“sank to the bottom of the San Francisco Bay”
I was under the impression that bodies floated to the surface after a few days. And since the water is somewhat salty bodies should even be more buoyant.
As I understand it, the process is:
- bodies sink.
- decomposition starts, producing gases inside the body.
- enough gas accumulates inside the body to make it light enough to rise to the surface.
- body splits open, and/or animal prey on it, and the gases are released.
- body (what remains of it) sinks once again.
- fish, crabs, etc. eat what remains of the body.
- skeleton is left, to eventually decompose into dust.
Since San Francisco Bay is very cold, the decomposition process may be slowed, or just not produce enough gas to refloat the body. Or sea creatures could have eaten into the body & released the gases before there were enough to refloat the body.
Or the body on the surface of the water may not have been seen by anyone before it sank again.
So it’s quite possible, even most probable, that the bodies ended up at the bottom of San Francisco Bay.
Or they were washed out into the deep ocean.
So undertakers check fingerprints now, before embalming (or after)?
“Stopped his life of crime” would imply that he fond a legitimate job. Shurly most of them take your fingerprints now? I first had that happen in the late 1990’s (though it was a fairly high security job). But don’t most employees in large companies now have photo-id security badges? And they take your fingerprints when issuing those.
But I expect most of those fingerprints are never compared to those of most wanted criminals (especially those from 40 years ago). It would take a tremendous amount of work & expense.
Coroners do, at least on John Does and anyone dying by violence.
See this Dutch team’s simulation of ocean currents the night of the escape. A whole lot of the sims end up with the three getting swept out past the Golden Gate, where presumably they became fish food.
I can buy that either Morris or the Brothers made it. Especially if the survivors fled the country, maybe to Brazil if the Xmas Cards story with the Anglin Brothers is true. What I don’t buy is that three hard cases managed to escape and then stay out of trouble to and through the present day.
Anyway, take a look at the Delft guys’ particle models. I think they drowned, and their jetsam ended up on Angel Island, witha body discovered quite a bit northwest in the Pacific, outside the Golden Gate by the SS Norefjell. Note also at that last link, the story of the Golden Gate suicide jumper Seymour Webb, who jumped around the same time as the escapees started swimming, and Webb’s body was never found.
Their bunk dummies were made of wood…
I don’t think so.
Number of full-time jobs as an adult: 6
Number of times fingerprinted for a job: 0
Even if the case is closed, I’m pretty sure they still have to keep in hiding. It’s not like the FBI closing the case = exoneration. Closing the case merely means that they’re not being actively searched for. If they’re still alive and their whereabouts became public knowledge, the FBI would be knocking on their door the next day, case closed or not.
The same applies to DB Cooper.
Zev Steinhardt
That confuses the issue then. Do they have any warts and where do we stand on the newt issue?
Updating this thread:
Yes, it is not standard for your employer to take your fingerprints as a condition of employment. In 30 years of employment had to do it once…when I got a job as a driver for the school district and they needed to run a background check.
It’s very easy to go through life without getting your fingerprints taken. And even if they do take your fingerprints, there isn’t a giant database of fingerprints that they match them to and there’s a big buzzing noise and Chris Hansen jumps out.
I have a very hard time believing three repeat offenders escaped prison and went straight. The letter claims two men died just a few years ago.
I guess anything is possible. Perhaps the fear of returning to prison did offer deterrence to further crimes. But, I’d want better proof than an anonymous letter.
Couldn’t the handwriting be verified with old samples from family letters?
The report says its inconclusive. They may have only used signatures on old prison forms. Complete letters would offer much better testing.
Not sure how you got the idea that taking fingerprints goes with photo-id badges. Most places have a simple setup with a digital camera and some software that lets them print your picture on a badge right there. But they don’t have the specialized equipment you’d need for taking fingerprints, or anyone trained to take them properly (badly taken fingerprints are a problem for people seeking security clearance). I’ve worked at multiple large companies that did regular background checks and used photo IDs, and none of them did fingerprints.
I have only had two jobs that required fingerprints, and that was because they required a security clearance. No other job required it and it would cost additional money to run prints. I just don’t see why you’d have to do it unless the job requires it, like a clearance, or a pharmacist, people who work in banks, etc.
Also, looking at that article about the guys that went to Brazil. Yeah, kinda see the match on the top mug shot and blurry print, but the bottom mug shot doesn’t match at all. Also, bottom mug shot, nose looks a bit crooked, Brazil shot it doesn’t. Probability is dropping…
You mean like a cell phone?
Most of the newer cell phones have a fingerprint sensor that can be used to unlock the phone. The first one was from Toshiba in 2007, 11 years ago, and iphones have had them since 2013.
3M makes a mobile fingerprinting device that police officers all over the country use to identify people who have (or claim to have) no id using the Bluecheck system. It uses a similar fingerprint sensor and has 95%-99+% accuracy, when used by the average cop. And the devices are cheap enough that the maker is now pushing them to liquor & tobacco stores.
So while employers may choose to not record fingerprints of employees, it’s not because of any specialized equipment, given modern technology.
How does the fact that your smartphone can do fingerprint ID square with what we know about bogus/dodgy fingerprint IDs in criminal cases? It it that new tech outstrips what the FBI/cops were using? Is this Bluecheck system considered reliable by anyone besides the people selling it?
I was responding to the claim that it takes specialized equipment & training to do fingerprinting. That’s not accurate, given current technology,
This is the technology that the police are using.
Los Angeles police have nearly 3,000 Bluecheck devices. New York City police have about 6,000 devices (Bluecheck or competitor brand). New Zealand also uses the Bluecheck scanners. Atlanta, GA police use competing brand Morpho RapID, as does Australia & many European police forces.
All these police forces continue to use them because they are indeed reliable for their purposes. You can find lots of Youtube videos of them in use during police stops.
While I concur with most sentiments, that these three were, one, unlikely to survive and get away undetected, and two, perhaps even more unlikely to have disappeared, gotten on the straight and narrow and never gotten into trouble again.
Having said that . . .
From a quick read of their bios, it didn’t appear that they were violent offenders. And if it’s true that they didn’t kill anyone, would it be so bad for the Marshall’s office to say in this one particular case, we will waive any further prosecution in this due to the ongoing public interest? An olly olly oxen free kinda thing?