# Hastur, what do you have against James Randi? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 26, 2001, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402 "2001-04-26T14:19:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![vanilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f19dbf/32.png) [@vanilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vanilla)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2001, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/41 "2001-04-27T13:32:59Z")
arrogant pig? Show us where he said anything wrong, that is, proven wrong. tap tap tap Lets see Your evidence. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2001, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/42 "2001-04-27T13:39:11Z")
Hastur: If you make claims that you can do real magic, you have to expect that they will be investigated. It makes no sense to storm off in a huff because SDMB’ers won’t take your word for it. That’s the nature of this board. You made an open challenge for Czarcasm to come to Oregon to watch you do real magic. He accepted, you backed off. Surely, you can see why people may not take your claims seriously. In addition, your comment > [@](#): > > All I see for the most part are armchair sceptics without any occult study taking potshots, being self-congratulatory, and acting as insular as any fraternity I have ever seen. You have no idea what is out there, and with attitudes such as the ones you have been displaying collectively, I doubt you will see it in this life time or any other is wholly unwarranted. Most skeptics are well-educated in the occult and paranormal, simply because they have spent so much time investigating those areas. Skeptics are not out to get you; they just want to see evidence, not mere assertions. To quote James Randi, " I am not making the claim; it is the believers who make the claim. I only challenge them to prove their claim." ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2001, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/43 "2001-04-27T13:42:27Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Hastur \* > **He’s a pompous jerk. Read his website. The man is an arrogant pig who is as smug in his lack of belief as Czarcasm and jab1 were in the initial BBQ Pit thread.** I like Randi. He does seem a bit arrogant and pompous at times, but it’s all part of his style. And he is not often wrong, so you can afford to give the guy some leeway. So…how is he “spiritually dead” again? > [@](#): > > **Don’t think that I will further participate in this thread or any other on these topics.** Well, if you won’t at least try to back up your statement, then get the hell off of this Board. Running away and hiding after making a drive-by comment like that is really low. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2001, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/44 "2001-04-27T14:12:56Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Hastur \* > > \*\*He’s a pompous jerk. Read his website. The man is an arrogant pig who is as smug in his lack of belief as Czarcasm and jab1 were in the initial BBQ Pit thread. > > \*\* Yes, but he’s virtually always correct. You, on the other hand, are a pompous jerk who can’t back up his shit. The skeptic is the one who is open minded. We say, “I will believe anything so long as you can prove it to me. All I want is evidence and, by the way, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.” You say, “It’s the truth and I don’t have to prove a thing. You’re just an uptight, ignorant jerk. Now that I have to prove myself, I’m going to pick up my toys and leave.” Randi does some great things. He goes to high schools and colleges and teaches critical thinking. He never belittles believers in horse shit such as “magick” and astrology. One thing that he does which I love is he will give a talk to students about astrology in a very straight up manner. He’ll then ask each student to give him their name and birthdate. He comes back the next week and gives each student an envelope with their horoscope. He askes each of them to read it and rate its accuracy. Generally the horoscopes are rated as very accurate. The punch line is that everyone is given the identical horoscope. It’s a great learning tool. Haj ---
**Author:** ![vanilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f19dbf/32.png) [@vanilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vanilla)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2001, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/45 "2001-04-27T14:29:06Z")
AK! Thanks for ruining it now! ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2001, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/46 "2001-04-27T15:13:07Z")
Hastur, This question wasn’t part of an “intellectual witch hunt” and I wasn’t attacking you. I’ve read his website. What does he say that you think makes him a pompous jerk or an arrogant pig? I asked the question because I’m honestly curious as to what you think, and wanted to give you a place to air your views, but, frankly, if you’re going to come in here, not answer my question, and be arrogant and dismissive to somebody who wasn’t arguing with you, then, frankly, I don’t see what more I can do. Don’t you have the simplest notions of decency and politeness? Have you no shame? ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2001, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/47 "2001-04-27T17:14:08Z")
