Eaters did us a favor at least as much as they did themselves. If **Drain** was going to go, the very first night seems like the best time. It seems pretty unlikely that a skipped Day cycle later in the game would have been easier to stomach, and pretty likely that it could have been crippling. Hurts to lose a cop, certainly, but speaking of investigations: what’s the deal with the color? First, there’s the mention of the particular curse being used to kill - the first was crucio, the pain spell (with accompanying descriptions of the twisted and haunted expression of the boy-who-until-recently-lived), and the second was the killing curse, which just killed regular. Second, there’s: > [@](#): > > He had not morphed. He remained the same person they had all expected him to be. That’s from **Normal Phase** ’s, and a similar line is in **Drain’s**. So, possibly unwarranted assumptions: 1. the Death Eaters can torture information out of people, or something? 2. there’s some sort of mechanism in place for identity tomfoolery and face morphing. Is that relevant to anybody now that HP the legilimens/investigator is gone, hell if I know, but it’s interesting. Seems a strange inclusion to be just color. ---
**Author:** ![Chipacabra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@Chipacabra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chipacabra)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/288 "2010-07-05T06:54:12Z")
Right now, what I’m really puzzling over is why did the death eaters kill Normal Phase? Anyway. Day 1, I really did suspect Red more than Omi, which is why I didn’t change votes. I’ve been agonizing over the possibility of situation #2, that Red is town and Omi was just trying to encourage the fight, but that just doesn’t feel right to me. I’m going to stick with my gut for now. **Vote Red Skeezix** ---
**Author:** ![One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/838e76/32.png) [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/One_And_Only_Wanderers)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 7:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/289 "2010-07-05T07:37:12Z")
I voted Omi because I believed that Omi knew Red was scum and was trying to lay groundwork for townie points, without actually voting. With Omi having in fact come up as scum, I am happy to **vote Red Skeezix** ---
**Author:** ![ColdPhoenix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@ColdPhoenix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ColdPhoenix)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/290 "2010-07-05T07:59:20Z")
Thanks all. It’s been a tiring but rewarding experience so far! Re the innie/outie question, I’ll have to wait until the cord falls off I think. Game looks like it’s interesting! ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/291 "2010-07-05T16:08:06Z")
And once again, the Order of the Phoenix stood around, staring at their toes, hoping beyond hope that the magic of “luck” would save them 😉 ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/292 "2010-07-05T16:20:55Z")
> [@ShadowFacts](#): > > OK, so the way I’m reading this, \*\*NormalPhase \*\*was a non-compulsory Vigilante who could choose which side to be on at some point in the game. In my view, having him die is a net positive for Town, because: > > 1. If he chose scum, they would get one extra night kill, which would suck hard. > 2. Even Town-aligned Vigilantes have a bad record of killing Town, in my experience. Short of a no-kill or a dead scum, I think **Normal** ’s death was the best possible outcome from Night 2 and the lost Day. To your list I would add:3. The (voluntary) recruitment aspect of the role could have caused Town havoc with vote and post analysis if **Normal** decided to join the death eaters late in the game - I’m reminded of her role in Screamers. > [@storyteller0910](#): > > I struggle to believe that a Scummy ShadowFacts would make this post, knowing, as he would that Omi was going to turn up Scum. Why bother? To buy an evidently vanilla Scum a Day or Two, at best? Evidently vanilla scum or presumably vanilla scum? The color didn’t say anything about his role. I do agree that **ShadowFacts** ’ idea, with only 3 hours remaining in the Day, would have been a pretty foolish attempt to save a scum buddy however, if it had gathered support, we could have spent several Days trying to find scum among the voters. > [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](#): > > Hurts to lose a cop, certainly, but speaking of investigations: what’s the deal with the color? First, there’s the mention of the particular curse being used to kill - the first was crucio, the pain spell (with accompanying descriptions of the twisted and haunted expression of the boy-who-until-recently-lived), and the second was the killing curse, which just killed regular. This could indicate two different killers but it’s probably just color. > [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](#): > > 1. there’s some sort of mechanism in place for identity tomfoolery and face morphing. Is that relevant to