# Has the left figured out why Trump won the election? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [July 30, 2018, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827 "2018-07-30T19:32:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 6:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/122 "2018-08-01T06:55:32Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > If they influenced the election at all, then they changed the result. By definition. OK, I guess we can play this silly game further: They could have influenced an equal number of people to switch sides for both Hillary and Trump in the same precinct and not changed the result. So, no, your statement is not correct. The vote tallies would have been identical with or without influence. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 7:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/123 "2018-08-01T07:16:32Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Also noting that Clinton [had that plank in her platform](https://www.hillaryclinton.com/issues/workforce-and-skills/). The laid-off coal miners didn’t want that. They wanted someone to force people to buy coal (or at least promise that) so they could go on doing what they’d always done. Also noting that [Trump proposed eliminating the Appalachian Regional Council](http://www.thepostathens.com/article/2017/11/trump-budget-cuts-appalachia). Trump’s proposed budget calls for the elimination of all funding for the commission, according to a report by Time. Ninety-five percent of the counties the commission supports voted for Trump, according to the Time report. The Appalachian Regional Commission is a federal-state partnership that invests in resources in Appalachia. From 2015 to 2017, the commission supported a total of 662 projects in the region totaling $175.7 million, according to data provided by the commission. Over $257.4 million of that funding was matched by other organizations. The commission was founded in 1965. At the time, over 30 percent of Appalachian residents lived in poverty. From 2011 to 2015, the poverty rate was just over 17 percent, according to the commission website. Additionally, the number of high-poverty counties in the region has declined from 295 in 1960 to 87 in 2015. …So once again, it comes down to what **Velocity** said - perception trumping reality. Republican voters are perpetually misinformed, and they’re kept that way by an insular right-wing media bubble. The explanations offered in this thread from the right based on what Clinton or Trump actually proposed or did are almost exactly the opposite of the reality. So what do you do about that? ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 9:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/124 "2018-08-01T09:45:29Z")
I haven’t read the thread and I’m not on the left. Based on a comparison to the House election, Trump won because everyone voted straight party-line. It is damn near a perfect match, if you compare the maps (if you translate the Congressional districts to the Presidential ones) Usually there’s a middle who can be convinced to go against their personal, minimal leaning by a better candidate. In this case, there was no better candidate. It was crook A or crook B. As such, the middle went with their personal leaning. When it comes to ever elected position except the President, no one knows anything about the candidates, so it’s straight-line anyways. So when the Presidential election matches the House election perfectly, it means that no one felt there was a better candidate between the two. Now that could mean that they were both awesome, both middling, or both terrible in equal quantities. I think it’s fair to say that “terrible” is the safe bet. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/125 "2018-08-01T13:45:15Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > OK, I guess we can play this silly game further: They could have influenced an equal number of people to switch sides for both Hillary and Trump in the same precinct and not changed the result. So, no, your statement is not correct. The vote tallies would have been identical with or without influence. Seems infinitesimally unlikely that the enormous Russian campaign to elect Trump actually convinced an equal number of people to vote for Clinton, by some unidentified mechanism, as vote for Trump. Seems likely (certain) that the enormous Russian campaign to influence the election to elect Trump changed the result in favor of Trump. Which is why they bothered to do it in the first place. Which was my original statement. It’s like the lame argument that steroids didn’t actually help Bonds hit more home runs. Really? Then he took a ridiculously huge risk for no reason at all? Despite all of the evidence that he hit a ton more home runs because of the steroids? ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/126 "2018-08-01T13:50:23Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > …Now that could mean that they were both awesome, both middling, or both terrible in equal quantities. I think it’s fair to say that “terrible” is the safe bet. Yep, the morons that voted for trump believe that Clinton is as bad or worse than trump. This just goes to show you how easy it is to fool people that don’t pay attention to facts. ---
**Author:** ![tim-n-va](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim-n-va/32/3001_2.png) [@tim-n-va](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tim-n-va)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/127 "2018-08-01T14:39:44Z")
> [@](#): > > …people who feel that the government has let them down, the economy has let them down, nobody cares about them, nobody worries about what happens to their lives and their futures, and they’re just desperate for change. It doesn’t really even matter where it comes from. They don’t buy everything he says, but he seems to hold out some hope that their lives will be different. They won’t wake up and see their jobs disappear, lose a kid to heroine, feel like they’re in a dead-end. That is why Trump won. The quote is Hilary Clinton, explaining who the non-deplorable half of his support is. Also my opinion is that if the media were trying to help her, the second half of that paragraph would have gotten much more coverage. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/128 "2018-08-01T15:18:38Z")
