# Has a false accusation of racism ever caused significant harm to anyone in the US? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 26, 2014, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635 "2014-03-26T21:17:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 9:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/41 "2014-03-27T09:08:29Z")
> [@Blake](#): > > Can you perhaps tell us what examples you would accept? For example, do you accept the Zimmerman example? Would you accept the police officer is the Rodney King case as an example? Would you accept the anecdote of my co-worker who was forced to attend an arbitration meeting and then ordered to go to 12 hours of sensitivity training while being expected to maintain the same workload and who has been denied promotion several times since the incident despite never being denied before? > > In short, can you explain what standard of evidence is acceptable, how “significant” the harm should be? It’s all subjective. Some of the examples so far (like Shirley Sherrod and the “water buffalo” guy) fit the bill, I think. > [@](#): > > If you have enough evidence to conclude that the great worries on the right that false accusations of racism are rampant and intellectually stifling is just victimization fantasy, for the most part, then can we use that same standard of evidence to conclude that the great worries on the left that racism is rampant and intellectually stifling is just victimization fantasy, for the most part. If we can’t, then why can’t we? I may have jumped the gun on my conclusion, so I’ll just say I’m leaning in that direction. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 9:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/42 "2014-03-27T09:11:17Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Just a quick question to the OP: > > See this blog post: > > [http://www.frumforum.com/charged-with-being-a-jerk/](http://www.frumforum.com/charged-with-being-a-jerk/) > > Ignore the stuff about Gates - just look at the description of the environment the guy is in. Do you think those constant false accusations of racism he’s getting are harmless? It certainly doesn’t seem like he suffered any significant harm. “A few days went by and the charge dropped without a whisper because there was absolutely no basis for it.” So he was nervous for a few days. I don’t think that’s “significant harm”. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 10:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/43 "2014-03-27T10:51:32Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Thanks for the numbers there, **Bricker**. I’ll concede that Mr. Jacobowitz was harmed. Though I find the notion that he was significantly harmed unsupported I note that many seem to be elevating the possibility of significant harm to the same level as something that would actually be significantly harmful; I don’t share that view here. Can you explain the threshold necessary to reach “significant harm,” in your view? What kind of financial loss constitutes significant harm? What kinds of consequences other than financial would fit the term? I’m reminded of the Black Knight from Monty Python, dancing around after King Arthur has cut off both his arms and claiming, “It’s just a flesh wound!” ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/44 "2014-03-27T12:22:21Z")
I’d argue that significant harm is caused to college communities when free speech is thwarted by accusations of racism (pre-emptive or after the fact), through “speech codes” or harassment of speakers. [Example](http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/brown-students-shout-commish-kelly-talk-article-1.1500618): the case of a New York City police commissioner shouted down when he tried to speak to students at Brown University. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/45 "2014-03-27T14:09:50Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > It certainly doesn’t seem like he suffered any significant harm. “A few days went by and the charge dropped without a whisper because there was absolutely no basis for it.” > > So he was nervous for a few days. I don’t think that’s “significant harm”. So being called a racist every day to your face is harmless? ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/46 "2014-03-27T14:14:03Z")
OJ Simpson & Mark Fuhrman come to mind as the most famous one. And [Charles Stuart](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Stuart_(murderer)) and Tawana Brawley. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/47 "2014-03-27T14:39:13Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > So being called a racist every day to your face is harmless? No, but for the short period of time described in the article, I don’t think it comes close to “significant harm”. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/48 "2014-03-27T14:45:04Z")
The anti-abortion movement has totally smeared Palnned Parenthood founder [Margaret Sander](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Sanger#Race) as a racist. Which is odd, as she championed birth control, not abortion. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/49 "2014-03-27T14:47:14Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > OJ Simpson & Mark Fuhrman come to mind as the most famous one. > > And [Charles Stuart](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Stuart_(murderer)) and Tawana Brawley. Fuhrman was _falsely_ accused of saying something racist? I thought he admitted to saying it. The Charles Stuart case is strange and bad, but I’m not sure where there is a false accusation of racism in it. It certainly has what turned out to be a false accusation of murder, but that’s very, very different. The Tawana Brawley case is also very unusual, but the only possible false accusation of racism may have been towards Steven Pagones (who was also accused of rape). Pagones won a big settlement and had a successful political career, but if he suffered at all, it seems to me it was due to the supposedly false accusations of rape, not of racism. