# Has the media misrepresented the incident with the Covington Cathlic kids? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 22, 2019, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210 "2019-01-22T17:23:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/261 "2019-01-23T21:51:36Z")
> [@The Plutonium Kid](#): > > > [@Kimstu](#): > > > > Criticizing someone for promoting a hate ideology is not the same thing as advocating for them to be doxxed or threatened. > > Ah, a classic case of projection, accusing others of hatred when you are yourself full of hate. Again, many conservatives seem oblivious to the fact that **we can all see [Trump’s constant sowing of hatred and insult and lies](https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/01/28/upshot/donald-trump-twitter-insults.html)**. He’s never hidden it. From repeatedly declaring that Obama’s birth certificate is a fraud, to declaring that any negative polls or other unflattering media coverage of him is “fake news” and “witch hunts” by “enemies of the people”, to calling women who criticize him “ugly” and “fat” (and pretty much anybody who criticizes him “crazy” or “failing” or “loser” or “weak” or “nasty” or “dumb” or some combination of the above), to accusing his political opponents of being “crooks” and “criminals”, to declaring (on the basis of no evidence) that a given election is “rigged”, to slandering black ex-convicts (the “Central Park Five”) as guilty well after DNA evidence had exonerated them and the real perpetrator had confessed, to calling developing nations “shitholes”, to advocating for a ban on all US immigration by Muslims, to endorsing bigots like Ray Moore, to publicly repeating spiteful childish nicknames for political opponents such as “Cryin’ Chuck” or “Lyin’ Ted” or “Sleepy Eyes”, to hinting that his political opponents should be taken care of by “the Second Amendment people”, to cheering on supporters who physically assault people, Trump has been indefatigably encouraging unjustified resentment, outrage and prejudice against the people who don’t support him. Criticizing that kind of behavior as promoting a hate ideology, in a way that’s extremely abnormal and inappropriate for the holder of the highest elected office in the land, is not “projection”. I don’t behave the way Trump does, nor do I want to behave like that. If you support that kind of behavior on Trump’s part and ignore or dismiss criticism of it, you are endorsing his hate ideology. And you can’t dodge your responsibility for that by whining that the criticism is just “projection”. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/262 "2019-01-23T21:52:15Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Could you define “sidebar” for the help of everyone focusing on the topic of the thread and not your defense of posting definitions of words? The whole point of this thread is in the title. **Has the media misrepresented the incident with the Covington Cathlic kids**? **Airbeck** doesn’t seem to understand the meaning of a word even when he’s been supplied with the definition. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/263 "2019-01-23T21:52:43Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Could you define “sidebar” for the help of everyone focusing on the topic of the thread and not your defense of posting definitions of words? Related to this request, I’d like an expansion on the term “triviality” as well, preferably across six or seven posts of steadily increasing acrimony. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/264 "2019-01-23T21:56:19Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > How very brave of you. It really doesn’t take a lot of bravery, at least for a non-conservative, to declare that I disagree with a particular statement that happens to go against my principles, even if the person who made it happens to be someone I **do** agree with on a lot of other things. But principled disagreement is getting so rare among conservatives these days that I can see why you’d be unduly impressed by it. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/265 "2019-01-23T21:57:07Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Again, many conservatives seem oblivious to the fact that **we can all see [Trump’s constant sowing of hatred and insult and lies](https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/01/28/upshot/donald-trump-twitter-insults.html)**. (post shortened) People have seen the videos, and they can see who is trying to justify the lame stream media’s attacks on a teenager because he stood on a very wide step while he was being bullied by an old man who was trying to intimidate him. ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/266 "2019-01-23T21:57:54Z")
I went to lunch, had a few work meetings, and then I come back and there are lots of things to comment on. I’m going to close this temporarily while I catch up. [/moderating] ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/267 "2019-01-23T22:13:59Z")
There’s a lot of generalizing left/right etc. It’s not something I want to police but if it becomes a thing to wield as a bludgeon I’m going to say it’s deleterious to actual discussion. Examples: > [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I doubt there are many of our resident leftists willing to admit that. > [@The\_Plutonium\_Kid](#): > > That kind of nastiness is far more typical of left-wingers than right-wingers. > [@The\_Plutonium\_Kid](#): > > Compared to the typical leftie, a rabid wolverine would be the civil one. > [@The\_Plutonium\_Kid](#): > > Bah. If it wasn’t for double standards, lefties would have no standards at all. Actually, it’s mostly **The Plutonium Kid**. I’m giving instruction to you specifically - knock off the overbroad generalizations in this thread. It doesn’t further discussion at all. Then there is the personalization of argument: > [@Airbeck](#): > > And please save the condescension. You are on doorhinge’s side ffs. That combo is not a good look. Try to address the merits, not the posters themselves. If there are tangents that aren’t relevant then it’d be better to ignore them for the sake of keeping discussion more focused. That’s a choice at your discretion, not specific direction from me. * * * I’m reopening this now. [/moderating] ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/268 "2019-01-23T22:15:22Z")
