# Hate speech - Jews vs. Gays
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606
**Category:** Great Debates
**Created:** [November 17, 2000, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606 "2000-11-17T16:33:20Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)
#### Post date: [November 17, 2000, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/1 "2000-11-17T16:33:20Z")
Found an interesting site recently called [“Nazi Anti-Jewish Speech VS. Religious Right Anti-Gay Speech”](http://www.wiredstrategies.com/hitler.html) which drew some interesting comparisons between what the Nazis said then and what the radical right says now:
[ul][li]Jews control politics; gays control Hollywood.[/li][li]Jews are richer; gays are an elite.[/li][li]Jews spread disease; gays spread STDs.[/li][li]Jews are criminals; gays are child molesters.[/li][li]Jews are abnormal; gays are unnatural.[/li][li]Jews threaten to convert children; gays threaten to convert children.[/li][li]Jews threaten Christianity; gays threaten “family values.”[/li][li]Jews are covert; gays can blend in.[/li][li]There is a cultural war on against the Jews; there is a cultural war on against gays.[/ul][/li]
Chilled me to the bone.
Thoughts?
Esprix
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### Author:  [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)
#### Post date: [November 17, 2000, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/2 "2000-11-17T16:51:31Z")
“You missed the part where Jews control the media”, says the copy editor who can’t even get her bosses to change one fucking comma in this month’s galleys.
I wish more of the stereotypes about Jews were true—I’d love to be wealthy, over-educated and control the media!
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### Author:  [@Moirai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moirai)
#### Post date: [November 17, 2000, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/3 "2000-11-17T16:55:38Z")
God, you would think that people would have come farther than this. It is the standard hatred of the smaller group that is different.
Have the Jews learned anything about dealing with persecution in the last few thousand years that they can share with the gay community?
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### Author:  [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)
#### Post date: [November 17, 2000, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/4 "2000-11-17T16:56:05Z")
There’s an old joke about the Jewish villager back in Russia, during the days of the Czar, living - like the rest of the village - in poverty conditions. But every week he spends a precious kopec to get the newspaper, even though this is the Czar’s puppet paper for railing about how the Jews control everything and have infiltrated everywhere.
Finally, the store owner says, “Avram, why do you spend money every week reading such a thing?”
Replies Avram, “I like to see how powerful I am.”
- Rick
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### Author:  [@The\_Ryan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Ryan)
#### Post date: [November 18, 2000, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/5 "2000-11-18T04:29:23Z")
Although I haven’t heard anyone blaming the gays for Vietnam…
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### Author:  [@SpoilerVirgin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpoilerVirgin)
#### Post date: [November 18, 2000, 7:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/6 "2000-11-18T07:06:09Z")
I recently had a conversation with someone at work who told me that he home schools his children because he doesn’t want them to be taught that homosexuality is an acceptable lifestyle.
I explained to him that I believe very strongly in gay rights. This man, who is black, then said that there’s a difference between discrimination against blacks and discrimination against gays, because everyone can tell that he is black, and there’s nothing he can do about it, while no one knows that a gay person is gay, and you can choose whether or not to “act” gay.
I then pointed out to him that I am Jewish, and while no one can tell (at least not with certainty) by looking at me, and it is theoretically possible for me not to “act” Jewish, that doesn’t make anti-Semitism any less wrong or offensive.
He said that I had a good point. I don’t think I really changed his mind about gay rights, but at least I made him think a little.
BTW, I haven’t said this before, but I think that the “Ask the Gay Guy” threads are the best thing I have ever read on the internet (and I surf a lot). I think you should consider writing a book – the information is valuable and has great potential to change lives.
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### Author:  [@Sterra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sterra)
#### Post date: [November 18, 2000, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/7 "2000-11-18T13:34:44Z")
I thought this was going to be about how jews hated gays.
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### Author:  [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)
#### Post date: [November 18, 2000, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/8 "2000-11-18T15:33:45Z")
Another one for the list: both groups are obsessed with
the penis (circumcism and…er…whatever)
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### Author:  [@BlackKnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlackKnight)
#### Post date: [November 18, 2000, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/9 "2000-11-18T15:37:28Z")
That’s certainly very horrible Esprix, but couldn’t the same be said of the majority of other oft-hated minorities as well? I’m absolutely NOT condoning this type of thinking, merely saying that it is not restricted to a couple of groups.
For example:
Jews are richer, atheists are an elite (scientists, etc.)
Jews are criminals, atheists are immoral
Jews are covert, atheists can blend in
Jews control politics, atheists control the schools
Jews threaten Christianity, atheists …
Well, you get the picture.
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### Author:  [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)
#### Post date: [November 18, 2000, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/10 "2000-11-18T19:09:55Z")
Well, at least we don’t have a fake book called The Protocols of the Flaming Gays of San Francisco, or something like that…
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### Author:  [@Freyr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freyr)
#### Post date: [November 18, 2000, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/11 "2000-11-18T21:41:03Z")
I read thru the list that **Esprix** linked to, but got disgusted about a third of the way thru and couldn’t finish. It was just too similar.
