# Hate speech laws. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 22, 2012, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881 "2012-12-22T23:49:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![CCitizen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@CCitizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CCitizen)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2012, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/1 "2012-12-22T23:49:34Z")
In USA any hate speech short of threats of violence and provable slander is legal. According to [SNYDER v. PHELPS ET AL.](http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/10pdf/09-751.pdf) Even the group which has publicly stated that all Americans deserve to die has won the First Amandment case. In Canada, most of Europe, Australia, NZ, hate speech is prosecuted but very rarely. What is your opinion? ---
**Author:** ![akennett](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ee59a6/32.png) [@akennett](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/akennett)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2012, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/2 "2012-12-22T23:55:54Z")
I think we should enact “common sense” speech control laws. I propose the following: 1. A rigorous criminal and mental background check before one can speak. 2. A limit on the number of words someone’s speech may contain. 3. A ban on assault words, which are designed only to inflict maximum damage on the hearer. 4. A one-speech-per-month limit. 5. A waiting period between the composition of speech and its distribution. ---
**Author:** ![Lauren-C](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@Lauren-C](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lauren-C)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/3 "2012-12-23T00:18:28Z")
At the very least, they should be applied evenly. If you distribute literature calling for the murder or enslavement of those who don’t follow your particular religion, you should rightly be prosecuted. So why aren’t those who distribute the Koran prosecuted? ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/4 "2012-12-23T00:20:24Z")
I believe in free speech, which means I am against “hate speech” legislation. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/5 "2012-12-23T00:23:08Z")
> [@CCitizen](#): > > In Canada, most of Europe, Australia, NZ, hate speech is prosecuted but very rarely. > > What is your opinion? This sort of implies those countries “et al” all have identical laws, but in fact they differ enormously. ---
**Author:** ![CCitizen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@CCitizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CCitizen)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/6 "2012-12-23T00:43:34Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > This sort of implies those countries “et al” all have identical laws, but in fact they differ enormously. They have very similar hate speech law practices. ---
**Author:** ![CCitizen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@CCitizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CCitizen)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/7 "2012-12-23T00:44:37Z")
> [@Lauren-C](#): > > At the very least, they should be applied evenly. If you distribute literature calling for the murder or enslavement of those who don’t follow your particular religion, you should rightly be prosecuted. So why aren’t those who distribute the Koran prosecuted? Ancient religious texts are an exception. ---
**Author:** ![Lauren-C](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@Lauren-C](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lauren-C)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/8 "2012-12-23T00:51:43Z")
> [@CCitizen](#): > > Ancient religious texts are an exception. They shouldn’t be. Where does one draw the line? What constitutes ancient? ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/9 "2012-12-23T00:56:28Z")
> [@Lauren-C](#): > > At the very least, they should be applied evenly. If you distribute literature calling for the murder or enslavement of those who don’t follow your particular religion, you should rightly be prosecuted. So why aren’t those who distribute the Koran prosecuted? Because those who distribute literature calling for the murder or the enslavement of nobody in particular aren’t prosecuted either (in the US). First Amendment, baby. It cuts both ways. Per wiki: > [@](#): > > Even in cases where speech encourages illegal violence, instances of incitement qualify as criminal only if the threat of violence is imminent.[[60]](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech#cite_note-60) This strict standard prevents prosecution of many cases of incitement, including prosecution of those advocating violent opposition to the government and those exhorting violence against racial, ethnic, or gender minorities.[[61]](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech#cite_note-61) ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/10 "2012-12-23T01:01:37Z")
(BTW, considering the Bible calls for putting homosexuals to death, and homosexuals are a protected class, by your standards distributing the Bible would constitute hate speech, same as the Koran. You OK with that ?) ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/11 "2012-12-23T01:10:51Z")
> [@CCitizen](#): > > In USA any hate speech short of threats of violence and provable slander is legal. According to [SNYDER v. PHELPS ET AL.](http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/10pdf/09-751.pdf) Even the group which has publicly stated that all Americans deserve to die has won the First Amandment case. > > In Canada, most of Europe, Australia, NZ, hate speech is prosecuted but very rarely. > > What is your opinion? It’s customary here for the OP to lay out a case for his or her position. What’s yours? ---
