# Have any cults existed without sexual manipulation? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 3, 2019, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639 "2019-09-03T18:51:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2019, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/1 "2019-09-03T18:51:57Z")
Whether it’s a recruitment technique like the Children of God’s Flirty Fishing, a community bonding exercise in Rajneeshpuram, or a means to punish and reward in the the polygamist practicing LDS, Nxivm or Scientology sex seems like a go-to method of controlling people. Does a sexual component somehow have to be involved in a cult? Are there any where controlling sexuality in anyway wasn’t a part of keeping the masses in line? ---
**Author:** ![Hampshire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hampshire/32/4887_2.png) [@Hampshire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hampshire)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2019, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/2 "2019-09-03T19:23:56Z")
The Heaven’s Gate cult was not a sexual one, thought sex was a “human” trait that got in the way of them getting to the next “level” and several members even went through with voluntary castration. Actually, re-reading your post the Heaven’s Gate cult DID use sexuality to control it’s members. Only they didn’t exploit it but rather demonized it. ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2019, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/3 "2019-09-03T19:47:56Z")
Has there existed a human society anywhere, ever, without sexual manipulation? ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2019, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/4 "2019-09-03T20:04:22Z")
> [@Ulfreida](#): > > Has there existed a human society anywhere, ever, without sexual manipulation? That’s what I was thinking too. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2019, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/5 "2019-09-03T20:07:31Z")
The [Shakers - Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shakers)? ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2019, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/6 "2019-09-03T20:20:37Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > The [Shakers - Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shakers)? Shakers believe in celibacy as a core tenet, and while not castrating people like Heaven’s Gate, if forbidding sex is considered sexual manipulation then the Shakers are not an exception. ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2019, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/7 "2019-09-03T20:35:09Z")
[Amway?](http://www.cocs.com/jhoagland/amcult.html) ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2019, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/8 "2019-09-03T21:28:28Z")
The Mickey Mouse Club? ---
**Author:** ![Mangosteen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Mangosteen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangosteen)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2019, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/9 "2019-09-03T23:01:00Z")
I stayed with the Love Family for a few months back in the 70’s. Their main “home” was in Seattle, but I was at their Hilo Branch. The long term male members were all hooked up with the long term female members. I never saw any sexual manipulation. Young single females would come and go, but I never saw anything untoward. They flipped large houses to support themselves, so we all lived in pretty close quarters. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2019, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/10 "2019-09-03T23:34:13Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > The Mickey Mouse Club? Well, maybe. But at least some viewers, (as Dave Barry observed) noticed that some parts of the older girls’ T-shirts were closer to the camera than the rest. Should have looked it up. Here’s the exact quote: > [@](#): > > Another important television show of the era was The Mickey Mouse Club, which made enormous cultural contributions, by which we mean: Annette Funicello. Annette had a major impact on many of us male Baby Boomers, especially the part where she came marching out wearing a T-shirt with her name printed on it, and some of the letters were considerably closer to the camera than others. If you get our drift. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2019, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/11 "2019-09-03T23:40:57Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > The Mickey Mouse Club? “Annette had ears—I lusted in my heart” -John Fogerty ---
**Author:** ![MortSahlFan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3bc359/32.png) [@MortSahlFan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MortSahlFan)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2019, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/12 "2019-09-03T23:47:23Z")
I’ve always been fascinated by cults, and when I hear about a new one, or one from the past I never heard of, I always ask myself, “Ok, where’s the sexual manipulation?” - but it seems like sexual manipulation is everywhere in places of power, and even places with very little power. The local priest, rabbi, imam, etc… ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/13 "2019-09-04T14:22:30Z")
