# Harry S Trumans middle name **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 12, 2002, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175 "2002-04-12T04:20:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![antechinus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/fbc32d/32.png) [@antechinus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antechinus)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/1 "2002-04-12T04:20:18Z")
I was told that the S in Harry S. Truman, a president of the USA elected at the end of the second world war, stood for a Russian name. It was something like Sergi. However when I look it up on the WWW there are many references saying there was no middle name or it stood for his grandfathers name. What gives? ---
**Author:** ![racinchikki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eada6e/32.png) [@racinchikki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/racinchikki)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/2 "2002-04-12T04:27:21Z")
I was told that his middle name was S - just hte letter S - because his grandfathers’ names both started with an S and his parents didn’t want to choose between which to honor. ---
**Author:** ![Cull](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/bc79bd/32.png) [@Cull](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cull)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/3 "2002-04-12T04:30:08Z")
I’ve also heard that it was just “S” no abbreviation ---
**Author:** ![nani](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/58956e/32.png) [@nani](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nani)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/4 "2002-04-12T04:41:42Z")
It is just S. Apparently Harry’s parents had quite a few members of each respective family whose name began with “S,” and rather than choose one to give him, they just decided to honor them all, but more specifically the two grandfathers. ---
**Author:** ![clonestyle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ebca7d/32.png) [@clonestyle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clonestyle)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 7:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/5 "2002-04-12T07:14:29Z")
I heard his parents dropped a piece of noodle on his birth certificate (in the shape of an S) and it kinda stuck. ::shrug:: :b ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_T](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Gary\_T](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_T)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 7:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/6 "2002-04-12T07:33:15Z")
If I’m not mistaken, he gave his name as Harry S Truman–no period after the S. ---
**Author:** ![brad\_d](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@brad\_d](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brad_d)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 7:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/7 "2002-04-12T07:45:22Z")
It is correct that the “S” is not short for anything. “To period or not to period” can be a tough issue for the picky, but I’m willing to defer to the Harry S. Truman Library. It has on its website [this page](http://www.trumanlibrary.org/speriod.htm), which addresses the issue of the period. It says, in part: > [@](#): > > The evidence provided by Mr. Truman’s own practice argues strongly for the use of the period. While, as many people do, Mr. Truman often ran the letters in his signature together in a single stroke, the archives of the Harry S. Truman Library has numerous examples of the signature written at various times throughout Mr. Truman’s lifetime where his use of a period after the “S” is very obvious. > > \ > > Most published works using the name Harry S. Truman employ the period. Authors choosing to omit the period in their texts must still use it when citing the names of organizations that employ the period in their legal titles (i.e. Harry S. Truman Library) thus seeming to contradict themselves. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/8 "2002-04-12T14:21:21Z")
I offer no authoritative evidence on this subject. All I know is that most respected reference books say Truman’s parents gave him the middle initial “S” without telling anyone what it stood for, so that two different sets of relatives (each of whose family names started with “S”) could think Harry had been named for them. That’s a plausible story, and I can buy it. But I myself brought up the issue of “Sergei” on these boards, after seeing an old George Burns movie called “18 Again.” In that movie, the mind of elderly George Burns is placed in the body of a young college student (Charlie Schlatter). In history class, a smug professor embarrasses kids by asking them what the “S” in Harry Truman’s name stood for, and then smirking that it didn’t stand for anything. Now, the George Burns character supposedly KNEW Harry Truman, way back when. So the kid with George Burns’ mind scoffs at the professor, saying something like, “Ha! You idiot! You BELIEVED that old story? His middle initial stood for Sergei. His family was part Russian. But he didn’t want to be perceived as a Russian sympathizer, so he told people the “S” didn’t stand for anything!” Now, I have NEVER seen that claim substantiated anywhere. In fact, I’d never heard it before seeing the movie. OBVIOUSLY, silly movie comedies are NOT a great place to look for historical data… but I’ve long been curious as to where that theory came from. Did the screenwriter make it up completely? Were there long-standing rumors to that effect (perhaps scurrlilous rumors made up by Red-baiters in the McCarthy era)? In short, it’s an interesting rumor, if true… but apart from that dubious film, I’ve never seen any evidence to suggest that it is. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/9 "2002-04-12T14:36:35Z")