\*\*Guinastasia wrote:
Well, at least we don’t have a fake book called The Protocols of the Flaming Gays of San Francisco, or something like that…\*\*
No, we don’t, we have something worse: **THE HOMOSEXUAL AGENDA.** The thing that makes it so bad is that’s **NOT** written down, therefore it can be anything anyone wants it to be and included any and everything.
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### Author:  [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)
#### Post date: [November 18, 2000, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/12 "2000-11-18T22:05:12Z")
Ooooh…I forgot about that one…
The scary thing is, to this day, some people take The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion SERIOUSLY…it’s pretty fecking scary!
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### Author:  [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)
#### Post date: [November 19, 2000, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/13 "2000-11-19T05:16:02Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Freyr \*
> \*\*I read thru the list that **Esprix** linked to, but got disgusted about a third of the way thru and couldn’t finish. It was just too similar.
>
> \*\*Guinastasia wrote:
>
> Well, at least we don’t have a fake book called The Protocols of the Flaming Gays of San Francisco, or something like that…\*\*
>
> No, we don’t, we have something worse: **THE HOMOSEXUAL AGENDA.** The thing that makes it so bad is that’s **NOT** written down, therefore it can be anything anyone wants it to be and included any and everything. \*\*
You obviously do not understand the level of destruction the Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion has caused.
This “homosexual agenda” concept is a very recent innovation - it relies on the existence of gay activism for its existence - and so far as I’m aware has not yet been used as an excuse to construct a death camp capable of murdering tens of thousands a day.
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### Author:  [@Freyr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freyr)
#### Post date: [November 19, 2000, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/14 "2000-11-19T05:37:31Z")
\*\*RickJay wrote:
You obviously do not understand the level of destruction the Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion has caused.\*\*
Actually, I think I do and am appalled. Please understand I wasn’t trying to trivialize that destruction, but to simply point out that something similar is going on today as **Esprix** is doing with this thread.
**This “homosexual agenda” concept is a very recent innovation - it relies on the existence of gay activism for its existence - and so far as I’m aware has not yet been used as an excuse to construct a death camp capable of murdering tens of thousands a day.**
Agreed, the “homosexual agenda” concept is rather recent, only within the past 20 years or so. But then gay activism is fairly recent, too. There was Stonewall in '69 and the Mattachine Society in the '50s (tho how much influence they had is up to debate; most scholars point to Stonewall as the main gay-rights political starting point).
Back in the mid-80s, the more extreme politicians and commentators called for the detention of gays, especially when the transmission of AIDS wasn’t fully understood. Thankfully, not much attention was paid to them.
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### Author:  [@The\_Ryan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Ryan)
#### Post date: [November 19, 2000, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/15 "2000-11-19T06:10:02Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by SpoilerVirgin \*
> **I recently had a conversation with someone at work who told me that he home schools his children because he doesn’t want them to be taught that homosexuality is an acceptable lifestyle.**
I really can’t understand his attitude. Is he Christian? Public schools teach that non-Christianity is an acceptable lifestyle. Is he really that scared of his children be exposed to opposing viewpoints?
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### Author:  [@tiggeril](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tiggeril)
#### Post date: [November 19, 2000, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/16 "2000-11-19T07:00:54Z")
> [@](#):
>
> _Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion_
Since we are fighting ignorance and all, what is that?
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### Author:  [@Doug\_Bowe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doug_Bowe)
#### Post date: [November 19, 2000, 8:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/17 "2000-11-19T08:17:13Z")
[http://www.igc.apc.org/ddickerson/protocols.html](http://www.igc.apc.org/ddickerson/protocols.html)
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### Author:  [@tiggeril](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tiggeril)
#### Post date: [November 19, 2000, 8:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/18 "2000-11-19T08:27:03Z")
Many thanks, **Doug**.
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### Author:  [@waterj2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/waterj2)
#### Post date: [November 19, 2000, 10:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/19 "2000-11-19T10:48:00Z")
I don’t see the parallels as being scary. What makes the Nazis so grotesque and incomprehensible was not the irrationality of their hatred, but its popularity and the lengths to which they went. As a matter of fact, I feel pretty secure knowing that using similar tactics, the anti-gay crowd is getting nowhere. The best they seem capable of is holding the status quo (e.g. keeping single sex marriage illegal).
Incidentally, is it me, or has it been a while since anyone on the boards has come out against gay right? I remember the days of CalifBoomer and ORION\*\*\*\*\*ORION and similar posters.
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### Author:  [@David\_B](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_B)
#### Post date: [November 19, 2000, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-jews-vs-gays/41606/20 "2000-11-19T13:32:39Z")
Doug, I’m very disappointed in you – referring people to _another_ site instead of the [Straight Dope Staff Report on the Protocols](http://www.straightdope.com/mailbag/mzionprotocol.html).
Tsk, tsk, tsk.
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