# HARRY POTTER question: Can muggles make or even use magical potions or artifacts? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 10, 2014, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-question-can-muggles-make-or-even-use-magical-potions-or-artifacts/706862 "2014-12-10T17:54:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2014, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-question-can-muggles-make-or-even-use-magical-potions-or-artifacts/706862/21 "2014-12-12T00:59:25Z")
> [@asterion](#): > > I wish I had access to the OED, but according to Wiktonary, “wizard” comes from Middle English _wys_ plus _ard_ and basically means “one who is wise”. “Warlock” is older, coming from Old English “waerloga” (and that from a mixture of Proto-Indo-European and English). The non-obsolete definition of “male equivalent of a witch” probably comes from the obsolete definitions of both “liar or oath-breaker” and “the Devil or a demon”, leading to the other definition in the UK of a man in league with the Devil (as a witch is in league with the Devil). “Witch” comes from the Old English “wicce” and previously from Proto-Germanic “wikjo”. Please note I’ve omitted a number of diacritical marks. > > So anyway, it’s probably simply that the better equivalent to a witch is a warlock, and considering the school was founded in the late 10th century Middle English would not have existed yet. So the default would presumably be “witch” and “warlock” or probably “wicce” and “wicca” at the date of the founding of the school. This assumes that the founders were all speakers of Old English, that they decided to use Old English (since they weren’t all from England), and that the founding of the school in the Scottish Highlands didn’t mean that Middle Irish (which, being a Celtic language has no real relationship to the Germanic family that Old English is in) was used instead. And no, I’m not going to find the equivalent of witch, wizard, and warlock in Middle Irish. That said, it’s probably a safe bet that there was a combination of Celtic and Germanic languages spoken at Hogwarts throughout the centuries until the British Isles pretty much standardized on English. > > This, of course, assumes that Rowling is a linguist or philologist on the order of J.R.R. Tolkien. While Rowling is fond of using Latin and other languages to name characters, spells, and so on, somehow I doubt she gave the whole “wizard” vs. “warlock” question much thought. I have access to the OED, and the info in your first paragraph is correct; you’re pretty much on target throughout, in fact. ---
**Author:** ![Balance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ccd318/32.png) [@Balance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balance)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2014, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-question-can-muggles-make-or-even-use-magical-potions-or-artifacts/706862/22 "2014-12-12T03:01:51Z")
> [@asterion](#): > > Edit: Well, I took a lot longer getting there, but I still like my explanation better than the presumably official one of a title. It just being a title is boring. Well, we could push the etymology of it a bit. If we take “warlock” as a derivation from the O.E. _waerloga_ in the oathbreaking sense, it’s conceivable that its meaning could have diverged at some point, with the magic version losing its negative connotation and coming to mean a person who could release others from oaths–an important thing in a society in which oaths can be magically binding. Such a person might be needed in order for a couple to divorce, for example. If someone had occasion to leave a group that has membership oaths–similar to a nun being released from her vows, say–it would make sense if the leader were the one with the power to unbind them. A similar function might apply to magically binding contracts or treaties the group might make. In this manner, the term could come to be used as an official title, denoting the individual with the authority to bind or loose members or the organization as a whole. If such a title were commonly used in, say, dueling societies, it might also come to denote a champion duelist, since the leaders of such groups would presumably excel at combative magic. This would account for both modern usages: the formal title denoting a leader and the informal term of respect for a skilled duelist. There’s more handwaving in this post than in a whole beginner Charms class. ---
**Author:** ![Aquadementia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aquadementia/32/555_2.png) [@Aquadementia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aquadementia)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2014, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-question-can-muggles-make-or-even-use-magical-potions-or-artifacts/706862/23 "2014-12-13T00:47:55Z")
An explanation I would buy into more is to say creating a potion was a ritual as much as adding precise amounts of ingredients. They should have some mumbo-jumbo like take four pumpkin seeds with your right hand and with your left throw one away to represent the sister that didn’t make it. If you just added three pumpkin seeds or tossed one away without knowing why then your potion turns to soup. And it’s that intent that is the difference between doing things and magicking things. When ordinary people do things it doesn’t matter what there intent is. ---
**Author:** ![Shirley\_Ujest](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@Shirley\_Ujest](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shirley_Ujest)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2014, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-question-can-muggles-make-or-even-use-magical-potions-or-artifacts/706862/24 "2014-12-13T01:46:11Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Cracked can bite my shiny metal ass. I read that in Bender’s voice. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2014, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-question-can-muggles-make-or-even-use-magical-potions-or-artifacts/706862/25 "2014-12-13T02:30:32Z")
> [@Shirley\_Ujest](#): > > I read that in Bender’s voice. You were SUPPOSED to. ---
**Author:** ![Aquadementia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aquadementia/32/555_2.png) [@Aquadementia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aquadementia)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2014, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-question-can-muggles-make-or-even-use-magical-potions-or-artifacts/706862/26 "2014-12-13T02:43:24Z")
Sounded like McGonagall to me. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2014, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-question-can-muggles-make-or-even-use-magical-potions-or-artifacts/706862/27 "2014-12-13T03:23:54Z")
Doesn’t “witch” (or “wicce”) also come from a root meaning “wise”, though? That would support “witch” and “wizard” being used as the male and female versions of the same thing. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2014, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-question-can-muggles-make-or-even-use-magical-potions-or-artifacts/706862/28 "2014-12-13T04:06:07Z")
The assumption that you must be a real wizard to brew potions is used in a fanfic I’m reading that puts a D&D (munchkin) wizard into the the HP world. (The protagonist has to figure out how to pull it off without HP magic, without knowing what the potion is supposed to do.) And that guy is pretty particular on getting all his data correct. (He even rolls for the D&D wizard in battle.) It’s a comedic take of how each book would be changed. The first one is called [_Harry Potter and the Natural 20_](https://www.fanfiction.net/s/8096183/). The guy who wrote _Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality_ recommends it. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2014, 4:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-question-can-muggles-make-or-even-use-magical-potions-or-artifacts/706862/29 "2014-12-13T04:43:22Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > The assumption that you must be a real wizard to brew potions is used in a fanfic I’m reading that puts a D&D (munchkin) wizard into the the HP world. (The protagonist has to figure out how to pull it off without HP magic, without knowing what the potion is supposed to do.) And that guy is pretty particular on getting all his data correct. (He even rolls for the D&D wizard in battle.) It’s a comedic take of how each book would be changed. The first one is called [_Harry Potter and the Natural 20_](https://www.fanfiction.net/s/8096183/). > > The guy who wrote _Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality_ recommends it. Just be at there’s no specific Rhymer rule on against reading fanfic doesn’t mean the other rules don’t imply such a prohibition. ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2014, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-question-can-muggles-make-or-even-use-magical-potions-or-artifacts/706862/30 "2014-12-13T12:25:49Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Doesn’t “witch” (or “wicce”) also come from a root meaning “wise”, though? That would support “witch” and “wizard” being used as the male and female versions of the same thing. According to Wiktionary (again, no OED here), it ultimately derives from the Proto-Germanic “wikjo”, which means “necromancer” or “waker of the dead”. Nothing about being wise that I can see. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-question-can-muggles-make-or-even-use-magical-potions-or-artifacts/706862.md?page=1)