# Has any country ever kicked out (forced independence upon) part of its territory/people? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 25, 2009, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-any-country-ever-kicked-out-forced-independence-upon-part-of-its-territory-people/507638 "2009-08-25T15:23:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Ronald\_C.Semone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/cc9497/32.png) [@Ronald\_C.Semone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ronald_C.Semone)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-any-country-ever-kicked-out-forced-independence-upon-part-of-its-territory-people/507638/41 "2009-08-27T12:58:40Z")
I’m too lazy to look up all the details, but I remember Dr. Lee in my freshman history class more than 50 years ago saying that among Bismark’s goals when he took power in the German Confederation was to kick Austria out of the Confederation so that Prussia would have greater power. He was successful in so doing and Austria became a separate state. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-any-country-ever-kicked-out-forced-independence-upon-part-of-its-territory-people/507638/42 "2009-08-27T14:04:52Z")
> [@FRDE](#): > > I wonder how much say the residents of Alaska had over the sale of their homeland. Away from the few Russian fur-trading villages, probably few of them even knew about it. There are stories about the militarization of the territory in WW2 in which the Army constantly ran across natives who didn’t even know they were Americans. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-any-country-ever-kicked-out-forced-independence-upon-part-of-its-territory-people/507638/43 "2009-08-27T14:05:55Z")
That reminds me - did the Newfoundlanders get a say about becoming Canadians, or was that decision made for them in London and Ottawa? ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-any-country-ever-kicked-out-forced-independence-upon-part-of-its-territory-people/507638/44 "2009-08-27T17:10:15Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Away from the few Russian fur-trading villages, probably few of them even knew about it. There are stories about the militarization of the territory in WW2 in which the Army constantly ran across natives who didn’t even know they were Americans. The same was true of Indians who lived on the lands of the Louisiana Purchase. Lewis and Clark spent a great deal of time explaining that the French and the Spanish weren’t in charge anymore (if indeed, from the Indians’ perspective, they ever were). ---
**Author:** ![MikeS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/919ad9/32.png) [@MikeS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MikeS)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-any-country-ever-kicked-out-forced-independence-upon-part-of-its-territory-people/507638/45 "2009-08-27T17:26:57Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > That reminds me - did the Newfoundlanders get a say about becoming Canadians, or was that decision made for them in London and Ottawa? There was a public referendum in 1948 between three options: independence, joining Canada, or remaining governed by the UK. No option gained a majority in the first round (the vote was around 45-40-15, respectively), so there was a run-off election in which Newfoundlanders voted to join Canada 51-49. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-any-country-ever-kicked-out-forced-independence-upon-part-of-its-territory-people/507638/46 "2009-08-27T21:37:22Z")
> [@MikeS](#): > > There was a public referendum in 1948 between three options: independence, joining Canada, or remaining governed by the UK. No option gained a majority in the first round (the vote was around 45-40-15, respectively), so there was a run-off election in which Newfoundlanders voted to join Canada 51-49. Didn’t the local authorities wanted it to be a vote just between independence or remaining a British colony and London added joining Canada to the ballot against their wishs? ---
**Author:** ![Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hypnagogic_jerk/32/4252_2.png) [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypnagogic_Jerk)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-any-country-ever-kicked-out-forced-independence-upon-part-of-its-territory-people/507638/47 "2009-08-28T04:46:42Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > Didn’t the local authorities wanted it to be a vote just between independence or remaining a British colony and London added joining Canada to the ballot against their wishs? If I remember correctly, merger with Canada was added due to the lobbying efforts of Joseph Smallwood, who became the first post-union with Canada premier of Newfoundland. ---
**Author:** ![Bookkeeper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bookkeeper/32/281_2.png) [@Bookkeeper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bookkeeper)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-any-country-ever-kicked-out-forced-independence-upon-part-of-its-territory-people/507638/48 "2009-08-28T04:48:25Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > Didn’t the local authorities wanted it to be a vote just between independence or remaining a British colony and London added joining Canada to the ballot against their wishs? The option of joining with Canada was added to the referendum by the British government, after the Convention elected to decide the future of the colony had rejected this option, at the insistence of the minority Confederate Association faction led by Joey Smallwood. Smallwood has the reputation of having dragged Newfoundland kicking and screaming into Canada, although the British government was certainly helping push. ---
**Author:** ![installLSC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/54ee81/32.png) [@installLSC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/installLSC)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2009, 5:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-any-country-ever-kicked-out-forced-independence-upon-part-of-its-territory-people/507638/49 "2009-08-28T05:13:46Z")
> [@Ronald\_C.Semone](#): > > I’m too lazy to look up all the details, but I remember Dr. Lee in my freshman history class more than 50 years ago saying that among Bismark’s goals when he took power in the German Confederation was to kick Austria out of the Confederation so that Prussia would have greater power. He was successful in so doing and Austria became a separate state. I don’t really think that counts since the German Confederation didn’t really have sovereignity over its member countries. Certainly the member states had been conducting their own foreign policies since the treaty of Westphalia in 1648. Plus one the Confederation’s few effective units, the Zollverein custom union, included every member of the Confederation except Austria [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-any-country-ever-kicked-out-forced-independence-upon-part-of-its-territory-people/507638.md?page=2)