We need a “phew” smiley ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/269 "2019-01-23T22:21:42Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > We need a “phew” smiley I think it’s spelled :eek: :smack: 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/270 "2019-01-23T22:28:40Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Basically the media says a group of cathloic high school boys, some wearing MAGA hats, were taunting and making fun of a Aative American. The school is taking alot of grief over this ([Howard Dean wants the school closed](https://twitter.com/GovHowardDean/status/1086869687609290752)). Indeed the [school did close for a day](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2019/01/22/covington-catholic-high-school-backlash-protests/2642568002/)over security threats. > > Students have even been given death threats. One [reporter was even fired](https://www.thewrap.com/vulture-writer-on-covington-students-i-just-want-these-people-to-die-simple-as-that/) over doing this. A [writer for SNL](https://www.infowars.com/snl-writer-offers-oral-sex-for-anyone-who-punches-maga-kid/) has offered oral sex for anyone who punches the MAGA hat wearing kid. > > However maybe the media has gotten it wrong. [HERE](https://reason.com/blog/2019/01/20/covington-catholic-nathan-phillips-video) is one story where they tell the other side of the story. > > Supposedly their were these group of African activists called Black Hebrews preaching at the same time a schoolgroup of Catholic youth who were attending a nearby right to life rally. Their was also some native american activists in the same area. One of the NA activists decided to walk into the group of youth beating his drum. Most just stepped aside and let him pass except one youth wearing a MAGA hat who just stood there smiling while he beat the drum in his face. > > [HERE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t3EC1_gcr34&feature=youtu.be) is the full video of the entire incident. Warning, its very long. Notice though that at 00:45 a NA activist asks the man to quiet down. Later he Black Hebrews hurl several insults at the youth and many others. > > I think the media should admit they got it wrong and the catholic boys did nothing wrong. They should also show some admiration for the MAGA wearing youth who kept his cool and was not intimidated by the guy beating the drum in his face. > > Should the media retract its story? The families of the youth [have threatened a lawsuit](https://pjmedia.com/trending/lawyer-for-covington-catholic-hs-families-threatens-lawsuits-against-media-unless-they-retract-false-stories/). Couldnt they just admit there were more sides to the story? What IS the other side of the story? [HERE](http://www.wave3.com/2019/01/21/covington-catholic-student-incident-indigenous-peoples-march-releases-statement/) is a statement from the student.[HERE](https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=covington+cathloic+incident&view=detail&mid=980BA49FB95C6245CB2A980BA49FB95C6245CB2A&FORM=VIRE)is a video showing the statement from the NA drummer. > > One media outlet has admitted ["Their are new videos and even more interpretations](https://www.wcpo.com/news/local-news/kenton-county/covington/covington-catholic-incident-in-washington-yields-many-videos-even-more-interpretations)". > Fox news is reporting that the[media did show a bias](https://news.yahoo.com/did-media-misrepresent-covington-catholic-111646893.html). > You have to admit its not unusual for a media outlet to run a story before learning all the facts. Has it truly got this one wrong? Should they run an apology? Yes, the lazy lame stream media got this one wrong. First, they chose to believe a lot of horseshit that was being posted on various twitter feeds. 2nd, they chose not to verify the information they chose to release under their own name. 3rd, they chose to be _first_ rather than _correct_ when they chose to repeat these unverified rantings. 4th, they chose to pile on the attacks directed at the teenager, his family, his friends, and his school. What is amazing is the numbers of people who are justifying the piss poor reporting, and bullying, that has taken place over the last few days. Unfortunately, haters gotta be haters. It worse when the haters hide behind the label of news reporting. ---
**Author:** ![nate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nate/32/13085_2.png) [@nate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nate)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/271 "2019-01-23T22:31:41Z")
> [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > Is he not within say 18 inches of Sandmann in the initial video that started it all? Yes, but that still doesn’t explain how they came to be so close, right? I mean, me filling in the blanks in this story has the Native American walking up to the group of kids, banging the drum. Then the MAGA hat wearing kid with the smirk walks up to him as close a possible and stands there and stares. I thought this was the narrative? I’m asking if this is true. I haven’t seen a video of that part of the situation. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/272 "2019-01-23T22:36:07Z")
For **Ravenman** ’s beenfit, what follows is an example of a sidebar. I’ll see if I can arrange to have it stretch over six or seven acrimonious posts for **Bryan Eker** ’s sake: > [@Kimstu](#): > > It really doesn’t take a lot of bravery, at least for a non-conservative, to declare that I disagree with a particular statement that happens to go against my principles, even if the person who made it happens to be someone I **do** agree with on a lot of other things. > > But principled disagreement is getting so rare among conservatives these days that I can see why you’d be unduly impressed by it. I’m trying to heed **Bone** ’s guidance about avoiding broad-brush attacks on conservatives or liberals in what follows: On the last page, you were full of righteous anger. You complained about “constant social-media smears” “inflammatory accusations” and the “taint of hateful bigotry”. Then someone whom you often agree with came along and said ‘The whole “screaming racist insults” thing doesn’t bother me’ and the response you managed to muster was “I do not endorse it”. That seemed tepid, to the point of being comical when contrasted with your earlier fiery posts denouncing the “taint of hateful bigotry”. But, to your credit, a tepid non-endorsement is better than silent acquiescence, so some small amount of kudos are probably in order. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/273 "2019-01-23T22:39:17Z")
