# Hating on Star Trek: The Next Generation **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 2, 2014, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871 "2014-06-02T22:45:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/121 "2016-09-16T02:53:20Z")
> [@Nonsuch](#): > > When a kid lost his parents in an away mission, the kid would just go back to their quarters to stew in their grief, alone and unsupervised. Sooner or later, they could expect a friendly visit from a pshrink/psocial worker like Troi who would do a computer search to find out in which corner of the Federation their nearest next-of-kin lived, and then pack them off on the next available shuttlecraft. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/122 "2016-09-16T03:25:07Z")
> [@Nonsuch](#): > > Wha? Are you familiar with the nation of [Australia](http://www.convictrecords.com.au/ships)? Or even the Mayflower? I’m going to assume your question was purely rhetorical, and that you had absolutely no intention of insulting my intelligence with it. :mad: ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/123 "2016-09-16T03:32:54Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > Naval vessels might have rescued and evacuated colonists in situations of extreme danger (natural disasters, wars, political upheavals) and helped to resettle them elsewhere, but this was far from their primary task. > > The _Enterprise_ did from time to time perform such duties (“This Side of Paradise,” “Up the Long Ladder”), but ferrying civilians was certainly not what it was intended for. Heck, they were forced into the role in _Homeward_ and were not happy about it. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/124 "2016-09-16T03:43:39Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > Wagon trains carried settlers to populate new lands. The naval vessels of that or any other day did not. Not settlers, but kids aboard warships weren’t uncommon in Hornblower’s day, and even after: > **[Powder monkey](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Powder_monkey)** > > A powder boy or powder monkey manned naval artillery guns as a member of a warship's crew, primarily during the Age of Sail. His chief role was to ferry gunpowder from the powder magazine in the ship's hold to the artillery pieces, either in bulk or as cartridges, to minimize the risk of fires and explosions. The function was usually fulfilled by boy seamen of 12 to 14 years of age. Powder monkeys were usually boys or young teens, selected for the job for their speed and height: they wer Many o... [![](http://images.fineartamerica.com/images/artworkimages/mediumlarge/1/-two-young-midshipmen-in-sight-of-home-philip-richard.jpg) ](http://images.fineartamerica.com/images/artworkimages/mediumlarge/1/-two-young-midshipmen-in-sight-of-home-philip-richard.jpg) [![](https://i.pinimg.com/236x/af/85/d5/af85d5734ff3688a0fe5a84b7d8659b4.jpg) ](https://i.pinimg.com/236x/af/85/d5/af85d5734ff3688a0fe5a84b7d8659b4.jpg) > **[Photo Storage](https://smg.photobucket.com/user/CSM1010101/media/Movies/MAC/dUb_screen_MAC_005.jpg.html)** > > Store your photos and videos online with secure storage from Photobucket. Available on iOS, Android and desktop. Securely backup your memories and sign up today! ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/125 "2016-09-16T03:59:50Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Not settlers, but kids aboard warships weren’t uncommon in Hornblower’s day, and even after: > > [Powder monkey - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Powder_monkey) > [http://images.fineartamerica.com/images/artworkimages/mediumlarge/1/-two-young-midshipmen-in-sight-of-home-philip-richard.jpg](http://images.fineartamerica.com/images/artworkimages/mediumlarge/1/-two-young-midshipmen-in-sight-of-home-philip-richard.jpg) > [https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/af/85/d5/af85d5734ff3688a0fe5a84b7d8659b4.jpg](https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/af/85/d5/af85d5734ff3688a0fe5a84b7d8659b4.jpg) > [Photo Storage](http://smg.photobucket.com/user/CSM1010101/media/Movies/MAC/dUb_screen_MAC_005.jpg.html) Yes, I used to do living history, and I know about young/underage children serving in the American, British, and other militaries until relatively recently. Sometimes they enlisted legally, sometimes not, and occasionally with the connivance of their parents and the recruiter. Often they came from poor families with many children, or they were simply orphans. Somehow, I don’t see a parallel with children on the \*Enterprise \*here. (Occasionally, a ship’s captain would have his wife on board as well, or allow his officers to bring their wives along on a voyage. I shudder to think what their lives must have been like, though they were of course of a much hardier breed than I imagine the average wife of a Starfleet officer would be.) ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/126 "2016-09-16T14:35:43Z")
> [@AncientHumanoid](#): > > It’s both. And it’s neither. [archly] I see no reason for answers to be couched in riddles. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/127 "2016-09-16T14:48:12Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > Sooner or later, they could expect a friendly visit from a pshrink/psocial worker like Troi who would do a computer search to find out in which corner of the Federation their nearest next-of-kin lived, and then pack them off on the next available shuttlecraft. Yup, a three month voyage on a small, one room shuttle with Ensign Johnson… :eek: ---
**Author:** ![akrako1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c77e96/32.png) [@akrako1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/akrako1)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/128 "2016-09-16T14:52:26Z")
> [@squidfood](#): > > Proving that the true inheritor of TOS was in fact Firefly. At least in the Star Trek universe, they took the whole ‘Wagon Train To The Stars’ thing more a little more figuratively… Spaceports should have paved roads folks!! Sorry, that was one of my biggest peeves with Firefly… A space “frontier” area can certainly resemble the ‘Old West’ in feel, but once someone gets to the point of spaceports and interstellar travel, it shouldn’t actually look like it! ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/129 "2016-09-16T14:56:24Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > [archly] I see no reason for answers to be couched in riddles. That took forever… I’m glad someone shares my sense of trekmour. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/130 "2016-09-16T15:05:28Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > Yup, a three month voyage on a small, one room shuttle with Ensign Johnson… :eek: Did you make a dirty joke here, or do I just have a dirty mind? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Cardigan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardigan/32/187_2.png) [@Cardigan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardigan)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/131 "2016-09-16T15:07:04Z")