anybody now that HP the legilimens/investigator is gone, hell if I know, but it’s interesting. Seems a strange inclusion to be just color. I think this is simply the way death eaters hide among the OotP, from the opening color: > [@Mahaloth](#): > > From the same sources, the Order of the Phoenix has also learned that the Death Eaters themselves have infiltrated their order by using polyjuice potion, a potion that changes the form of the user and allows them to look like other people. Which matches **Omi** ’s death color: > [@Mahaloth](#): > > As they stared at Ominokami….he began to morph. His true form was revealed. > [@Chipacabra](#): > > Right now, what I’m really puzzling over is why did the death eaters kill Normal Phase? Why do you think scum, rather than another killing role, killed **Normal**? based on **Oredigger** ’s comment or something else? I hope he wasn’t messing with us as his comment would also rule out any possible interference (redirections, bus drivers, bodyguards, etc.) leaving a scum kill targeted at a player who had yet to make her first game-related post. As for reasons why, I can only guess she was killed for meta-game reasons as **ColdPhoenix** only made a few posts in response to the information sharing discussion. For the record, a final Vote Count with color: Shadowfacts(0): Chipacabra (114 [del]136[/del]) Tiltawhirl(0): Chipacabra (136 [del]145[/del]) Chipacabra(3): Red Skeezix (139), Meeko (193), Ominokami (199) Storyteller(0): Chipacabra (145 [del]162[/del]) Red Skeezix(2): ShadowFacts (152), Chipacabra (165) Freudian(1): Rysto (186) Ominokami(6): DrainBead (203), JimmyChitwood (206), Oneandonly (214), Guiri (216), Littleplastic (218), Zeriel (223) Not voting: ColdPhoenix, Freudian Slit, Inner Stickler, Pedescribe, Storyteller, Tiltawhirl I agree that it’s likely **Omi** was trying to save a scummy **Red** from the lynch on Day 1 and, by expressing his suspicions of **Red** , build up some townie cred if/when **Red** flipped. This tells us about **Omi** ’s possible motivations but only tells us about **Red** through association. I’m going to re-review the alternative scenarios before placing a vote. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/293 "2010-07-05T16:30:06Z")
\*\*Vote Count: Red Skeezix(4): Rysto, ShadowFacts, Chipacabra, OnandOnly\*\* ---
**Author:** ![Rysto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecccb3/32.png) [@Rysto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rysto)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/294 "2010-07-05T16:41:43Z")
> [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](#): > > 1. there’s some sort of mechanism in place for identity tomfoolery and face morphing. Note that in **Omi** ’s death scene, **Mahaloth** said this: > [@Mahaloth](#): > > \*\*As they stared at Ominokami….he began to morph. His true form was revealed. > > And they recognized him. > > **Ominokami was Antonin Dolohov, a Death Eater.** \*\* I would guess that the Death Eaters are under a polyjuice potion to disguise themselves, but if they die it wears off instantly. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/295 "2010-07-05T16:58:03Z")
> [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > Why do you think scum, rather than another killing role, killed **Normal**? based on **Oredigger** ’s comment or something else? I’ve been assuming that must be the case as well, because of: [QUOTE=Mahaloth] As they awoke, they dreaded that in their delay, they may have allowed the Death Eaters to kill once again. They were right. [/QUOTE] Thanks for pointing out the polyjuice thing from the opening text, by the way, guys. I guess I hadn’t read that very closely. - It looks like **Skeezix** is going to be a runaway favorite here, and I can definitely understand the appeal even though I originally read the **Skeezix** / **Chip** brawl as more damning of **Chip**. It’s interesting that from the point at which **Omi** rode into battle with that long post #199, **Skeezix** , who was very active earlier, is nearly absent from the discussion. His only non-fluff post after that point was in response to **ShadowFacts’** suggestion that we look at the **Omi** voters, rather than at **Omi** : > [@](#): > > @Shadowfacts: > > While I think your suggestion is an intriguing one, I do not think trying to squeeze a discussion into the space of a few hours would be anything other than a clusterfuck. That said, I think there will be much to profit from analyzing how this bandwagon formed, especially in the area of well-reasoned cases vs me-too votes. > > @The 1/3rd of the players who haven’t bothered to vote, wtf!?! This is ridiculous. You can’t all be scum. What reason could you possibly all have for not voting? He’s right about that last point, though. ---