**Author:** ![Lauren-C](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@Lauren-C](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lauren-C)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/12 "2012-12-23T01:15:47Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > (BTW, considering the Bible calls for putting homosexuals to death, and homosexuals are a protected class, by your standards distributing the Bible would constitute hate speech, same as the Koran. You OK with that ?) Yes, though I’m not sure why you think I wouldn’t be. To be fair, however, St Paul and other New Testament writers stated quite clearly that the Old Testament law doesn’t apply to Gentile Christians or anyone else other than the Jews. This, indeed, was the first major controversy in the Church. Singling out the Koran is justified because that’s the only one that still provokes endless violence and mass killings. ---
**Author:** ![CCitizen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@CCitizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CCitizen)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/13 "2012-12-23T01:31:31Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > It’s customary here for the OP to lay out a case for his or her position. What’s yours? I believe there should be a civil penalty for these actions. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/14 "2012-12-23T01:32:14Z")
> [@Lauren-C](#): > > Yes, though I’m not sure why you think I wouldn’t be. > > To be fair, however, St Paul and other New Testament writers stated quite clearly that the Old Testament law doesn’t apply to Gentile Christians or anyone else other than the Jews. This, indeed, was the first major controversy in the Church. > > Singling out the Koran is justified because that’s the only one that still provokes endless violence and mass killings. Yeah, banning the Koran would do wonders at ending mass killings. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Lauren-C](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@Lauren-C](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lauren-C)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/15 "2012-12-23T01:34:12Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Yeah, banning the Koran would do wonders at ending mass killings. :rolleyes: That’s like saying that if something is wrong, yet big and powerful, we should do nothing about it. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/16 "2012-12-23T01:37:19Z")
> [@Lauren-C](#): > > That’s like saying that if something is wrong, yet big and powerful, we should do nothing about it. No, it’s not. We have freedom of religion and speech in the US. Banning books is something we don’t do. If you think it’s justified because of “mass killings”, then banning it will only make matters worse. ---
**Author:** ![Lauren-C](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@Lauren-C](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lauren-C)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/17 "2012-12-23T01:43:58Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > No, it’s not. We have freedom of religion and speech in the US. Banning books is something we don’t do. If you think it’s justified because of “mass killings”, then banning it will only make matters worse. Clearly, that isn’t the case. Julian Assange published stuff outside America, but is now forced to live in the Equadorian embassy for fear of being extradited there. ---
**Author:** ![CCitizen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@CCitizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CCitizen)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/18 "2012-12-23T01:45:13Z")
> [@Lauren-C](#): > > Clearly, that isn’t the case. Julian Assange published stuff outside America, but is now forced to live in the Equadorian embassy for fear of being extradited there. He published state secrets. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/19 "2012-12-23T01:47:24Z")
> [@Lauren-C](#): > > Yes, though I’m not sure why you think I wouldn’t be. Because in my experience, American islamophobes (particularly those who put much weight on what’s written in the Koran, as opposed to what’s preached to or focused on in Muslim communities) tend to be Christians much lacking in self-awareness. I was pre-emptively providing some, just in case. > [@](#): > > To be fair, however, St Paul and other New Testament writers stated quite clearly that the Old Testament law doesn’t apply to Gentile Christians or anyone else other than the Jews. This, indeed, was the first major controversy in the Church. Doesn’t matter. The OT still says so, every Bible includes the text of the OT, and many American Christians use that very passage to justify their hating on homosexuals anyway. > [@](#): > > Singling out the Koran is justified Is it now ? > [@](#): > > because that’s the only one that still provokes endless violence and mass killings. Oh this is going to be good. Paging Dr. \*\*Trihs \*\*? Doctor **Der Trihs** to report to GD please ?.. Hmm, that’s odd, he’s usually there in a NY minute. Oh well, I guess I’ll play his part for a spell: did you mean in the US or abroad ? If in the US, check the (literal) gay bashing and abortion-related violence stats vs. Muslims knocking on Jews. Hell, check the Christians victimizing Muslims (or people they think are Muslims…) stats for that matter. While you’re at it, you could be interested in looking up Christian Identity groups like Aryan Nations or the Covenant, Sword and Arm of the Lord - they’re good peoples. If abroad, well, mentioning the IRA or Anders Breivik would be too easy so do check up on the NLFT in India instead. Or on Africa - Christians are up to delightfully whimsical shenanigans there. And by that I mean killing children with machetes whom pastors had accused of witchcraft. That is, when they aren’t enrolling them in marauding armies of course - it’s still 2012, doesn’t KONY ring a bell any more ? Man, that fad was over quick… ---
**Author:** ![Lauren-C](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@Lauren-C](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lauren-C)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881/20 "2012-12-23T01:47:24Z")
> [@CCitizen](#): > > He published state secrets. What about his freedom of speech? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hate-speech-laws/644881.md?page=2)