# Has TSA screening at US airports stopped a single terroristic plot since its establishment? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 8, 2019, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429 "2019-01-08T21:08:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2019, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/61 "2019-01-10T15:39:44Z")
> [@UltraVires](#): > > But pre-TSA, you empty your pockets in the little change thing, run your bag through the x ray machine, step through the metal detector and off you go. > > The lines are not long because of too many people, but because of people having to take off shoes, belt, put laptop in separate bin, listen to some sovereign citizen argue with the TSA agent that the hatchet in his carry on is a tool of his trade and bring up the TSA website to incorrectly argue that it is permitted, etc. Big deal. That’s making you sound like the guy who is chasing the young 'uns off your lawn. I recall when I could sit at home at night and choose from three reasonably decent television programs at 8 pm, rather than having to slog through hundreds of really poor television choices, only to decide that re-watching a movie will probably be more fun, if only I can remember which of my streaming services is showing it. And if you are finding it annoying to stand in line for endless hours, may I suggest that you simply pony up for TSA Pre-check, which is ridiculously quick in most airports. The main issue here is whether or not TSA screening has any significant value in reducing/removing the threat of air terror (of ANY kind, not just hijackings; after all, a bomb in an airplane is not a hijacking). It is possible that the hyped-up screening is preventing such attacks; it is also possible that it is not preventing anything, either because no one is trying anything, nor would they try anything, or because other methods are weeding them out first. But given the laundry list of confiscated items that could do real damage if in the wrong hands, I’m comfortable with continuation of the screening pretty much as-is, and that’s despite the fact that I tend to agree that it’s more for “show” than for actual “effect”. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2019, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/62 "2019-01-10T16:27:40Z")
Those deprecating the TSA ignore the many bottles of human breast milk for babies which have been turned away. Milk can be mixed with cyanide, ricin and other deadly poisons. > [@JB99](#): > > Just FYI, in 2017 a record-setting 3,957, firearms were discovered in carry-on bags at checkpoints across the country, averaging 76.1 firearms per week. Approximately 84 percent were loaded. Another 198 items (mostly knives and tasers) were found after being deliberately concealed in a hidden pocket or deceptive packaging. Wow! This may tell us little about TSA or terrorism, but it sure reminds us about American Exceptionalism — what makes the Land of the Brave so special. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2019, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/63 "2019-01-10T16:33:20Z")
> [@DSYoungEsq](#): > > Big deal. That’s making you sound like the guy who is chasing the young 'uns off your lawn. I recall when I could sit at home at night and choose from three reasonably decent television programs at 8 pm, rather than having to slog through hundreds of really poor television choices, only to decide that re-watching a movie will probably be more fun, if only I can remember which of my streaming services is showing it. And if you are finding it annoying to stand in line for endless hours, may I suggest that you simply pony up for TSA Pre-check, which is ridiculously quick in most airports. > > The main issue here is whether or not TSA screening has any significant value in reducing/removing the threat of air terror (of ANY kind, not just hijackings; after all, a bomb in an airplane is not a hijacking). It is possible that the hyped-up screening is preventing such attacks; it is also possible that it is not preventing anything, either because no one is trying anything, nor would they try anything, or because other methods are weeding them out first. But given the laundry list of confiscated items that could do real damage if in the wrong hands, I’m comfortable with continuation of the screening pretty much as-is, and that’s despite the fact that I tend to agree that it’s more for “show” than for actual “effect”. First, I was responding to the suggestion that allowing friends to go to the gate with you would make the long lines even longer. Second, as I said, if these procedures are keeping X number of people from being killed each year, then it may very well be worth it. I’m just curious what the new advanced screening would capture that the previous system didn’t catch. I mean, if I run my bag through an X ray device and I go through a metal detector, that should catch any guns, knives, or bombs. ---
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2019, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/64 "2019-01-10T16:46:34Z")
Wait, pouring human breast milk down the drain is a _good_ thing now? What the hell would a terrorist do with ricin-laced human breast milk? Force people to drink it? ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2019, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/65 "2019-01-10T18:41:29Z")
