# has menthol ever been used as a crowd control agent? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 8, 2017, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-menthol-ever-been-used-as-a-crowd-control-agent/779340 "2017-02-08T18:56:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-menthol-ever-been-used-as-a-crowd-control-agent/779340/1 "2017-02-08T18:56:47Z")
Pepper spray works by stimulating the heat-sensitive nerve cells in one’s skin, causing an acute burning sensation. Menthol goes in the opposite direction, stimulating cold-sensing nerve cells. Years ago I toured the Celestial Seasonings tea factory in Boulder, Colorado. The tour included a visit to the sealed room where they stored peppermint. When they opened the door, you immediately understood why they stored it like this: the smell was overwhelming, and there was a sense of respiratory irritation that made it difficult to breathe. If they stored their peppermint in the same rooms as their other ingredients, before long all of the tea they shipped would be peppermint-flavored, regardless of the label. So has menthol ever been used in place of pepper spray to serve as some kind of repellent/disabling agent? Not sure if it would have any advantages over pepper spray, just curious. ISTM that concentrated menthol in the eyes and on the face would be fairly incapacitating. ---
**Author:** ![plankter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ba0ec/32.png) [@plankter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/plankter)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-menthol-ever-been-used-as-a-crowd-control-agent/779340/2 "2017-02-08T19:53:34Z")
I don’t have an answer for you, I just wanted to say I’m jealous that you got to do that tour. ---
**Author:** ![Dag\_Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@Dag\_Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dag_Otto)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-menthol-ever-been-used-as-a-crowd-control-agent/779340/3 "2017-02-08T20:13:29Z")
Menthol might be a skin and eye irritant, but it is added to cigarettes so the respiratory irritant potential may not be all that great. No way would I smoke a habanero cigarette. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-menthol-ever-been-used-as-a-crowd-control-agent/779340/4 "2017-02-08T20:14:58Z")
That room was quite amazing. They basically dared people to walk as far into the mint room as they could and almost everyone turned back after two steps, including myself, and I’ve half-sprayed myself with pepper spray and wasn’t fazed (my eyes shut but I wasn’t in any distress). ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2017, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-menthol-ever-been-used-as-a-crowd-control-agent/779340/5 "2017-02-08T21:22:40Z")
Lots of smells aren’t disagreeable in small doses; it’s the high dose that sucks. Even skunk smell is pretty OK if you get just a faint whiff of it. Most of the unhappiness from a faint whiff of skunk is the knowledge of what a bigger dose is like and the concern that maybe you’re heading into it. ISTM peppermint oil, wintergreen oil, menthol, etc., are like that. In high enough density they’d be repelling. But not incapacitating. The thing that makes CS, capsaicin spray etc., valuable as a crowd or personal control device is the incapacitating effect. A small dose stops the target cold. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2017, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-menthol-ever-been-used-as-a-crowd-control-agent/779340/6 "2017-02-09T02:49:36Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > The thing that makes CS, capsaicin spray etc., valuable as a crowd or personal control device is the incapacitating effect. A small dose stops the target cold. I have no personal experience. The report of the army recruit I spoke to was that a small dose made him angry, upset, and irritated. ---
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2017, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-menthol-ever-been-used-as-a-crowd-control-agent/779340/7 "2017-02-09T03:24:18Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > The thing that makes CS, capsaicin spray etc., valuable as a crowd or personal control device is the incapacitating effect. A small dose stops the target cold. That’s not exactly true. Many police academies use pepper spray on the trainees to knock that very notion out of their head. Pepper spray will not necessarily stop anyone cold, and in fact can absolutely escalate the conflict. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2017, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-menthol-ever-been-used-as-a-crowd-control-agent/779340/8 "2017-02-09T05:49:32Z")
“Return to your domiciles, or we will clear your sinuses and vaporize you. Vicks vaporize you…”? ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2017, 5:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-menthol-ever-been-used-as-a-crowd-control-agent/779340/9 "2017-02-09T05:56:01Z")
When you send the police to smoke someone out, they aren’t gonna use Kools. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2017, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-menthol-ever-been-used-as-a-crowd-control-agent/779340/10 "2017-02-09T13:34:18Z")