> [@](#): > > You have no idea what is out there, and with attitudes such as the ones you have been displaying collectively, I doubt you will see it in this life time or any other. Christians, yes. Moslems, yes. But I’ve never had a pagan tell me I was going to hell before. Kewl. **Hastur** , may the light of the Goddess shine upon you in your pain. Blessed be. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Man\_Who](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c2a13f/32.png) [@The\_Man\_Who](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Man_Who)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2001, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/48 "2001-04-27T18:12:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by The Man Who \* > Nevertheless, anyone who professes to be Christian should read Flim-Flam at least once (I’ve read it three times). Faithfulness does not equal humiliating gullibility. > \*\* Better still, read the book I intended to recommend, The Faith Healers. -Myron ---
**Author:** ![jane\_says](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/47e85d/32.png) [@jane\_says](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jane_says)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2001, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/49 "2001-04-28T00:51:57Z")
Ooh, ooh! Someone actually asked to see my prized email, rather than having me thrust it upon them! Ogre, check your inbox. ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2001, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/50 "2001-04-28T03:48:28Z")
I’ve read his work over the years, and recently read through his website. My perspective does not have to be shared, but it is MY perspective. My comments on the mob mentality had nothing to do with your OP and EVERYTHING to do with the snotty, and intensely demeaning remarks made by others particpating in this thread. Anthracite: If you were being focused on by a snotty mob, I would think you’d just want to walk. I’ve seen little of any willingness to listen or discuss, and a helluva lot of cheap pot shots at my expense. John Corrado: > [@](#): > > Cry me a freaking river, Hastur. > > In the first place, I have yet to see _anyone_ upon this board so quick to over-react and respond to a simple statement with Hellfire And Damnation than you. You have a fuse so short as to be registered in atomic lengths, and a temperment so nasty as to give Medusa chills. So feel free to say “all things in moderation”; such is a damned hypocritical attitude to come from you. That is crap. I ignore a good percentage of threads because they annoy me, and the OP is ludicrous. I take on what I do for a reason, and unlike the lot of you, do it on my own without a mob to back me. I think there is a production of Frankenstein that is missing some torch bearing villagers, you might want to rejoin them. > [@](#): > > From the thread in question: > “The minute you can get yourself to Oregon, I will be most happy to show you magick.” > > Huh. How many people have responded so far with their statement that they’d be willing to get themselves to Oregon so that you could show them > ch? Czarcasm, obfusciatrist, andros, maybe more since I last looked. > > Oh, but Czarcasm was too nasty to you. Hurt your feelings. Caused little witchy-poo to become upset with the balance of nature and the Great Earth Spirit that resides within us all. So now you’ve declared that you’re not gonna show us anything. Why would I want any of you in my home, or my temple, with the hostile way you are collectively acting? Witchy poo? FUCK YOU. Get a life you pretentious, patronizing jerk. > [@](#): > > Even though if you managed to convince any of them that what you do is indeed some unnatural force that any could tap, you likely could convert them all into True Belief. At the very least, you would show them the error of their ways and help them along a better path. But nope; since one of > them was a bit nasty, none of them get to see the Truth of the Universe. Nice way to put words in my mouth that I NEVER SAID. I am not out to convert anyone, thank you very much. You have a chip on your shoulder and are manufacturing things I never said and don’t believe in. > [@](#): > > Excuse me while I assume that you’ve been bluffing all along. I mean, if you actually could do something so powerful, wouldn’t you want to share it, if only to show others your power? If you actually found some insight into the nature of the universe, wouldn’t you want to pass it along so that other seekers might find a better path? It’s not my desire to become a shepherd for others. I have my own way to find as everyone else does. I also have no need to show off, and don’t want to do parlor tricks to build my ego as you seem to by ad hominem and baseless attacks on character. > [@](#): > > Not you, though; one snide person spoils the entire pot of posters and lurkers who might be better off knowing that which you do. Either, sir, you are one of the most selfish beings in the existence of the planet, or you _don’t_ have any better knowledge of the truths of the universe, and are scared to death of such being exposed both to the boards and to _yourself_. Again, it is not my job to enlighten the world. And nice attempt at a guilt trip. I’ve not seen manipulation so heavy handed as yours since Mama Rose in Gypsy. Exposed? I don’t think so. Disgusted with your behavior: you bet. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2001, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/51 "2001-04-28T04:58:29Z")
I do believe that his last statement contained both the “Doubting Thomas” _and_ the “I don’t have to prove anything to _you_!” excuses. ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2001, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/52 "2001-04-28T05:23:46Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Czarcasm \* > \*\*I do believe that his last statement contained both the “Doubting Thomas” _and_ the “I don’t have to prove anything to _you_!” excuses. \*\* I do believe not only are you beating a dead horse, but you’ve tried to replace the corpse so the coroner will come up with a different conclusion than what happened. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2001, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/53 "2001-04-28T05:32:02Z")
