# Have Europeans done the most damage throughout human history? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 31, 2018, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913 "2018-01-31T22:36:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![BloodStalk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ee59a6/32.png) [@BloodStalk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BloodStalk)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2018, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/1 "2018-01-31T22:36:01Z")
In regards to issues such as Native American/Australian genocide, residential schooling, African-American Slavery, institutional racism today, experiments on non Europeans subjects such as Tuskeegee sylphis or J.Marion sims, colonization of other parts of the world which still has issues today, Apartheid. Due to this, have Europeans done the most damage throughout history? ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2018, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/2 "2018-01-31T22:42:41Z")
Do you include Russians / Soviets in “Europeans”? That’ll probably sway my answer between Asia / Europe. ---
**Author:** ![ZonexandScout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zonexandscout/32/544_2.png) [@ZonexandScout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZonexandScout)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2018, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/3 "2018-01-31T22:46:11Z")
The question is so vaguely phrased that I don’t believe there is a way to provide a sensible answer. What groups and cultures are to be included in “Europeans”? Over what time period? What kinds of damage? Overall, or on a per capita basis? I don’t mean to be threadshitting, but I think you need to be a bit more specific. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2018, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/4 "2018-01-31T22:57:13Z")
Damage to whom, specifically? ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2018, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/5 "2018-01-31T23:01:20Z")
“Europeans” aren’t really a meaningful group anyway. Some European countries were major colonial powers and did a lot of damage to their subject peoples percentage wise. Others weren’t. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2018, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/6 "2018-01-31T23:08:50Z")
“Residential schooling” looks rather out of place in that list. Care to explain? ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2018, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/7 "2018-01-31T23:14:04Z")
> [@BloodStalk](#): > > In regards to issues such as Native American/Australian genocide, residential schooling, African-American Slavery, institutional racism today, experiments on non Europeans subjects such as Tuskeegee sylphis or J.Marion sims, colonization of other parts of the world which still has issues today, Apartheid. Due to this, have Europeans done the most damage throughout history? You forgot to include polka and square dancing; Pauly Shore and Abba. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2018, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/8 "2018-01-31T23:20:58Z")
African-American Slavery? So we’re counting “has European ancestors but is not European themselves” as Europeans themselves for this exercise? In that case Africans have done the most damage throughout history - specifically whichever part of Africa homo sapiens emerged from. ---
**Author:** ![Clu-Me-In](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dfb087/32.png) [@Clu-Me-In](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clu-Me-In)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2018, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/9 "2018-01-31T23:30:08Z")
Pretty sure that he means Caucasian Europeans or “White” Europeans. ---
**Author:** ![BloodStalk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ee59a6/32.png) [@BloodStalk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BloodStalk)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2018, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/10 "2018-01-31T23:45:10Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > “Residential schooling” looks rather out of place in that list. Care to explain? Many native americans were taken from their homes and placed into schools with rampant abuse under the motto, kill the indian, save the child. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2018, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/11 "2018-01-31T23:49:05Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > “Residential schooling” looks rather out of place in that list. Care to explain? I think this Canadian example should be representative of the term in general, > [@](#): > > Residential schools were government-sponsored religious schools established to assimilate Indigenous children into Euro-Canadian culture.[RIGHT][CITE](https://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/residential-schools/)[/RIGHT] I’m disturbed by the ‘Tuskegee Study of Untreated Syphilis in the Negro Male’, as awful as it was, being an example of “the most damage throughout history”. :dubious: CMC fnord! ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2018, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/12 "2018-01-31T23:55:30Z")
> [@BloodStalk](#): > > In regards to issues such as Native American/Australian genocide, residential schooling, African-American Slavery, institutional racism today, experiments on non Europeans subjects such as Tuskeegee sylphis or J.Marion sims, colonization of other parts of the world which still has issues today, Apartheid. Due to this, have Europeans done the most damage throughout history? No. Even if you include the Nazis, Europeans are small fry compared with the Orientals. Genghis Khan and the Mongols slaughtered their way around Asia and Europe and Mao killed tens of millions. Pol Pot wasn’t exactly nice, and the Japanese in WW2 conducted experiments at which even Mengele would shudder. Then look at the Dalit / Untouchables of India and the racism of the Japanese. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/13 "2018-02-01T00:01:55Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > No. Even if you include the Nazis, Europeans are small fry compared with the Orientals. Genghis Khan and the Mongols slaughtered their way around Asia and Europe and Mao killed tens of millions. Pol Pot wasn’t exactly nice, and the Japanese in WW2 conducted experiments at which even Mengele would shudder. Then look at the Dalit / Untouchables of India and the racism of the Japanese. I don’t think we have great records of the mongol and mongol successors’ death toll, Chinese death tolls should probably be pro-rated for population size, and the death tolls following European colonization of most of the Americas (and some parts of Africa) are bigger than wmpeople often tend to realise. Up to 90% of indigenous new world people (involving pretty much total destruction of some ethnic groups) and 50% of the modern Democratic Congo and Namibia is pretty bad. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 7:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/14 "2018-02-01T07:45:13Z")
LOL, wypipo, amirite? Is it some sort of school vacay in Murica right now? Because as much as you all know I like to play “Blame Whitey”, even I find this is a bit silly. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/15 "2018-02-01T15:04:06Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > African-American Slavery? So we’re counting “has European ancestors but is not European themselves” as Europeans themselves for this exercise? > > In that case Africans have done the most damage throughout history - specifically whichever part of Africa homo sapiens emerged from. Europeans set up and started the African/American slave trade (as well as African/European slave trade). So we don’t need to jump through this hoop to absolve them. As to the OP: > [@](#): > > In regards to issues such as Native American/Australian genocide, residential schooling, African-American Slavery, institutional racism today, experiments on non Europeans subjects such as Tuskeegee sylphis or J.Marion sims, colonization of other parts of the world which still has issues today, Apartheid. Due to this, have Europeans done the most damage throughout history? Europe as a whole had the most global impact. I think this gets into something very similar to the ‘was religion the most destructive force in human history’ kind of thing. People tend to focus on the bad and forget the good. Certainly, Europeans caused a lot of harm, and the reach of their harm was global as opposed to the more localized (or short-term, thinking about the Mongols) and lasted for centuries if we look at Europe as a whole and patch together the various nations. But what they did also gave us the modern world, global trade and set up the structure that has taken more people out of poverty than at any time in history. So, you have to look at the good with the bad. Don’t get me wrong…Europeans caused a lot of harm. And I find a lot of the Europeans I know personally to be highly hypocritical and also tend to whitewash their own history while pointing at us uncouth Americans as doing the same (they love tossing rocks at our glass house). They didn’t invent slavery or the exploitation of natives while they built their various empires…they were just more efficient about them and did it at a time when they could have a global impact that wasn’t possible earlier in history. But I think along with saying they have done the most ‘damage’ (depending on how you define that) you have to give credit where credit is due and say they also expanded the human race and set the stage for the modern world we have today. The US, for example, is a basic extension of Europe, as is Australia and Canada. You could even say that China, South Korea and Japan were heavility influenced to become what they are today by Europe. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/16 "2018-02-01T17:07:20Z")
In regard to slavery, the Arab slave trade went on far longer, into the 20th century, and introduced a cruel wrinkle or two the Atlantic slave trade lacked; castration. The survival rate was very low. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/17 "2018-02-01T17:27:46Z")
Spend a weekend reading up on wars in Asia. Some of them rival or exceed anything Whitey has done. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/18 "2018-02-01T17:39:31Z")
Did Europeans invent any of the practices decried by the OP? Did Europeans invent slavery, or was it common in nearly every society around the world LONG before 1492? Were Europeans the first peoples to slaughter other nations, or was that common all over the world long before 1492? Were Europeans the first people to regard other cultures as inferior, or did EVERY society in history regard itself as the best on Earth, far superior to all the barbarians, long before 1492? ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/19 "2018-02-01T17:43:29Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Spend a weekend reading up on wars in Asia. Some of them rival or exceed anything Whitey has done. You might want to read up on some of the things ‘Whitey’ did in Asia. Wars aren’t the extent. Consider…where did Communism come from again? I think that has had a touch of impact on, oh, say China for instance. And that’s just one thing. Like I said, there is both good and bad associated with European colonialism as well as other European ideas and practices. But they aren’t limited to just the body count in war and the damage some of them have done is still being felt…as are the good aspects. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2018, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913/20 "2018-02-01T18:07:23Z")
> [@Hector\_St\_Clare](#): > > Up to 90% of indigenous new world people (involving pretty much total destruction of some ethnic groups) and 50% of the modern Democratic Congo and Namibia is pretty bad. 90% of the death of the Indians was due to diseases which though introduced by Europeans can not be said to have been actions of Europeans. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/have-europeans-done-the-most-damage-throughout-human-history/807913.md?page=2)