# Have conservatives given up on democracy? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 10, 2006, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-conservatives-given-up-on-democracy/343861 "2006-02-10T14:40:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2006, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-conservatives-given-up-on-democracy/343861/61 "2006-02-12T15:44:29Z")
EC, most of your posts focus on kinky sex. You’ve staked out your ground and laid claim to it, don’t go blaming me for recognizing that fact. You’ve happily played the part of a one trick pony, now suck it up and live with the consequences. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2006, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-conservatives-given-up-on-democracy/343861/62 "2006-02-12T18:09:10Z")
Anyway, I’ve seen EC himself decide that spreading a “noble lie” was justified in all the “Valarie Plame’s outing was TREASON!” threads. He admitted that the outing wasn’t treason, but that it was important to keep on claiming it was treason, since bringing down the Bush administration was more important than the truth. And all this Strauss talk is simply another version. It doesn’t matter to him whether or how much Strauss influences Bush administration foreign and domestic policy, and what exactly that influence is. This is just his personal version of the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth. Since these sorts of lies worked for Bush, we Democrats must have our own teams of lying sleazemongers, otherwise we’ll be outgunned! And Evil Captor is now a self-appointed team of one, doing his part for a better America. ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2006, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-conservatives-given-up-on-democracy/343861/63 "2006-02-12T19:27:12Z")
> [@Evil Captor](#): > > I did a search on Google for the terms “Strauss” and “neoconservativism” I got over 61,000 hits. Rather interesting for a person who has little or nothing to do with neoconservatism. So did I and I got [370](http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&c2coff=1&q=%22Strauss%22+%22neoconservativism%22&btnG=Search). Are you sure you weren’t adding them? ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2006, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-conservatives-given-up-on-democracy/343861/64 "2006-02-12T22:56:28Z")
> [@Weirddave](#): > > EC you make it so easy. Those of your posts that are not slobbering attempts to hijack threads into your own masturbatory fantasies are regurgitated crap from whatever left wing blog caught your attention on any given day. Thank you for that authentic bit of conservative gibberish. It’s a real treat to read psychobabble that’s such a delightful mix of id-spew and partisan hackery. > [@](#): > > When challenged on the ludicrous nature of your OP, your response is to frantically Google even more blog and op-ed articles and link to them claiming they somehow “prove” your point. IOW, when challenged I do research and present cites. I’m so ashamed. I should be indulging in glassy-eyed arm-waving like you, I suppose. > [@](#): > > You’re so narcissistic that you apparently haven’t even noticed that only one poster, BrainGlutton, agrees with your premise at all, and that posters from all across the political spectrum seem to think you’re nuts. Actually, inaccurate as a simple reading of the thread will indicate. Try reading **with comprehension** for a change. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2006, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-conservatives-given-up-on-democracy/343861/65 "2006-02-12T23:04:39Z")
> [@Weirddave](#): > > EC, most of your posts focus on kinky sex. Actually, a quick count by you or anyone else would conclusively demonstrate that you are wrong, that the vast majority of my posts have nothing to do with sex, kinky or otherwise. And I post virtually nothing in GD or the Pit regarding kinky sex, sticking mostly to politics there. Generally, I stick to the topic at hand – most of my posts on sexual matters occur in CS, where the topic is most often relevant. But your weird fascination with my sexually-oriented posts indicates a tremendously hightened sensitivity to the topic. When did you first begin confusing kinky sex with politics, Weird Dave? We’re all friends here … > [@](#): > > You’ve staked out your ground and laid claim to it, don’t go blaming me for recognizing that fact. You’ve happily played the part of a one trick pony, now suck it up and live with the consequences. Dave, why are you attempting to hijack this into a sex thread? Is it because you recognize the truth of my assertions, and realize that there’s no way a fair and reasoned response would work, so you start off on this tack? If so, shame on you. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2006, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-conservatives-given-up-on-democracy/343861/66 "2006-02-12T23:15:30Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > Anyway, I’ve seen EC himself decide that spreading a “noble lie” was justified in all the “Valarie Plame’s outing was TREASON!” threads. He admitted that the outing wasn’t treason, but that it was important to keep on claiming it was treason, since bringing down the Bush administration was more important than the truth. I said nothing of the sort. I have always said that even though Rove’s outing of Plame might not constitute treason under the tortured definition of the word under the law, it was clearly treason i the general sense of the word – of betraying one’s countries interests for personal or partisan advantage. When Rove outed Plame he betrayed her service to the United States, he betrayed the people she worked with, and he betrayed all the agents who worked under the same cover she did. He belongs in a jail cell, I don’t see why I shouldn’t say so. > [@](#): > > And all this Strauss talk is simply another version. It doesn’t matter to him whether or how much Strauss influences Bush administration foreign and domestic policy, and what exactly that influence is. Except that I have evidence, and you have arm-waving. When come back, bring … anything. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2006, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-conservatives-given-up-on-democracy/343861/67 "2006-02-12T23:17:07Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#): > > So did I and I got [370](http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&c2coff=1&q=%22Strauss%22+%22neoconservativism%22&btnG=Search). Are you sure you weren’t adding them? I believe I did. But still, I also came up with particular cites that make my point. ---
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2006, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-conservatives-given-up-on-democracy/343861/68 "2006-02-13T17:52:30Z")
> [@Evil Captor](#): > > (I will be using the term “you” in a generic sense here, meaning “all conservatives and Republicans” and not referring directly to Uncle Beer.) > > Look, I understand that you guys want to drop the neocons like the skunks they are now that the war in Iraq is showing all signs of going belly-up in terms of positive results for the US. But back in the early days of the Bush Admin., you were all lovey-dovey with them. You were rubbing noses together and making kissy-face, yes you were. And given that you were such vociferous supporters of the Bush Admin. under the neocon agenda, you will just have to forgive us if we continue to put some (meaning a very large) measure of responsibility on you for their actions. To lump you in with them, in fact. And if you don’t like it, well you know what you can do. I see. We’re to take your statements as referring to “all conservatives and Republicans,” yet not to anyone specifically. What you’ve got then, is a fucking strawman. You’ve essentially manufactured an argument against something which nobody is claiming; you’re making an argument which applies to nobody specifically; your argument can’t be countered by anyone with any other belief because you’ve discluded them with a pre-existing parameter. You’ve constructed your claim such that no one can argue against it because it doesn’t necessarily include any individual - just “everyone else.” This tactic renders your argument just as spurious as your OP. And equally devoid of logic. This, too, is incredibly lame. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-conservatives-given-up-on-democracy/343861.md?page=3)