> [@purplehorseshoe](#): > > Wait, pouring human breast milk down the drain is a _good_ thing now? What the hell would a terrorist do with ricin-laced human breast milk? Force people to drink it? [This woman had been harassed for carrying milk the week before and had explained TSA rules about milk to the TSA handlers. The next week they were ready for the uppity bitch](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UGZsrjpLm7k), leaving her in a detention cell at the checkpoint long enough to ensure she missed her flight. Google gives other hits. [TSA tossed this woman’s milk and later apologized for not following their own procedures, but the woman was upset enough to contact a news station.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rw4-ujNBpTc) It’s unclear to me whether ricin, or something else, was TSA’s concern. Many government scientists are on furlough right now, but these TSA oafs are “essential.” ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2019, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/66 "2019-01-10T19:07:38Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > [This woman had been harassed for carrying milk the week before and had explained TSA rules about milk to the TSA handlers. The next week they were ready for the uppity bitch](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UGZsrjpLm7k), leaving her in a detention cell at the checkpoint long enough to ensure she missed her flight. > > Google gives other hits. [TSA tossed this woman’s milk and later apologized for not following their own procedures, but the woman was upset enough to contact a news station.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rw4-ujNBpTc) It’s unclear to me whether ricin, or something else, was TSA’s concern. Maybe you have some cites that arent Youtube videos? ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2019, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/67 "2019-01-10T19:55:09Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > [List of aircraft hijackings - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_aircraft_hijackings) > > There were quite a few U.S. hijackings during that period – more than I would have guessed. There were lots of Cuban hijackings around 1974. Notice that there weren’t that many US hijackings after the metal detectors got put in, and many of them were things like fake bombs. One was an airline employee who did not get screened IIRC. Things were pretty loose before then. In 1970 I smuggled a hamster onto the plane in my camera case. Today I could call it a support hamster. (No, not really - I’m aware of the restrictions.) ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2019, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/68 "2019-01-10T19:59:35Z")
> [@DSYoungEsq](#): > > But given the laundry list of confiscated items that could do real damage if in the wrong hands, I’m comfortable with continuation of the screening pretty much as-is, and that’s despite the fact that I tend to agree that it’s more for “show” than for actual “effect”. Show is a valid policing method. Mounted police at rallies or near crowds are more for show than anything else, and it seems to work. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2019, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/69 "2019-01-10T20:18:36Z")
Sorry for my IMHO statement, but the terrorists it stops are those who decided not to even try. And it is utterly impossible to know how many of those there have been. One thing for sure. After the old flight inspections started, people stopped hijacking flights to Cuba. And even those fairly crude inspections should not have allowed 19 people with boxcutters on four different flights. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2019, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/70 "2019-01-10T20:28:17Z")
> [@UltraVires](#): > > …but flying is just no longer fun anymore. I don’t like having to waste two hours of my life by getting to the airport so damned early. My daughter will never get the experience of seeing her friend off at the gate, or having a beer or coffee with her friend at the gate before her flight. News Flash. Flying stopped being fun sometime in the 1970’s, well before 9/11. It happened at about the time air travel became affordable for the average person on a regular basis and planes turned into Greyhound buses with wings, only way smaller and way less comfortable. And most of the airports I am familiar with started restricting access to the gate area to passengers only at around that time, again well before 9/11. In some of them it was a congestion issue more than security — as more people started flying everywhere there were more flights and more people crowded into the same space. On my last flight out of LaGuardia the congestion was nightmarish, the passengers that were boarding were spilling out of the boarding area into the way too narrow central aisle, making it difficult for arriving passengers to navigate their way out of the gate area. In terms of your daughters life experiences, I can promise both of you that the experience of having a beer or coffee with a friend in the bar just outside of airport security is virtually identical to that of having a beverage at the bar in the gate area. So please don’t lose sleep thinking that her life will be bereft of enrichment because she has been denied this experience. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2019, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/71 "2019-01-10T20:29:48Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > Sorry for my IMHO statement, but the terrorists it stops are those who decided not to even try. And it is utterly impossible to know how many of those there have been. That reminds me of the story of the old mountain man who drank moonshine every morning and told his wife that it was his “medicine.” His wife remarks that she has never seen him sick and he replies that it just shows what good medicine it is. 🙂 You may be right, but at the cost of billions of dollars per year and untold freedoms, we should require _something_ more than just that statement as that statement could be made about any utterly worthless program as well. It would be like the city paying me $1 million per year to keep heroin off of my street. Then when the heroin level is low, medium, or even high on my street, I could argue that things would have been much, much worse without my skill. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2019, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/72 "2019-01-10T21:02:07Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Maybe you have some cites that arent Youtube videos? Turn the audio speed up to 2X and close your eyes so you don’t have to see the pictures. HTH. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2019, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/73 "2019-01-10T21:09:47Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Turn the audio speed up to 2X and close your eyes so you don’t have to see the pictures. > > HTH. Or just maybe you could come up with some valid, checkable, quotable cites? ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2019, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/74 "2019-01-10T22:15:53Z")
> [@UltraVires](#): > > … > So, I think it reasonable to look back almost twenty years later and ask if these billions of dollars are worth it. Not only the billions of dollars, but flying is just no longer fun anymore. I don’t like having to waste two hours of my life by getting to the airport so damned early. My daughter will never get the experience of seeing her friend off at the gate, or having a beer or coffee with her friend at the gate before her flight. > > Of course, these things are worth giving up if it means that people will be getting killed, but I am not convinced that is the case. This > [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > News Flash. Flying stopped being fun sometime in the 1970’s, well before 9/11. It happened at about the time air travel became affordable for the average person on a regular basis and planes turned into Greyhound buses with wings, only way smaller and way less comfortable. > > And most of the airports I am familiar with started restricting access to the gate area to passengers only at around that time, again well before 9/11. In some of them it was a congestion issue more than security — as more people started flying everywhere there were more flights and more people crowded into the same space. On my last flight out of LaGuardia the congestion was nightmarish, the passengers that were boarding were spilling out of the boarding area into the way too narrow central aisle, making it difficult for arriving passengers to navigate their way out of the gate area. > > In terms of your daughters life experiences, I can promise both of you that the experience of having a beer or coffee with a friend in the bar just outside of airport security is virtually identical to that of having a beverage at the bar in the gate area. So please don’t lose sleep thinking that her life will be bereft of enrichment because she has been denied this experience. Yeah, I wasn’t thinking so much that “flying should be fun”, more that "flying shouldn’t be miserable and dehumanizing. Having a beer outside security is nothing like having a beer inside security, because you have the nagging worry of having to get through security, and not being certain you will be able to catch your plane. I once waited a very long time behind a woman with a “cheese knife”, who quite reasonably point out that it wasn’t sharp enough to cut flesh, but unreasonably thought that somehow the security guy would let something with “knife” in its name through security. Another time the TSA screener decided to spend 20 minutes examining my nail clipper. (Which was legal at the time, and he did eventually let it through, despite it having a file attached that, I dunno, might have scratched someone?) It’s not a huge deal for a fully competent adult that you can’t bring friends with you to the gate, but it IS a huge deal for people like my daughter, who has an anxiety disorder and isn’t very good at dealing with the world. Getting her to college would have been a hell of a lot easier if we could have taken her to her gate, and not dropped her off outside security. And every one of those confiscated knives represents a financial loss to the person who accidentally brought it with them. My mother has had TSA steal about 4 small pocketknives, because she always carries one and forgets she has it. So she’s had to buy new ones. Just add up the time we all spend taking off our shoes and putting them on again. What’s the economic value of that? Is it worth is? I sincerely doubt it. ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2019, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/75 "2019-01-10T22:30:08Z")