I wonder if the persistence of an odorant is a factor in deciding its suitability for crowd control. If menthol hangs around for days after, the people and businesses in that area might be very unhappy. They want to go about their daily lives after the incident and instead they’re all gagging to death. Other factors such as range of reactions, “backsplash” effects on the people spraying it, etc. might be involved as well. Is a controlling dose for a 300lb person going to kill an 80lb person? Does a cop really want to smell like menthol for days afterwards? ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2017, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-menthol-ever-been-used-as-a-crowd-control-agent/779340/11 "2017-02-09T14:15:29Z")
I remember as a kid I used to like these little chocolates called Ice Cubes (I see that they are [still on the market](https://www.thecandycity.com/Alberts-Chocolate-Ice-Cubes-100-Count-Tray_p_1076.html)) that felt cool in your mouth when you ate them. (It turns out that the physics of it is that the coconut oil in the candy melts at well below body temperature, absorbing heat in the process–they don’t just _feel_ cold on the tongue–they actually make your tongue cold.) They should pelt the crowds with those. ---
**Author:** ![donkeyoatey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47c2d/32.png) [@donkeyoatey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/donkeyoatey)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2017, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-menthol-ever-been-used-as-a-crowd-control-agent/779340/12 "2017-02-10T05:25:54Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > Even skunk smell is pretty OK if you get just a faint whiff of it. Most of the unhappiness from a faint whiff of skunk is the knowledge of what a bigger dose is like and the concern that maybe you’re heading into it. What the fuck does this mean? ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2017, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-menthol-ever-been-used-as-a-crowd-control-agent/779340/13 "2017-02-10T15:46:26Z")
> [@donkeyoatey](#): > > What the fuck does this mean? **Moderator Note** **donkeyoatey** , this is a jerkish response to a perfectly understandable post. No warning issued, but don’t do this again. Colibri General Questions Moderator ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2017, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-menthol-ever-been-used-as-a-crowd-control-agent/779340/14 "2017-02-10T15:54:09Z")
> [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > Pepper spray works by stimulating the heat-sensitive nerve cells in one’s skin, causing an acute burning sensation. > > Menthol goes in the opposite direction, stimulating cold-sensing nerve cells. Years ago I toured the Celestial Seasonings tea factory in Boulder, Colorado. The tour included a visit to the sealed room where they stored peppermint. When they opened the door, you immediately understood why they stored it like this: the smell was overwhelming, and there was a sense of respiratory irritation that made it difficult to breathe. If they stored their peppermint in the same rooms as their other ingredients, before long all of the tea they shipped would be peppermint-flavored, regardless of the label. > > So has menthol ever been used in place of pepper spray to serve as some kind of repellent/disabling agent? Not sure if it would have any advantages over pepper spray, just curious. ISTM that concentrated menthol in the eyes and on the face would be fairly incapacitating. If I’m ever in a crowd being “controlled” by scent sprays, I’m putting in a vote for wintergreen (methyl salicylate). ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2017, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-menthol-ever-been-used-as-a-crowd-control-agent/779340/15 "2017-02-10T16:06:01Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > If I’m ever in a crowd being “controlled” by scent sprays, I’m putting in a vote for wintergreen (methyl salicylate). … and the nurses involuntarily shudder. ---
**Author:** ![quimper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/7c8e57/32.png) [@quimper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/quimper)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2017, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-menthol-ever-been-used-as-a-crowd-control-agent/779340/16 "2017-02-10T17:00:26Z")
God I hope not. Crowd control sprays need to be non-toxic (to both applicant and applier) or reasonably close. If someone was drenched with pure peppermint extract it would probably kill them. Gas masks would be useless as the chemical would be absorbed by skin. Plant esters such as those produced by members of the mint family (peppermint, spearmint, thyme, oregano, rosemary, sage, etc) are \*\*toxic \*\*in large quantities. Toxic as in ‘ **kill you dead** ’ type toxicity (what, you think these plants spent millions of years evolving these substances so we can have nice tasting tea!?) Methyl salicylate is also bad. Some runner [died of an overdose](http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/10/nyregion/10cream.html?_r=1&ref=nyregion&oref=slogin) a few years back, presumably by rubbing too much Ben Gay on herself.