# harry potter stuff that bothers you **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 4, 2014, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466 "2014-02-04T00:06:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![xizor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xizor/32/102_2.png) [@xizor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xizor)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/221 "2014-02-07T17:24:02Z")
> [@KKKK](#): > > But can you think of any school match where a team of 13 year olds goes up against a team of 17 year olds with good results? Off the top of my head I remember the University of Michigan riding a team of 5 freshman all the way to within one timeout of the NCAA basketball championship back in the early 90s. So yes with a couple phenom players this is not hard to believe. ---
**Author:** ![fachverwirrt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/94ad74/32.png) [@fachverwirrt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fachverwirrt)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/222 "2014-02-07T18:54:54Z")
I don’t recall Harry’s blood status being an issue, although it’s possible I’ve just forgotten. And while I’m sure there are Slytherins and Death Eaters who are contemptuous of halfbloods, I don’t recall them being specifically persecuted under the Voldemort regime. I don’t think Voldy would have taken kindly to claims that halfbloods are inferior or less powerful. ---
**Author:** ![gracer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8e7dd6/32.png) [@gracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gracer)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/223 "2014-02-07T19:48:49Z")
> [@fachverwirrt](#): > > And while I’m sure there are Slytherins and Death Eaters who are contemptuous of halfbloods, I don’t recall them being specifically persecuted under the Voldemort regime. I don’t think Voldy would have taken kindly to claims that halfbloods are inferior or less powerful. That’s… the whole point? Voldemort and the Death Eaters want blood purity. They’re racists. You should probably give it another read. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/224 "2014-02-07T20:34:09Z")
I think fach is differentiating between halfblood and mudblood. Someone like Voldemort or Harry is a halfblood with a mixture of magical and nonmagical ancestors, while Hermione is a mudblood since she has no magical relatives. While technically, the death eaters should focus on halfbloods as well as mudbloods, the sheer number of them in the wizarding world makes such a stance politically untenable. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/225 "2014-02-07T20:38:55Z")
> [@fachverwirrt](#): > > I don’t recall Harry’s blood status being an issue, although it’s possible I’ve just forgotten. Pretty much the only allusion to it is Dumbledore noting that of the two candidates for the Prophecy’s subject, Voldemort decided to do away with the one with a muggleborn mother. > [@fachverwirrt](#): > > And while I’m sure there are Slytherins and Death Eaters who are contemptuous of halfbloods, I don’t recall them being specifically persecuted under the Voldemort regime. I don’t think Voldy would have taken kindly to claims that halfbloods are inferior or less powerful. > [@gracer](#): > > That’s… the whole point? Voldemort and the Death Eaters want blood purity. They’re racists. You should probably give it another read. Yabbut, Voldemort isn’t going to get racial purity for himself; half of his chromosomes come from a Muggle. Accepting an axiom that halfbloods are wielders of an inferior grade of magic forces him to accept that HE is the wielder of an inferior grade of magic. And **fachverwirrt** ’s point, if I’m reading him correctly, is that during the purges of the Thicknesse administration, the interrogators only required their defendants to prove the magical status of ONE birth parent. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/226 "2014-02-07T20:40:19Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Yip, that’s one of the two major changes. I don’t know for sure what the other one is, but the results are that both Voldemort and Harry are really smart. For the purposes of this thread, Harry exists as the audience surrogate to point out the flaws in the Rowling canon. > > It starts out pretty humorous, but gets more intense as it goes on. By the point we are at now, it gets at least as dark as the last books did. > > Speaking of humor, if you want to read a purely humorous take that the author likes–and especially if you know a little bit about D&D or other paper RPGs–you may want to check out [Harry Potter and the Natural 20](https://www.fanfiction.net/s/8096183/1/Harry-Potter-and-the-Natural-20). It’s about a munchkin wizard who gets sucked into the HP world. I’ve never even played a game of D&D, but I love it. > > (The HPMOR author says he found it funnier than some of the Discworld books.) I’ll poke around at some of the other stuff. Just got burned looking for the pod casts. picked up some annoying malware that took some time to get rid off. ---
