# Hate speech and the SDMB
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236
**Category:** The BBQ Pit
**Created:** [October 8, 2003, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236 "2003-10-08T05:41:59Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 6
### Author:  [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)
#### Post date: [October 9, 2003, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/101 "2003-10-09T21:57:59Z")
Or, if he had clearly stated that religious zealots of any stripe are subhuman savages. For me, that would include hand-stabbing atheists of the MMO type, Christians who bomb abortion clinics, and Muslims who beat up reporters.
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### Author:  [@milroyj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/milroyj)
#### Post date: [October 10, 2003, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/102 "2003-10-10T03:36:15Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Lynn Bodoni \*
> **This board is mostly read and moderated by people residing in the USA. As such, it does have a decided American slant. It has posters from every political viewpoint, though there is a liberal slant. Deal with these facts.**
Yay, one of the Admins finally admitted the truth. The board slants liberal, duh. I disagree with the notion of “Fighting Ignorance” is well-served by doing so.
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### Author:  [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)
#### Post date: [October 10, 2003, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/103 "2003-10-10T04:20:58Z")
If the Board slants liberal, try leaning in the other direction to maintain balance - like being on a ship.
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### Author:  [@sugaree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sugaree)
#### Post date: [October 10, 2003, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/104 "2003-10-10T11:12:18Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by milroyj \*
> \*\*Yay, one of the Admins finally admitted the truth. The board slants liberal, duh. I disagree with the notion of “Fighting Ignorance” is well-served by doing so. \*\*
What do you suggest? Quotas?
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### Author:  [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)
#### Post date: [October 10, 2003, 11:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/105 "2003-10-10T11:50:47Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by sugaree \*
> \*\*What do you suggest? Quotas? \*\*
Nah. It’d be better if someone, say, **milroyj** , contributed nothing whilst foaming at the mouth like a rabid squirrel about persecution.
Oh, wait…
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### Author:  [@milroyj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/milroyj)
#### Post date: [October 10, 2003, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/106 "2003-10-10T23:58:40Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by sugaree \*
> \*\*What do you suggest? Quotas? \*\*
No silly, but I would suggest that the rule against Hate Speech be enforced more equitably.
e.g. hate speech against Christians should not be allowed, since hate speech against Muslims is not allowed.
Likewise, hate speech against Americans should not be allowed, since hate speech against Pakistanis is not allowed.
But there has been anti-American hate speech allowed on the SDMB.
After 9/11, there were hateful posts about how America “deserved it”. No, nobody on this earth, past, present, or future, deserved what happened that day.
And again at the start of the war in Iraq, at least one poster wished for a lot of American casualties. Wishing death on American soldiers is somehow NOT hate speech?
IMHO, YMMV.
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### Author:  [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)
#### Post date: [October 11, 2003, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/107 "2003-10-11T00:05:11Z")
> [@](#):
>
> No silly, but I would suggest that the rule against Hate Speech be enforced more equitably.
THEN USE THE REPORT BUTTON. Report any post that you think is hate speech. However, be warned that just because YOU think that something is hate speech, doesn’t necessarily make it so.\* We can’t read EVERY post, you know, and I don’t even try any more. In particular, the Pit is very tough to monitor, it’s very soul-draining.
\*Criticism isn’t necessarily hate speech. In fact, it usually isn’t hate speech.
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### Author:  [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)
#### Post date: [October 11, 2003, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/108 "2003-10-11T00:05:11Z")
remember folks, the next meeting is Tuesday at the regular place. Nominations for the best “hate speech against Americans on SDMB” will be held.
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### Author:  [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)
#### Post date: [October 11, 2003, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/109 "2003-10-11T01:38:47Z")
Are we to submit our own original compositions? Or can we nominate from posted submissions? Can we nominate ourselves or must we pretend to admire someone else’s post more than one’s own?
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### Author:  [@El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Cid_Viscoso)
#### Post date: [October 11, 2003, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/110 "2003-10-11T04:37:34Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Mr. B \*
> \*\ ***Other than self-preservation I have no vested interests here.**
>
> OP by **[Dogface](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?postid=4079310#post4079310)**:
> The thread inevitably became a pile-on with no additional input from **Dogface**.
>
> With the exception of **[Giraffe](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?postid=4079359#post4079359)**, who queried the meaning of the OP, there was a lot of invective and rule-breaking (take my word for it) until **[Libertarian](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?postid=4080399#post4080399)** stepped in: Ultimately the thread was closed by **[Lynn Bodoni](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?postid=4081792#post4081792)** with a threat of banning.