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/50 "2014-03-27T14:48:24Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > The anti-abortion movement has totally smeared Palnned Parenthood founder [Margaret Sander](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Sanger#Race) as a racist. Which is odd, as she championed birth control, not abortion. She’s deceased, so I don’t think she counts as having suffered 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/51 "2014-03-27T14:51:47Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > It certainly doesn’t seem like he suffered any significant harm. “A few days went by and the charge dropped without a whisper because there was absolutely no basis for it.” > > So he was nervous for a few days. I don’t think that’s “significant harm”. See, here I agree. According to the linked article, the author suffered a few days of “going around with his head hung low,” no formal accusations, no disciplinary processes, nothing except a vague rumor that evaporated – and may have arisen because he was teaching “To Kill a Mockingbird,” which is a racially-charged story and gives more than one chance for a teacher’s personal views to be confused with his literary observations. That’s technically harm, but of a very minor, transitory sort. But when you talk about a university student who spent thousands of dollars hiring a lawyer, was formally charged by the university for violation of its code of conduct, and never formally exonerated by the university after months of the charge hanging over his head, I believe it’s fair to call that “significant harm.” When you talk about a woman who was forced to resign by her government – who then tripped over themselves offering her job back when the full context of her remarks became clear – that, I believe, is fair to call “significant harm.” Even though she was offered her job back, she did not take it, because (I suspect) she knew that her actions going forward would remain under a microscope and it’s always more difficult to get the true story out. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/52 "2014-03-27T14:54:18Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > No, but for the short period of time described in the article, I don’t think it comes close to “significant harm”. It wasn’t a short time. The particular accusation was. But being called it to your face every day was a regular occurrence. So - is being called a racist every day to your face harmful? ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/53 "2014-03-27T15:01:18Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Pagones won a big settlement and had a successful political career, but if he suffered at all, it seems to me it was due to the supposedly false accusations of rape, not of racism. _If he suffered at all_? Are you serious?? And I suppose [Harry Crist Jr.'s family](http://www.nytimes.com/1998/04/05/nyregion/mourning-a-son-tied-to-the-brawley-case.html) hasn’t suffered at all. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/54 "2014-03-27T15:02:44Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > The anti-abortion movement has totally smeared Palnned Parenthood founder [Margaret Sander](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Sanger#Race) as a racist. Which is odd, as she championed birth control, not abortion. From your cite - > [@](#): > > Sanger’s writings echoed ideas about inferiority and loose morals of particular races that were widespread in the contemporary United States. In one “What Every Girl Should Know” commentary, she observed that Aboriginal Australians were “just a step higher than the chimpanzee” with “little sexual control,” as compared to the “normal man and Woman.” I thought we were talking about _false_ accusations of racism. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/55 "2014-03-27T15:08:03Z")
> [@Stringbean](#): > > Please, let’s not be sensible and informed. The word sounds a lot like niggerly. Taking offense at niggard or niggardly is ill-informed rather than informed. And about as sensible as fearing to use the word country because the first syllable sounds exactly like cunt. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/56 "2014-03-27T15:13:33Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > It wasn’t a short time. The particular accusation was. But being called it to your face every day was a regular occurrence. So - is being called a racist every day to your face harmful? No, not in that circumstance. The article makes clear that it was a generic insult – “ceremonial racism,” if you will. And it’s not even clear that being called a cracker is an accusation of racism. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/57 "2014-03-27T15:14:56Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > No, not in that circumstance. The article makes clear that it was a generic insult – “ceremonial racism,” if you will. And it’s not even clear that being called a cracker is an accusation of racism. “As one of the only whites in the Baltimore high school in which I taught, I was called a racist – “You white racist bitch!” or “You skinny white racist bitch!” – **on a rather consistent basis** , mainly by students I was disciplining.” “Ceremonial racism”? I guess that makes it all better. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/58 "2014-03-27T15:36:14Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > _If he suffered at all_? Are you serious?? > > And I suppose [Harry Crist Jr.'s family](http://www.nytimes.com/1998/04/05/nyregion/mourning-a-son-tied-to-the-brawley-case.html) hasn’t suffered at all. :dubious: I only went by the Wiki article 🙂 But my point is that the suffering in this case was from false accusations of rape, not of racism. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/59 "2014-03-27T15:37:47Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > “As one of the only whites in the Baltimore high school in which I taught, I was called a racist – “You white racist bitch!” or “You skinny white racist bitch!” – **on a rather consistent basis** , mainly by students I was disciplining.” > > “Ceremonial racism”? I guess that makes it all better. If he was called a racist for many years, I suppose that might count as significant suffering. But nowhere in the article does he say this – the only time period he discusses (other than the word “consistent”) is a few days, after which it blew over. So based on the article, I see no significant suffering. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2014, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635/60 "2014-03-27T15:40:43Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > If he was called a racist for many years, I suppose that might count as significant suffering. But nowhere in the article does he say this – the only time period he discusses (other than the word “consistent”) is a few days, after which it blew over. He discusses two things. One is consistent incidents of calling him a racist. The other is a specific incident. > [@](#): > > So based on the article, I see no significant suffering. Yes, constantly being called a racist is harmless. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-a-false-accusation-of-racism-ever-caused-significant-harm-to-anyone-in-the-us/684635.md?page=4)