Oh, I don’t care about sidebars. I made my interests clear, I thought. ---
**Author:** ![BeepKillBeep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9e8a1a/32.png) [@BeepKillBeep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeepKillBeep)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/274 "2019-01-23T22:39:42Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > It worse when the haters hide behind the label of news reporting. I agree, Fox News is awful, but there’s a whole other thread for that. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/275 "2019-01-23T22:48:17Z")
> [@nate](#): > > Yes, but that still doesn’t explain how they came to be so close, right? I mean, me filling in the blanks in this story has the Native American walking up to the group of kids, banging the drum. Then the MAGA hat wearing kid with the smirk walks up to him as close a possible and stands there and stares. I thought this was the narrative? I’m asking if this is true. I haven’t seen a video of that part of the situation. No, that’s not true, at least AFAICT. The MAGA hat-wearing kid did not “walk up to him”. There’s a link to a very long video showing the whole incident in the OP. Nathan Phillips approaches the group of students at around 1:12 in that video. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/276 "2019-01-23T22:52:57Z")
Freedom of speech does not mean you cannot be criticized. The only reason freedom of speech works is that you can be criticized. Then, ideally the best argument wins. These kids can support the President. They can also be criticized for supporting said president. That is freedom of speech. These kids can show what support for this particular president means, by being full on bigots on display. And we can criticize them for being bigots. That is also freedom of speech. You even have the freedom of speech to tell us that we are wrong. However, if you use “freedom of speech” as the reason why we are wrong, then you will be criticized. You haven’t made an argument. You’ve just misused “freedom of speech” to mean “freedom from rebuttal.” And, before you try it, no, I don’t support death threats. At no point did I say death threats were okay. But someone mistreating you doesn’t make you right. It doesn’t turn you into the good guy if you weren’t good in the first place. Sympathy is about that one aspect, not about the whole thing. I mean, I try my best to have sympathy for everyone, even people I hate. It’s just sympathy that their life led them to believe such horrible things. There is no reason for sympathy to be a get-out-of-jail-free card. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/277 "2019-01-23T22:54:06Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > You complained about “constant social-media smears” “inflammatory accusations” and the “taint of hateful bigotry”. Yes, especially as coming from the President of the United States. > [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Then someone whom you often agree with came along and said ‘The whole “screaming racist insults” thing doesn’t bother me’ and the response you managed to muster was “I do not endorse it”. Well, I think it’s a bit pearl-clutchy for conservatives to complain because some racist insults screamed by a few members of a universally despised loony-fringe hate group with zero political power or standing aren’t being taken as seriously, or denounced as stridently, as the constant slanderous shit-stirring and bigotry routinely dispensed by the President of the United States and embraced by his millions of supporters. Sure, racist insults in whatever context are definitely bad, and I disagree with **begbert2** ’s view that it’s ever acceptable not to be “bothered” by them at all. But I also acknowledge that as destructive social phenomena go, some racist insults from asshole “Black Israelites” at a protest are much more minor than Trump’s MAGA-schtick hate ideology. If that makes me seem like a hypocrite in your view, oh well. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/278 "2019-01-23T22:57:21Z")
> [@The\_Plutonium\_Kid](#): > > A much better example would be that herd of mad cows wearing pink knit caps at the Women’s March. Or an even better one would be the Black Hebrew Israelites who, completely unprovoked, shouted slurs such as “faggot” and “incest baby” at the students. > > Give us a goddam break. Your comparison is absurd, and you know it. My point is rather mundane and pedestrian, a symbol can change a hat, or a t-shirt, into a statement. By offering a “much better example” you apparently concur. If my example is absurd, your improvement is…well, what, perzackly? ---
**Author:** ![sisu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@sisu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sisu)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/279 "2019-01-23T22:57:23Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Like any other bigoted hate symbol, MAGA gear should be regarded with wariness rather than trivialized or ignored. wow I can’t believe the ladder of assumption that people climb when they see a MAGA hat. On observation from Australia it seems that if identify as right then you are a neo nazi. From a distance I see the MAGA hat as a natural and to be expected back lash against the far left that seems to dominate the university campuses (yes in Australia too) that is at it’s heart anti-capitalism, Marxist, man hating etc. So MAGA hats are on par with pussy hats. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2019, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210/280 "2019-01-23T23:02:48Z")
> [@sisu](#): > > From a distance I see the MAGA hat as a natural and to be expected back lash against the **far left** that seems to dominate the university campuses (yes in Australia too) that is at it’s heart **anti-capitalism, Marxist, man hating** etc. :dubious: Emphasis added. I think your view of the MAGA hat is perhaps being determined not so much by your distance as by your slant. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-the-media-misrepresented-the-incident-with-the-covington-cathlic-kids/828210.md?page=15)