BTW, is that claim that you can perform magic still open? If we can find someone that you approve of, I’m sure arrangements can be made to get them to your place. On the same subject, are there any _other_ magic spells you can perform that you don’t have to show us? ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2001, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/54 "2001-04-28T05:35:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Czarcasm \* > \*\*On the same subject, are there any _other_ magic spells you can perform that you don’t have to show us? \*\* The old disappearing trick might be a good one… ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2001, 5:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/55 "2001-04-28T05:36:38Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by woodstockbirdybird \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > \*Originally posted by Czarcasm \* > > \*\*On the same subject, are there any _other_ magic spells you can perform that you don’t have to show us? \*\* > > The old disappearing trick might be a good one… \*\* You first. ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2001, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/56 "2001-04-28T05:38:41Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Czarcasm \* > \*\*BTW, is that claim that you can perform magic still open? If we can find someone that you approve of, I’m sure arrangements can be made to get them to your place. On the same subject, are there any _other_ magic spells you can perform that you don’t have to show us? \*\* How nice. Now you’re ignoring what was said to attempt to reassert yourself so you don’t have to answer for it. And before any smarmy bastard says some variant of ‘you should talk,’ I have explained myself fully. Ironically, Scylla was the most polite and actually seemed to want to learn someone else’s perspective, rather than attempt to be cute or superior. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2001, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/57 "2001-04-28T05:47:21Z")
You made the claim that you could perform magic. If that statement is true, say so. If that statement is false, say so. Until you do one or the other, as far as I’m concerned anything else you say should be taken with a large grain of salt. Yeah, I know you don’t care what I think about you, because it’s much easier to surround yourself with “true believers” who never question what you say because 1. They don’t want to hurt your feelings and, 2. They depend on _your_ unquestioning support for their fantastic claims. Would you like to either prove or retract your claim now? ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2001, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/58 "2001-04-28T05:55:22Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Hastur \* > \*\* > > You first. \*\* Well, if I had half the board attacking _me_ I probably would disappear, and maybe try to find an online community more in touch with my values and beliefs. Or at least re-evaluate my posts and try to understand what it was I was saying that was causing such a backlash. But then I’m not much of a masochist. ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2001, 5:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/59 "2001-04-28T05:56:05Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Czarcasm \* > \*\*You made the claim that you could perform magic. > If that statement is true, say so. > If that statement is false, say so. > > Until you do one or the other, as far as I’m concerned anything else you say should be taken with a large grain of salt. Yeah, I know you don’t care what I think about you, because it’s much easier to surround yourself with “true believers” who never question what you say because > > 1. They don’t want to hurt your feelings and, > 2. They depend on _your_ unquestioning support for their fantastic claims. > > Would you like to either prove or retract your claim now? \*\* Wow. Now you engage in insulting my friends. What a wonderful way to compel someone to do something you want. My friends do not depend on me for their ‘claims.’ My friends can stand on their own two feet, just as I do. And I’m quite sure you’ll have something smarmy to say in response to that. I not only take what you say with a grain of salt, I throw some over my shoulder in case you are there. The statement is true. You want proof? Go to someone else and be a skosh more polite and I’m quite sure they will be happy to give you a free home demonstration. This still, by the way, does not answer what you were asked before, which does not surprise me in the slightest. You rarely, if ever address what was said before, unless you are taking things out of context and misconstruing them, or like your compatriot, John Corrado, claiming I said things I did not. The only egocentric superiority and smugness I have seen in this thread comes from the lot of you(minus a few exceptions). ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2001, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402/60 "2001-04-28T05:58:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by woodstockbirdybird \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > \*Originally posted by Hastur \* > > \*\* > > > > You first. \*\* > > Well, if I had half the board attacking _me_ I probably would disappear, and maybe try to find an online community more in touch with my values and beliefs. Or at least re-evaluate my posts and try to understand what it was I was saying that was causing such a backlash. But then I’m not much of a masochist. \*\* Barring this, and some of the homophoboc posters of the board, I have no reason to leave. There are generally fascinating discussions on here. Leaving a thread is not reason to leave a board. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hastur-what-do-you-have-against-james-randi/63402.md?page=4)