**Author:** ![Ranger\_Jeff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranger_jeff/32/2065_2.png) [@Ranger\_Jeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranger_Jeff)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/227 "2014-02-07T20:41:20Z")
> [@gracer](#): > > That’s… the whole point? Voldemort and the Death Eaters want blood purity. They’re racists. You should probably give it another read. Voldemort _ **was** _ a half-blood, remember? As was Snape and Harry. Oh, I’m not completely through HPMOR. I’m only up to chapter 16 or so. The Harry in HPMOR reminds me a lot of Sheldon Cooper; A lot of memorized book knowledge, an inability to conceive of the idea that he could be wrong, a belief that he’s smarter and therefore superior to everyone he meets, and grossly lacking in social skills. And so far, I haven’t seen much of a Moral Compass in him. Oh, and the other major change I see, so far, is that Harry is in Ravenclaw, not Gryffindoor. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/228 "2014-02-07T20:44:20Z")
> [@Fenris](#): > > Ok, Dumbledore is an utter idiot and an attention whore, so I don’t think it’s unreasonable for him to have missed an obvious loophole in Lily’s “Protect Harry” spell, but someone else should have caught it. > > I get that Rowling was trying for a Rolad Dahl style of “humorous abuse” with the Dursleys, but she failed, IMO. Given that harry was locked up in a spider-filled hole under the stairs for weeks at a time (sneaking out to get canned food and to go to the bathroom), that he was verbally abused and feared actual real violence and got literally no affection or physical contact from anybody, he should have grown up feral. > > The obvious loophole would have been to put Harry with some other family (wizard or not) and had him spend one overnighter (or one week or whatever the minimum amount of time needed) to fulfill the “live with relatives” part of mom’s protection. Hell, even if he’s gotta be with the Dursleys for a few months in the summer, it’s _still_ better than what Dumbledore did which is completely abandon Harry to horribly abusive monsters. Not QUITE complete. Arabella Figg was there to monitor the situation. It’s completely unclear what she would have been prepared/instructed to do if Harry had never been permitted to interact with the outside world, but she WAS there, all the same. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/229 "2014-02-07T20:44:32Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > I think fach is differentiating between halfblood and mudblood. Someone like Voldemort or Harry is a halfblood with a mixture of magical and nonmagical ancestors, while Hermione is a mudblood since she has no magical relatives. While technically, the death eaters should focus on halfbloods as well as mudbloods, the sheer number of them in the wizarding world makes such a stance politically untenable. His progenitor (salazar slytherin) only wanted to teach pure bloods. Ironically his great great… grandson wouldn’t be able to attend. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/230 "2014-02-07T20:48:06Z")
> [@Ranger\_Jeff](#): > > Voldemort _ **was** _ a half-blood, remember? As was Snape and Harry. > > Oh, I’m not completely through HPMOR. I’m only up to chapter 16 or so. The Harry in HPMOR reminds me a lot of Sheldon Cooper; A lot of memorized book knowledge, an inability to conceive of the idea that he could be wrong, a belief that he’s smarter and therefore superior to everyone he meets, and grossly lacking in social skills. And so far, I haven’t seen much of a Moral Compass in him. Heh. In the thread on the subject, somebody called it _Ender Wiggin Goes to Hogwarts_, which is pretty funny. And funnier if you have any basic familiarity with _Ender’s Game_. ---