**Author:** ![Trepa\_Mayfield](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@Trepa\_Mayfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trepa_Mayfield)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/296 "2010-07-05T17:38:28Z")
I wish I was a scum right now. Seriously it’s midday 3, Mahaloth has PMed me twice to get back in the game, I’ve been active in two other games, and not a single person has voted for me?! Not one? Geez, you guys are unusually sheepy. > [@Rysto](#): > > To put it in scum-motivation terms, the motivation for posting fluff is that it’s fun. That motivation applies equally well to townies and scum. On the other hand, there’s a lot of scum motivation for posting contentless posts that address some part of the game. For scum, talking is dangerous. They could slip, they could contradict themselves, they could hem themselves into performing an action that they really don’t want to do. But not talking is also dangerous, because sooner or later the town will punish such behaviour. All too often in our games the best strategy for scum is to walk that line where you are posting enough to not be considered a lurker while posting as little as possible actual content. I don’t see a strong town motivation for doing such a thing. > I posted it because I have observed what I think is a pattern in town behaviour that I don’t think is a pro-Town thing. I wasn’t trying to call out any specific player – in the two examples that I gave, the offending players aren’t even playing in this game. Those were just recent examples that cam to mind. Especially you, Rysto. Why aren’t you voting for me? It isn’t like you. It’s suspicious. \*\* Vote Rysto\*\* ---
**Author:** ![Rysto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecccb3/32.png) [@Rysto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rysto)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/297 "2010-07-05T17:50:20Z")
Uh, because I honestly had no idea you were in this game? Besides, I trust the mods to take care of actual lurkers, and players who I have an active suspicion of rank higher on my “to-vote” list than lurkers. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/298 "2010-07-05T17:53:25Z")
That might be the most poorly conceived voting philosophy I’ve yet had the pleasure to encounter. If it isn’t, it’s the second most poorly conceived. Restated, **pedescribe** , what you’re saying is that _you’ve been so scummy_ that anybody who hasn’t voted for you is under suspicion – which is everybody, because as you might not have even noticed, since by your own admission you’ve been refusing to play, we’ve missed a day of voting and already lynched a death eater. That is such a monstrously absurd rationale that I can’t even bring myself to vote you for it. Good luck with that going forward. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/299 "2010-07-05T17:55:09Z")
Wait, yes I can, as it turns out. What is my vote, special? **Vote pedescribe** ---
**Author:** ![Red\_Skeezix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/aca169/32.png) [@Red\_Skeezix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Red_Skeezix)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429/300 "2010-07-05T19:19:41Z")
Well, I can’t say I didn’t see this coming based on the way that Oni’s flip. Good for him, I guess since he has provided ample reason for scum and town alike to vote for me. At this point, I’m assuming that he was a newbie scum who was unable to decide between two (what he thought were) town players, although I cannot be sure about chipa. This is based on his argument that scum bussing scum was incomprehensible to him (oni). Perhaps he was trying to set us up for a One-Two punch, but if that was his strategy, then he went at it rather ham handedly. So onto the part, you’ve all been waiting for, my role! I’m a pfk, kind of a serial killer/lyncher type. So lynch away, and I’ll eat my hat for disagreeing with sachertorte at the end of Random Mafia. Games where players don’t want to play, suck. Period. LTL is a _boring_ strategy. [QUOTE=Mahaloth] You are Fenrir Greyback, Leader of the Werewolves. You are not aligned with either the Order of the Phoenix or the Death Eaters. You have an insatiable hunger for the blood of children, and believe that the terror you spread will bring greater station to your fellow werewolves. You win when the following players are dead, and you have killed at least one of them personally: Luna Lovegood Hermione Granger Harry Potter Ronald Weasley Gregory Goyle Draco Malfoy Powers: 1. Each night you may select a player whom you will stalk and kill. 2. Due to your feral canine nature, no one can penetrate your mind and no one could ever learn your true identity through magic of any kind. 3. Your win is exclusive and supersedes all other win conditions. [/QUOTE] In addition, I targetted two players, one for each night, neither kill was successful, ie those players are still alive. I would reveal the targets but at this point due to oni getting me lynched, I’m thinking “Fuck scum, I’m not going to possibly out any town powers.” (I was not told why my kills failed.) Arrivederci! PS: Thanks to those who actively participated on Day 1, whatever your alignments may be, for playing the game. PPS: Also, for possibly delibrately not playing the game: **vote Pedescribe** [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-mafia/544429.md?page=16)