> When does an arguably ambiguous statement become hate speech? \*\*
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### Author:  [@El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Cid_Viscoso)
#### Post date: [October 11, 2003, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/111 "2003-10-11T04:39:26Z")
Whoops. Very strange. ☹
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### Author:  [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)
#### Post date: [October 11, 2003, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/112 "2003-10-11T04:46:15Z")
And the Fireman rushes in, from the pouring rain…
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### Author:  [@El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Cid_Viscoso)
#### Post date: [October 11, 2003, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/113 "2003-10-11T04:51:08Z")
\
And I was going to post something oh so interesting. Oh well. Back to my macramé.
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### Author:  [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)
#### Post date: [October 11, 2003, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/114 "2003-10-11T04:54:41Z")
My ex used to be in to macrame. Fits. She was strung out, knotted up and kinda twisted.
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### Author:  [@El\_Cid\_Viscoso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Cid_Viscoso)
#### Post date: [October 11, 2003, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/115 "2003-10-11T04:55:59Z")
But where did she put the beads?
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### Author:  [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)
#### Post date: [October 11, 2003, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/116 "2003-10-11T06:34:21Z")
Wherevrer.
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### Author:  [@spinky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spinky)
#### Post date: [October 11, 2003, 7:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/117 "2003-10-11T07:58:34Z")
Huh. I have no clue about **Dogface’s** posting history, but the way I read the quote from the OP was, “why do we even keep pretending that [hooligans who dispense violent vigilante justice] deserve even the tiniest shred of consideration as human beings?”
Why is it reasonable to assume the worst?
> [@](#):
>
> _Originally posted by Bippy the Beardless_
> Lib can you see the difference in these two
>
> 1. Approximately 15 young men ages 15 to 18, described as being of Pakistani heritage, attacked the poor man…Why do we even keep pretending that these creatures deserve even the tiniest shred of consideration as human beings?
>
> 2. Approximately 15 young men ages 15 to 18, described as being Muslim fundamentalists, attacked the poor man…Why do we even keep pretending that these creatures deserve even the tiniest shred of consideration as human beings?
Or 3) Approximately 15 young men ages 15 to 18, described as having brown hair, attacked the poor man…Why do we even keep pretending that these creatures deserve even the tiniest shred of consideration as human beings?
In other words, the “described as” phrase was just that: _descriptive_, not meant to define the class under consideration. Hell, they were described as “young men” too. Why isn’t anyone assuming he thinks all young men are savages?
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### Author:  [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)
#### Post date: [October 11, 2003, 8:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/118 "2003-10-11T08:02:15Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by ntucker \*
> I have no clue about **Dogface’s** posting history, but the way I read the quote from the OP was, “why do we even keep pretending that [hooligans who dispense violent vigilante justice] deserve even the tiniest shred of consideration as human beings?”
>
> Why is it reasonable to assume the worst?
Because you have no clue about **Dogface’s** posting history.
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### Author:  [@spinky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spinky)
#### Post date: [October 11, 2003, 8:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/119 "2003-10-11T08:19:53Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by rjung \*
> \*\*Because you have no clue about **Dogface’s** posting history. \*\*
That sounds like a reason **not** to assume the worst to me.
I don’t understand why people who are so firmly convinced of his bigotry based on his **other** posts are spending time analyzing this one which is ambiguous at best. Flame away at that stuff that’s demonstrably wrong, not stuff you have to interpret in the worst possible light to find fault with.
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### Author:  [@spinky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spinky)
#### Post date: [October 11, 2003, 8:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-and-the-sdmb/206236/120 "2003-10-11T08:46:53Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Libertarian \*
> I’ve given several hours of thought to the matter and, based on Andros’ compelling argument, I have to agree with those who say that Dogface’s remarks were racially bigotted.
First, I gotta say, my hat’s off to you for seriously considering the arguments and reversing your position. **Andros’** argument is very good, and it required a keen interpretation of a really subtle point. It almost had me convinced.
However, the way I originally read the statement under question, it still makes perfect sense with the “keep pretending” part:
“Why do we even keep pretending that [people who commit these types of violent acts] deserve even the tiniest shred of consideration as human beings?”
I have to admit that when I read it this way, I agreed with it. It wasn’t until I read other people’s outrage that I saw the potentially bigoted meaning.
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