Donald Trump once put is name on a vitamin business. The way it worked was you sent Donald Trump $139.95 and a vial of your piss, and in exchange he sent you a bottle of vitamins. I don’t know why the man has such an infatuation with pee or what he did with the urine his marks sent him, but that’s a subject for another thread. This man is now president of the United States. There’s a sucker born every minute and Trump found a way to scoop up all of them. Donald Trump is a singularly dishonest businessman and a con artist. New Yorkers have a huge amount of Trump hate because familiarity breeds contempt. His business career has been a string of high profile broken promises and bankruptcies. His building have a reverse cachet among New Yorkers, partly because of the outward Richie Rich style ostentation but also because he cheaps out on the general construction, especially the electric and mechanical systems - I always see these weird forced air HVAC systems in Trump buildings that are more suitable for a suburban Best Western. That’s one reason his buildings are so loaded with foreigners - New Yorkers won’t buy them. But he’s playing a long game - sometimes the first couple of checks from the deposed Nigerian prince actually clear the bank. It’s called a long con. Which is why his first step was to borrow several trillion dollars and throw it at his friends and his base. This improved the financial lot of his supporters a little bit, but mostly he convinced them the economy was better but just telling his supporters that it was better and ballyhooing the typical statistics of a recovering economy into some sort of personal success. Yes, it’s true that people were hurting and feeling that their government wasn’t helping them. That’s the cancer he identified. And his base is buying the snake oil he’s selling as a cancer cure. The divisiveness he’s promoting is simply protection. Because when you’re the deposed Nigerian prince there’s always the chance someone will get to your victims and talk sense into them. So the technique is to turn the tables and convince your marks that the people that are out to talk sense into your victims are the enemy. Then you work on making the law enforcement agencies that are trying to protect people against con artists the enemy as well. Maybe once he’s no longer president, he can go back into the piss vitamin business. If he collects $139.95 from all his supporters he will truly be rich, and he’ll collect enough piss to bathe in for the rest of his life. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/129 "2018-08-01T15:37:41Z")
Funny you should liken Trump to a Nigerian prince. Election night, I posted similar on Facebook: calling his campaign the political equivalent of a 419 scam. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/130 "2018-08-01T17:44:32Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > Let’s stay away from Russia topic, as there is zero evidence of collusion and absolutely no evidence that one vote was tapered with on the voting machines. Yes, because the Kremlin interfered in the Election, because Trump lied to the Rust belt that he could get their factory jobs back (he can’t), because The DNC and Clinton didn’t fight in the right states, and went in over confident, and because Bernie didnt rein in his Bernie-Bros who kept attacking Clinton long after the Nomination was Clintons. But no, we’re not gonna stay away for the Russia topic. Sure, at this moment there is no evidence that Trump himself, _personally_ colluded. However the arrests, convictions and intelligence reports make it perfectly clear that Russia interfered. Russia tried to fix the voting machines, but as far as we know, failed. However, there is scads of evidence about their disinformation campaign vs Clinton. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/131 "2018-08-01T17:47:58Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > T > Trump was arguably pro-gun. Hillary wanted to reinstate the assault weapons ban. So did Trump, and in fact Trump isnt pro gun at all. However, he did put a conservative on the SC, so that is a pro-gun move, in a way. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/132 "2018-08-01T17:57:03Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > So did Trump, and in fact Trump isnt pro gun at all. However, he did put a conservative on the SC, so that is a pro-gun move, in a way. Whether or not Trump was _historically_ pro-gun is immaterial. With only a few exceptions (trade, protecting Social Security and Medicare), since he began his campaign, he’s been either a standard-issue Republican or an extreme-right Republican, depending on the issue. ---