> [@DSYoungEsq](#): > > Big deal. That’s making you sound like the guy who is chasing the young 'uns off your lawn. I recall when I could sit at home at night and choose from three reasonably decent television programs at 8 pm, rather than having to slog through hundreds of really poor television choices, only to decide that re-watching a movie will probably be more fun, if only I can remember which of my streaming services is showing it. And if you are finding it annoying to stand in line for endless hours, may I suggest that you simply pony up for TSA Pre-check, which is ridiculously quick in most airports. > > T_he main issue here is whether or not TSA screening has any significant value in reducing/removing the threat of air terror (of ANY kind, not just hijackings; after all, a bomb in an airplane is not a hijacking)._ It is possible that the hyped-up screening is preventing such attacks; it is also possible that it is not preventing anything, either because no one is trying anything, nor would they try anything, or because other methods are weeding them out first. But given the laundry list of confiscated items that could do real damage if in the wrong hands, I’m comfortable with continuation of the screening pretty much as-is, and that’s despite the fact that I tend to agree that it’s more for “show” than for actual “effect”. (My bolding.) I’d say it depends on what you’d call “air terror”. The TSA may not be very good at stopping terrorist plots, for the various reasons listed in this thread; I’d say what they’re best at is ensuring that when the drunken businessman in 32A finally loses his shit over the drunken tourist sitting in 32B who keeps hogging the damn armrest, their subsequent fistfight isn’t a knife fight. Whether or not their efforts are worth the billions we spend on them, I cannot say. But it seems to me their principle value (as opposed to their stated mission) lies in hindering non-terroristic violence. ---
**Author:** ![pullin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c57346/32.png) [@pullin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pullin)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2019, 10:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/76 "2019-01-11T10:52:20Z")
Is it true that the additional screening is causing _more_ deaths due to increased ground travel (and auto accidents)? [This](https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2013/09/excess_automobi.html) security blogger claims so, but I don’t know enough about it to be certain. Anecdotally, I’ve become so disillusioned with air travel that I take my own vehicle unless absolutely forced by job requirements and time. It seems likely a lot more are doing this. ---
**Author:** ![psychonaut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/psychonaut/32/4655_2.png) [@psychonaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/psychonaut)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2019, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/77 "2019-01-11T12:03:43Z")
> [@TSBG](#): > > So, plane-attacking terrorists got very lucky–_once_. As a result we all take off our shoes. Do they still make you do this in American airports? I don’t recall ever having had to do this in European airports, except in Moscow (and even then, not in the last five years). ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2019, 12:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/78 "2019-01-11T12:05:26Z")
> [@pullin](#): > > Is it true that the additional screening is causing _more_ deaths due to increased ground travel (and auto accidents)? [This](https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2013/09/excess_automobi.html) security blogger claims so, but I don’t know enough about it to be certain. It’s certainly _possible_. The rationale for allowing infants to be carried as unrestrained projectiles is that, if you make them travel in seats, more families will travel by car which is even less safe for the baby (never mind everyone else). But you’d have to tease out how much of the increased lines etc. are due to the increased screenings as opposed to ~15 million additional passengers each year squeezing into airports that are mostly the same size as they were in 2001. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2019, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/79 "2019-01-11T12:11:24Z")
> [@Lord\_Feldon](#): > > But you’d have to tease out how much of the increased lines etc. are due to the increased screenings as opposed to ~15 million additional passengers each year squeezing into airports that are mostly the same size as they were in 2001. I read the figure wrong, it’s actually ~15 million more passengers a _month_. ---
**Author:** ![eburacum45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eburacum45/32/8690_2.png) [@eburacum45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eburacum45)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2019, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429/80 "2019-01-11T14:13:17Z")
Global air travel is increasing at 6% per year, compared to global population growth, which is 1.07% and decreasing. More people are travelling and fewer people are dying in planes. Someone is doing something right. > **[Growth of global air traffic passenger demand 2006-2022 | Statista](https://www.statista.com/statistics/193533/growth-of-global-air-traffic-passenger-demand/)** > > This statistic represents the annual growth in global air traffic passenger demand between 2006 and 2022. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/has-tsa-screening-at-us-airports-stopped-a-single-terroristic-plot-since-its-establishment/827429.md?page=5)