**Author:** ![Bozuit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/edb3f5/32.png) [@Bozuit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bozuit)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/231 "2014-02-07T20:49:22Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > Yabbut, Voldemort isn’t going to get racial purity for himself; half of his chromosomes come from a Muggle. Accepting an axiom that halfbloods are wielders of an inferior grade of magic forces him to accept that HE is the wielder of an inferior grade of magic. I take it as a sort of allegory for Hitler and his obviously-not-Aryanness, plus the Jewish ancestry rumours. ---
**Author:** ![fachverwirrt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/94ad74/32.png) [@fachverwirrt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fachverwirrt)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/232 "2014-02-07T21:12:06Z")
> [@gracer](#): > > That’s… the whole point? Voldemort and the Death Eaters want blood purity. They’re racists. You should probably give it another read. As others have noted, Voldemort was a halfblood. The persecution was against muggleborns; wizards and witches with no magical parents. ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/233 "2014-02-07T21:17:33Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > I’m not the best to answer that, but, as far as I can tell, most of the other characters are (or at least start out) the same, they are just reacting to a different situation. And there’s a lot of canon information that can inform your reading, particularly stuff about horcruxes and Voldemort himself. > > Anything that changing Harry and Voldemort wouldn’t have changed is still there, too, of course. That means all of Rowling’s setting is there, including the inanities. Some, however, turn out to have a good explanation. Right now, we’ve just learned that there was a good reason that Voldemort had to keep going back and getting a fresh supply of unicorn blood. Much earlier, Harry figured out how the spit take soda (whatever it’s called) works. > > The prophecy is still there, although I believe it’s slightly different. Snape still was bullied by Harry’s dad and is in love with Harry’s mom. Voldemort still appeared to kill Harry and make him his horcrux. Something is still off about Quirrell. The Chamber of Secrets is still there and is how Voldemort got his power. Harry is still the Boy-Who-Lived and all that stuff. > > So, yeah, a lot of the stuff is still there. But your going to encounter it differently, through the eyes of a young boy scientist who is wise beyond his years and has these weird temper episodes where he feels almost like a different person. Eh, sorry, my question was rhetorical. I’ve read both. The similarities are almost…superficial, in that the world is similar, but the characters that are in the limelight, their experiences leading up to and then their interactions in Hogwarts are massively, massively different. The changes are all pervasive. Huge spoiler ahead about the nature of one of the characters in HPMOR. Are you aware that Voldemort is Harry’s most trusted mentor at Hogwarts? Yup. Quirrel is Voldemort. ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/234 "2014-02-07T21:20:47Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > Heh. In the thread on the subject, somebody called it _Ender Wiggin Goes to Hogwarts_, which is pretty funny. And funnier if you have any basic familiarity with _Ender’s Game_. Heh. I suspect that even Yudkowsky would probably agree with that assessment. Later on, some of the parallels are so close that I think it’s fan fiction for both novels. ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/235 "2014-02-07T22:05:45Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Speaking of humor, if you want to read a purely humorous take that the author likes–and especially if you know a little bit about D&D or other paper RPGs–you may want to check out [Harry Potter and the Natural 20](https://www.fanfiction.net/s/8096183/1/Harry-Potter-and-the-Natural-20). It’s about a munchkin wizard who gets sucked into the HP world. I’ve never even played a game of D&D, but I love it. > > (The HPMOR author says he found it funnier than some of the Discworld books.) Heh. Thanks for linking this. I read a couple of chapters and will probably read all of it now. A couple questions. How long is it? Is it finished? Do you know if it’s available on mobi? I couldn’t find a mobi version. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/236 "2014-02-07T23:05:44Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > Not QUITE complete. Arabella Figg was there to monitor the situation. It’s completely unclear what she would have been prepared/instructed to do if Harry had never been permitted to interact with the outside world, but she WAS there, all the same. But she was useless. “Monitoring the situation” means “intervening if the kid is locked in a 2"x3"x3” closet filled with spiders, forced to either hold his bladder for 16 hours a day and living off canned soup he can steal" or “intervening if Uncle Vernon is in Harry’s face to the point where Harry can see Vernon’s nostril hairs and Vernon is yanking Harry around by one arm” or “Seeing that Harry is malnourished, abused, ill-treated and given no human contact or affection.” Apparently her only mission was “Watch out for Harry…call me if Voldemort shows up…don’t sweat anything else” which isn’t really a good standard of care. ---