**Author:** ![Lamoral](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lamoral/32/16078_2.png) [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/133 "2018-08-01T17:57:42Z")
I think it’s fair to say that Trump is pro-gun. Whatever his stated positions may have been when he lived the life of a New York business hustler, he has not done or said anything as president to indicate that he is not 100% behind the most pro-gun agenda that someone can have. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/134 "2018-08-01T18:05:00Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Whether or not Trump was _historically_ pro-gun is immaterial. With only a few exceptions (trade, protecting Social Security and Medicare), since he began his campaign, he’s been either a standard-issue Republican or an extreme-right Republican, depending on the issue. > **[Trump takes six positions on gun control: Why that matters](https://www.latimes.com/politics/la-pol-essential-politics-20180302-story.html)** > > One of the paradoxes of Donald Trump’s tenure is that a president who is among the least ideological to have held the job presides over one of the most ideological administrations in memory. \*"Trump’s remark at a televised session with lawmakers on Wednesday that government officials should have the power to seize guns from people who might pose a danger without going to court — “Take the guns first, go through due process second,” he said — directly contradicted that view. Trump didn’t stop there. He urged the assembled members of Congress to pass a “comprehensive” gun control bill, as Christi Parsons wrote, saying that it should expand background checks, limit gun purchases to people 21 or older and perhaps even include a ban on the sale of some assault weapons. He harshly put down Rep. Steve Scalise (R-La.) when he tried to push for an NRA-backed proposal to expand gun owners’ rights to carry concealed weapons from state to state."\* > **[Trump’s Evolving Positions on Gun Issues (Published 2018)](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/12/us/politics/trump-evolving-positions-gun-issues.html)** > > The president has repeatedly shifted his stance on a wide range of gun issues — from purchasing age to background checks to ownership rights — over nearly 20 years. \*"President Trump said on Monday that his administration would leave it to states to set an age limit for buying assault rifles. It was a reversal of weeks of repeated promises to act, and the latest of years of conflicting positions he has taken on a range of gun issues, from background checks to arming teachers. Vague and contradictory positions on background checks Mr. Trump has said he supports requiring background checks for gun purchases, and at various times has even called for strengthening such measures. However, he has also questioned whether background checks work and opposed expanding the system…A full reversal on the assault weapons ban While the ban was in place, Mr. Trump voiced his support. Fifteen years later, he called it a “total failure.” He recently suggested that he was open to at least considering a new ban on assault weapons sales."\* So, not pro gun at all. Flip-flop, wavering and mugwumping. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/135 "2018-08-01T18:14:21Z")
> [@Lamoral](#): > > I think it’s fair to say that Trump is pro-gun. Whatever his stated positions may have been when he lived the life of a New York business hustler, he has not done or said anything as president to indicate that he is not 100% behind the most pro-gun agenda that someone can have. Well, he’s talked about banning printed guns, so now we have a divide forming between being pro-gun and being pro-NRA, since the NRA is largely funded by gun manufacturers and thus has an incentive to oppose printed guns. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/136 "2018-08-01T18:35:29Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Well, he’s talked about banning printed guns, so now we have a divide forming between being pro-gun and being pro-NRA, since the NRA is largely funded by gun manufacturers and thus has an incentive to oppose printed guns. Trump reads polls & the news and reacts before thinking things thru. However, his record, so far, (other than appointing Gorsuch) has been a series of flip flops and nothing solid pro or anti gun. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/137 "2018-08-01T18:37:33Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Trump reads polls & the news and reacts before thinking things thru. However, his record, so far, (other than appointing Gorsuch) has been a series of flip flops and nothing solid pro or anti gun. Indeed, the only thing consistent is the lasting delusion of his supporters that he _has_ a position, and not just on this issue but a number of others. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/138 "2018-08-01T18:46:30Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > This man is now president of the United States. There’s a sucker born every minute and Trump found a way to scoop up all of them. Trump’s genius is realizing a subset of people who desperately want to be fooled, and figuring out what lies they want to hear. His downfall will be that this can’t last forever. I have to admit it’s lasted a lot longer than I expected, though. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/139 "2018-08-01T18:48:15Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > His downfall will be that this can’t last forever. That’s brave talk, my friend. Let’s hope it’s true. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/140 "2018-08-01T23:42:45Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Whether or not Trump was _historically_ pro-gun is immaterial. With only a few exceptions (trade, protecting Social Security and Medicare), since he began his campaign, he’s been either a standard-issue Republican or an extreme-right Republican, depending on the issue. Regardless of _what_ trump is philosophically, he is, operationally the most right-wing president we’ve ever had. ---
**Author:** ![BeepKillBeep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9e8a1a/32.png) [@BeepKillBeep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeepKillBeep)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827/141 "2018-08-01T23:56:27Z")
> [@E-DUB](#): > > Regardless of _what_ trump is philosophically, he is, operationally the most right-wing president we’ve ever had. Boy, is that an understatement. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-left-figured-out-why-trump-won-the-election/818827.md?page=8)