Truman’s family history is pretty well known (see McCullouch’s biography **Truman** , or just about any book on him) – no Russians anywhere in sight on that family tree. Verdict – as you say, don’t get your history from movies. If you do, I’ve got a fantastic deal on this here black statue of a Falcon. It’s from Malta. ---
**Author:** ![postcards](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8e8cbc/32.png) [@postcards](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/postcards)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/10 "2002-04-12T14:47:45Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by clonestyle \* > \*\*I heard his parents dropped a piece of noodle on his birth certificate (in the shape of an S) and it kinda stuck. ::shrug:: :b \*\* I think this story came from James Whitmore’s one man show (and movie) 'Give ‘Em Hell Harry’. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/11 "2002-04-12T18:05:10Z")
In the normal FN-MI-LN format (Dwight D. Eisenhower, John F. Kennedy, George W. Bush), Harry’s name was Harry S. Truman. When written out, à la Franklin Delano Roosevelt, it was Harry S Truman. The S. stood for his middle name, which was S ---
**Author:** ![Skippman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Skippman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skippman)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/12 "2002-04-12T18:18:46Z")
I have it on good authority that his middle name was \*\* Sue \*\*. The again the guy who told me that did end up in \*\* Folsum Prision\*\*. ---
**Author:** ![nimitz\_42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/eb8c5e/32.png) [@nimitz\_42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nimitz_42)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/13 "2002-04-12T20:58:14Z")
From the USS Harry S Truman (CVN-75) website: You can use the period or not use the period, it is up to you. The S is not an abbreviation for anything. ---
**Author:** ![karmakaze](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c67d28/32.png) [@karmakaze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/karmakaze)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2002, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/14 "2002-04-12T23:21:49Z")
FYI, Harry Truman’s grandfathers’ last names were Solomon and Shippe, IIRC, and rather than offend one or the other, the compromise of just using “S” was improvised. Hope that helps, TD ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2002, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/15 "2002-04-13T16:16:47Z")
Close but no cigar. One of Harry’s grandfathers was Solomon Young. His _great-grandfather_ (one of them) on his father’s side was a Shippe – and that name was preserved in the family. So yes, the S was a compromise between Solomon and Shippe, as you note, but not on account of its being his grandfathers’ surnames (one of them, of course, would have had to have been Truman). ---
**Author:** ![antechinus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/fbc32d/32.png) [@antechinus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/antechinus)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2002, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/16 "2002-04-15T03:48:47Z")
More info on the S in Harry S Truman. I did a search on “Harry Sergei Truman”, with correct spelling of Sergei, and was returned the URL… www.skeptics.com.au/features/quiz/quiz0105.htm A reference here says… “For the truth of the matter, you have to either look at the birth records for Lamar Missouri (there is only one Truman born there on May 8 1884 - “Harry Sergei Truman.” Read the autobiography of Allen W. Barkley (Truman’s VP) or read the superlative “an Underground Education” by Richard Zacks. It is for this reason alone that Harry Truman’s birth certificates are not on display at his presidential museum.” I was thinking that Astorians theory the Sergie rumour started via the George Burns movie was satisfactory, but now I dont know. Anyone live in Lamar Missouri? ---
**Author:** ![colnlrunner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b5ac83/32.png) [@colnlrunner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/colnlrunner)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/17 "2012-01-17T00:44:00Z")
I think the idea that it stands for Sergei comes from the movie “18 Again!” I found this thread because that idea was outlined in the movie and I was curious whether there was any truth to it. Ultimately I think it was just a plot device. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/18 "2012-01-17T00:57:38Z")
> [@Polycarp](#): > > … his grandfathers’ surnames (one of them, of course, would have had to have been Truman). That’s only true if everyone takes their father’s surname. At least one President of the U.S. had a surname that did not belong to one of his grandfathers: Gerald Ford’s grandfathers were Lynch and Gardner – he took his stepfather’s surname. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/19 "2012-01-17T01:01:30Z")
> [@Giles](#): > > That’s only true if everyone takes their father’s surname. At least one President of the U.S. had a surname that did not belong to one of his grandfathers: Gerald Ford’s grandfathers were Lynch and Gardner – he took his stepfather’s surname. Note that this is a ten year old thread that has been revived. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2012, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175/20 "2012-01-17T01:57:10Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > Note that this is a ten year old thread that has been revived. I knew that, but **Polycarp** still posts here regularly, and no one had responded to his comment. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-s-trumans-middle-name/103175.md?page=2)