**Author:** ![dracoi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90db22/32.png) [@dracoi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dracoi)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/237 "2014-02-07T23:21:30Z")
> [@Fenris](#): > > But she was useless. “Monitoring the situation” means “intervening if the kid is locked in a 2"x3"x3” closet filled with spiders, forced to either hold his bladder for 16 hours a day and living off canned soup he can steal" or “intervening if Uncle Vernon is in Harry’s face to the point where Harry can see Vernon’s nostril hairs and Vernon is yanking Harry around by one arm” or “Seeing that Harry is malnourished, abused, ill-treated and given no human contact or affection.” > > Apparently her only mission was “Watch out for Harry…call me if Voldemort shows up…don’t sweat anything else” which isn’t really a good standard of care. Yes, exactly. In fact, having Figg there makes the whole situation LESS believable to me, not more. It’s one thing if we can think that Dumbledore was in the dark to some extent and maybe we can excuse him for being busy and trusting to human nature being good. It’s another thing when it looks like the attitude of many wizards surrounding the situation was “So it’s a little child abuse. No biggie.” ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2014, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/238 "2014-02-07T23:55:08Z")
> [@Fenris](#): > > But she was useless. “Monitoring the situation” means “intervening if the kid is locked in a 2"x3"x3” closet filled with spiders, forced to either hold his bladder for 16 hours a day and living off canned soup he can steal" or “intervening if Uncle Vernon is in Harry’s face to the point where Harry can see Vernon’s nostril hairs and Vernon is yanking Harry around by one arm” or “Seeing that Harry is malnourished, abused, ill-treated and given no human contact or affection.” > > Apparently her only mission was “Watch out for Harry…call me if Voldemort shows up…don’t sweat anything else” which isn’t really a good standard of care. It was apparent from the letters that they were aware of the situation and as he grew older they threatened the Dursley’s outright if they mistreated him. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2014, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/239 "2014-02-08T00:06:01Z")
It’s possible Dumbledore and company didn’t realize how bad the situation was with Harry. Remember, they weren’t aware that he didn’t know that he didn’t know about Hogwarts, and that it took him forever to get his letter? They probably thought he was okay. It wasn’t until later that they found out he was being abused. > [@bldysabba](#): > > Eh, sorry, my question was rhetorical. I’ve read both. The similarities are almost…superficial, in that the world is similar, but the characters that are in the limelight, their experiences leading up to and then their interactions in Hogwarts are massively, massively different. The changes are all pervasive. Huge spoiler ahead about the nature of one of the characters in HPMOR. > > Are you aware that Voldemort is Harry’s most trusted mentor at Hogwarts? Yup. Quirrel is Voldemort. Uh, this is open-spoilers, and that is not even a big one. [spoiler]Quirrel was never one of Harry’s mentor’s, let alone a trusted one. You’re probably thinking of Mad-Eye, and he didn’t turn out to be Voldemort, but Barty Crouch Jr. Besides, of all of his DADA teachers, Harry was closest to Lupin. (An amusing fact: the twins at one point bewitched snowballs to hit Quirrel in the back of his turban. They were actually hitting Voldemort in the face!) Rowling made Voldemort a half-blood on purpose – it was to show his insecurity and his hatred of his father for leaving his mother. It’s almost as if by ridding the world of Muggle-borns he was ridding himself of his paternal roots.[/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2014, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466/240 "2014-02-08T00:56:09Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Uh, this is open-spoilers, and that is not even a big one. Uh, different book being spoilered there. Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality. Please do me a favour and request a mod to alter your post? There are people in this thread who have expressed a desire to read HPMOR. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-stuff-that-bothers-you/680466.md?page=13)