> [@Mangosteen](#): > > I stayed with the Love Family for a few months back in the 70’s. Their main “home” was in Seattle, but I was at their Hilo Branch. > > The long term male members were all hooked up with the long term female members. I never saw any sexual manipulation. Young single females would come and go, but I never saw anything untoward. They flipped large houses to support themselves, so we all lived in pretty close quarters. Interesting. Wiki says: > [@](#): > > The Love Family evolved from being a highly concentrated communal society with a shared economy, to what some non-members[who?] call a cult with their own laws and ways. The greater community in time became a social network of autonomous households that interact through a shared culture that they have continued to create together, without the robes and peer-enforced order. Presently, those that continue to claim membership in what remains of the Family are concentrated in homes and lots on the shore of the Columbia River (Lake Roosevelt), where they own the China Bend Winery, just below Canada. Would you call it a cult? ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/14 "2019-09-04T14:29:23Z")
> [@Ulfreida](#): > > Has there existed a human society anywhere, ever, without sexual manipulation? Heh, maybe. Is the term ‘Sex Cult’ redundant then? Are sexual mores, no matter where they come from, some level of manipulation? ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/15 "2019-09-04T14:49:23Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > Heh, maybe. Is the term ‘Sex Cult’ redundant then? Are sexual mores, no matter where they come from, some level of manipulation? I think there’s a difference between luring people in with the (implied?) promise of sex, much less situations where sex is blatantly used to manipulate (blackmail photos, threats to expose “what you did”) and other groups that just have opinions about sex (“premarital sex is a sin”). Sex is a large enough part of the human experience that I assume most lifestyle groups would have some opinions on it but not everyone uses it as part of their toolkit to gain/retain members, perhaps against their will. ---
**Author:** ![zimaane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a3d4f5/32.png) [@zimaane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zimaane)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/16 "2019-09-04T15:31:19Z")
The Peoples Temple (the cult involved in the Jonestown, Guyana mass suicide) did not really have a sexual control element, to my limited knowledge. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/17 "2019-09-04T15:40:31Z")
> [@zimaane](#): > > The Peoples Temple (the cult involved in the Jonestown, Guyana mass suicide) did not really have a sexual control element, to my limited knowledge. From [this Psychology Today article:](https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/articles/199203/the-truth-about-jonestown)(spoilered because of grossness) > [@](#): > > Both men and women were routinely beaten, coerced into having sex with Jones in private and with other people in public. Husbands and wives were forbidden to have sex with each other, but were forced to join other members in watching their spouses being sexually humiliated and abused. In order to prove that he wasn’t a racist, a white man was coerced into having oral sex in front of a gathering of members with a black woman who was having her period. Another man was made to remove all his clothes, bend over and spread his legs before the congregation while being examined for signs of venereal disease. A woman had to strip in front of the group so that Jones could poke fun at her overweight body before telling her to submerge herself in a pool of ice-cold water. Another woman was made to squat in front of 100 members and defecate into a fruit can. Children were tortured with electric shocks, viciously beaten, punished by being kept in the bottom of a jungle well, forced to have hot peppers stuffed up their rectums, and made to eat their own vomit. ---
**Author:** ![zimaane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a3d4f5/32.png) [@zimaane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zimaane)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/18 "2019-09-04T15:55:45Z")
OK, I stand corrected. ---
**Author:** ![yabob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yabob/32/2821_2.png) [@yabob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yabob)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/19 "2019-09-04T16:33:43Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > I think there’s a difference between luring people in with the (implied?) promise of sex, much less situations where sex is blatantly used to manipulate (blackmail photos, threats to expose “what you did”) and other groups that just have opinions about sex (“premarital sex is a sin”). Sex is a large enough part of the human experience that I assume most lifestyle groups would have some opinions on it but not everyone uses it as part of their toolkit to gain/retain members, perhaps against their will. I think we have to take this approach to find any examples at all. We should also include “manipulate” for the large number of cults which include coercive sexual misconduct on the part of the leaders, whatever the stated rules of the cult. Given that, how about Eckankar? That may fail the “sexual misconduct” test - there seems to be conflicting information out there. The basic beliefs seem to be silent on the subject of sex (while being batshit crazy in other areas). ---
**Author:** ![xnylder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/bbce88/32.png) [@xnylder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xnylder)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2019, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639/20 "2019-09-04T17:03:49Z")
Ironically, the [Raëlians](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ra%C3%ABl)might fit this bill. While the cult certainly attracts new members with sex (there used to be gatherings of scantily-clad cult members handing out flyers in downtown Montreal), they don’t seem to have issues with forced or coerced sex. At least, not that have been revealed to the public. Their liberal opinions on sex education and homosexuality appear to have been ahead of their time. When they were condemned, it was for fraud (concerning funding for a ludicrous human cloning scheme). [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-any-cults-existed-without-sexual-manipulation/839639.md?page=2)