Not the worst TNG episode by any stretch, but I was intensely annoyed by that episode where the Enterprise crew was subjected to alien mind control by the introduction of an addictive computer game. _Mothers, don’t let yer kids become mindless video game zombies_ - was sanctimonious message du jour. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/132 "2016-09-16T15:07:11Z")
> [@AncientHumanoid](#): > > That took forever… > I’m glad someone shares my sense of trekmour. 🙂 He answered as simply as your level of understanding permits. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/133 "2016-09-16T15:09:53Z")
> [@Cardigan](#): > > Not the worst TNG episode by any stretch, but I was intensely annoyed by that episode where the Enterprise crew was subjected to alien mind control by the introduction of an addictive computer game. > > _Mothers, don’t let yer kids become mindless video game zombies_ - was sanctimonious message du jour. I thought it was remarkably like “The Trouble with Tribbles,” in that the menace came from something apparently harmless yet insidious. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/134 "2016-09-16T15:45:36Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > I thought it was remarkably like “The Trouble with Tribbles,” in that the menace came from something apparently harmless yet insidious. Like root beer. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/135 "2016-09-16T15:51:25Z")
> [@Cardigan](#): > > Not the worst TNG episode by any stretch, but I was intensely annoyed by that episode where the Enterprise crew was subjected to alien mind control by the introduction of an addictive computer game. > > _Mothers, don’t let yer kids become mindless video game zombies_ - was sanctimonious message du jour. I put that episode as like fourth worst of all time. Over 1000 crew, from many different species, and ALL are affected the same way, instantaneously, by the “game”? Even Worf? And, unfortunately for Wil Wheaton, Westly has to save the day. AGAIN. Not even Ashley Judd could save it. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/136 "2016-09-16T15:56:41Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > Like root beer. Root beer, mmmmmmmmmmmmm! :o ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/137 "2016-09-16T15:58:25Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > Root beer, mmmmmmmmmmmmm! :o Just like the Federation… ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/138 "2016-09-16T16:16:15Z")
This sort of thread reminds me of why I liked Trek at the level I did. There were too many inconsistencies in the world building for my taste - is the enterprise a military ship or not (and if not why does it act like one so often), does the federation have money or not and how does the economy work with replicators, how does a transporter work (if it can duplicate and/or ressurect people there are huge implications, and sometimes it can), and so on. And the tendency to come up with an amazing new ability for the ship or some super scientific breakthrough one week, but then forget it the next week (and worse, invent another new ability to then be forgotten about) breaks suspension of disbelief and removes dramatic tension. Those things only bother me if I get really into the series and try to think/talk about it a lot, though. If I’m just watching a show occasionally to see the characters get up to adventures and/or drama, then I’m not going to try to form the whole thing into a coherent picture in my head, so don’t end up saying ‘wait, that doesn’t make sense’ or ‘but he should be able to fix that easily, he did last week’. That’s where I think TNG worked great, you could come in occasionally for a TV SF fix and enjoy it easily without having to stumble over the inconsistencies in plot and world building. Also, I don’t agree that the interior aesthetics of the ship were bad - it feels dated now, but I didn’t get a ‘hotel and convention center’ vibe from the ship when I used to watch it. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/139 "2016-09-16T17:01:41Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > I put that episode as like fourth worst of all time. Over 1000 crew, from many different species, and ALL are affected the same way, instantaneously, by the “game”? Even Worf? To me, the real stumbling block is how La Forge could be affected, since he doesn’t have conventional eyesight. The show doesn’t even try, they just show Riker telling him about the device and later we see La Forge under its thrall, but we never see him wearing it. It had potential as a premise - an alien species wants the ship’s power and manipulates the crew to get it. Compare this episode to “11001001” (a heavily cybernetic species steals the _Enterprise_ after tricking its crew into abandoning it) and “Conundrum” (a species gives the entire crew amnesia - including Data, this time - and tries to trick the crew into thinking they’re involved in an interstellar war). Loathe as I am to praise _Voyager_, the manipulation-recruitment premise works best on an individual level, as in their episode “Nemesis”, which I thought was one of their best. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2016, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871/140 "2016-09-16T17:27:27Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > To me, the real stumbling block is how La Forge could be affected, since he doesn’t have conventional eyesight. The show doesn’t even try, they just show Riker telling him about the device and later we see La Forge under its thrall, but we never see him wearing it. > > It had potential as a premise - an alien species wants the ship’s power and manipulates the crew to get it. Compare this episode to “11001001” (a heavily cybernetic species steals the _Enterprise_ after tricking its crew into abandoning it) and “Conundrum” (a species gives the entire crew amnesia - including Data, this time - and tries to trick the crew into thinking they’re involved in an interstellar war). > > Loathe as I am to praise _Voyager_, the manipulation-recruitment premise works best on an individual level, as in their episode “Nemesis”, which I thought was one of their best. Oh yeah, I should have mentioned Geordi as part of my problem with this ep. Conundrum is bad, but in a similar style I list _Clues_ as like the fifth worst of all time. 🙂 “We must all give ourselves amnesia otherwise the super powerful and super violent but surprisingly forgiving aliens will kill us all!” When people complain about TNG being wimpy, I have to grudgingly agree concerning this episode. Not only would Kirk not have put up with the shenanigans of this episode, neither would have Picard in any earlier episode. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hating-on-star-trek-the-next-generation/689871.md?page=8)