# Hawaii won't let Uber gouge customers **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [June 7, 2018, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592 "2018-06-07T03:18:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2018, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/41 "2018-06-07T19:46:18Z")
> [@Grrr](#): > > We’ve already gone over this. Maybe read your own thread before responding. I posted my reply after reading your post. I know of no requirement to check and see that others have already told you that your post was ill-conceived, but it’s gratifying to know that others called bullshit on bullshit as well. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2018, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/42 "2018-06-07T19:54:57Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > The exchange of money is not irrelevant; it’s the core of the transaction and what makes this a business and not “sharing”. Uber is a business that connects people looking to buy to people looking to sell. Just like Angieslist, Craigslist, and about a hundred other apps and websites out there. People know full well what they’re getting into. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2018, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/43 "2018-06-07T20:25:25Z")
> [@Grrr](#): > > Uber is a business that connects people looking to buy to people looking to sell. Just like Angieslist, Craigslist, and about a hundred other apps and websites out there. Yeah, it’s sort of like Angie’s List. The businesses on Angies List are subject to local laws about licenses, bonds, etc. Nobody argues with a straight face that because someone sells their services on Angie’s List that they are exempt from the laws that govern construction businesses that may not advertise on Angie’s List. But unlike Angie’s List or craigslist, Uber isn’t merely an advertising app. It is a business in and of itself, working with either employees or contractors who perform the work. If I hire a plumber from Angie’s List, that plumber is not an employee or contractor of Angie’s List. So they aren’t actually the same at all. ---
**Author:** ![Disheavel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e274bd/32.png) [@Disheavel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disheavel)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2018, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/44 "2018-06-07T21:58:22Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > Obviously some people in this thread aren’t aware of the details of Uber surge pricing. We’re not talking a 50% fee, we’re talking in some cases raising the price by 3x or more. They went to x9.9 on New Years Eve in NYC in 2016 and I’m sure you could find other stories about that sort of thing. I was just in Boston for a Convention and we hit surge 3.1 on Tuesday night. That being said, we waited 55 minutes for a cab to show up to a 4 star restaurant to pick up our business guests. As soon as they were in their cab, we requested on Uber and were in a car in 2 minutes (at 3.1x). With the Red Sox game and the convention, apparently Uber driver phones were pinging left and right and a huge red area was going for hours that night. My driver the next day said that he drove from 4.pm - 11.pm and never had more than 5 minutes without a rider in the car. He made more that night than he makes in a normal week. I think the fact that taxi cabs have in no significant way responded to Uber and Lyft shows just what a ridiculous monopoly taxis had, and it was time to be broken up. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2018, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/45 "2018-06-07T22:13:56Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Uber is acting as a de facto taxi business while avoiding the regulations that apply to taxi business by claiming it’s just a “ride sharing” service. Wah. :sniff: ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2018, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/46 "2018-06-07T22:35:15Z")
> [@Grrr](#): > > Uber is a business that connects people looking to buy to people looking to sell. Just like Angieslist, Craigslist, and about a hundred other apps and websites out there. This is incorrect: “people” are not selling anything; Uber is selling them a taxi/livery service. When “people” sell things, “people” set the prices and conditions. That’s why the drivers have been able to unionize: they are not independent contractors, they are employees. Your post serves as a fine example of how Uber’s business model is dependent on fraud and exploitation; thanks for that. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2018, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/47 "2018-06-07T23:08:29Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > This is incorrect: “people” are not selling anything; Uber is selling them a taxi/livery service. When “people” sell things, “people” set the prices and conditions. That’s why the drivers have been able to unionize: they are not independent contractors, they are employees. > > Your post serves as a fine example of how Uber’s business model is dependent on fraud and exploitation; thanks for that. Oh brother. Let’s just forget about the analogies. Bottom line is, what Uber is doing is awesome. Full stop. People doing business with Uber know exactly what they’re getting into and they’re fine with it. And they don’t need the government white knighting for them. I could really give two fucks about what regulations they are sidestepping or what their business model is doing to the taxi industry. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2018, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/48 "2018-06-07T23:14:06Z")
I don’t get the Uber hate. (unless you own a cab company) They provide a vastly superior service at a reasonable price, with full transparency on pricing. I’ve been ripped off by cab drivers, I’ve been in dirty and smelly cabs, I’ve had unsafe cab drivers, and I’ve had to wait forever for cabs on occasion. I’m sure all of these things are possible with Uber, but in about 100 Uber rides so far, I’ve never had a bad experience or been in a car that wasn’t spotless. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2018, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/49 "2018-06-07T23:15:46Z")
You might give a fuck or two if you’re in an accident in an Uber car and find out neither the driver’s nor your insurance will cover you injuries. Which has happened to people on occasion. Or do you check to see that your Uber driver has commercial driver’s insurance to cover them while conducting a business in their vehicle before you accept that ride? ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2018, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/50 "2018-06-07T23:22:55Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > You might give a fuck or two if you’re in an accident in an Uber car and find out neither the driver’s nor your insurance will cover you injuries. Which has happened to people on occasion. > > Or do you check to see that your Uber driver has commercial driver’s insurance to cover them while conducting a business in their vehicle before you accept that ride? I’m pretty sure they fixed that and Uber provides insurance “during the ride” that would cover passengers. Their website says at least $1 million in coverage, which is 10 times what local cabs are required to have. I think there might be a problem if they’re driving around waiting for a ride. If there is a gap there, they should fix it. ---
**Author:** ![Spiderman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiderman/32/230_2.png) [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2018, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/51 "2018-06-08T01:37:36Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > I’m pretty sure they fixed that and Uber provides insurance “during the ride” that would cover passengers. Their website says at least $1 million in coverage, which is 10 times what local cabs are required to have. I think there might be a problem if they’re driving around waiting for a ride. If there is a gap there, they should fix it. I’d bet that Uber requires the owner of the vehicle to have proper insurance. If you have a private policy & the insurance co finds out you’re using your vehicle for commercial purposes, whether Uber/Lyft or pizza delivery, then there goes your claim. If you don’t have valid primary insurance, then Uber’s secondary insurance doesn’t have to pay out because the driver didn’t meet the terms & conditions to drive for them. Which means the victim, even if you were just a pedestrian on the sidewalk, is SoL! With 50 different states insurance rules & multiple different companies, I bet some victim is going to get screwed…badly. Have we seen a life altering (loss of limb, paralysis, etc.) or fatal accident from Uber/Lyft where the driver didn’t have appropriate primary / commercial insurance yet? Even if it has happened, Uber might pick up the tab for the first one, or two, but when it becomes somewhat regular & gets expensive I don’t see them continuing the practice. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2018, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/52 "2018-06-08T03:23:54Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > You might give a fuck or two if you’re in an accident in an Uber car and find out neither the driver’s nor your insurance will cover you injuries. Which has happened to people on occasion. > > Or do you check to see that your Uber driver has commercial driver’s insurance to cover them while conducting a business in their vehicle before you accept that ride? [https://help.uber.com/h/6e7ac56f-a12b-440a-9e6e-83acea284b55?state=7jpFuL576VdDGCbfLu\_J53dK9ObckllJmKMMC7cmANk%3D&\_csid=zNvYkWBLWPj5W6NNibG4PA#\_](https://help.uber.com/h/6e7ac56f-a12b-440a-9e6e-83acea284b55?state=7jpFuL576VdDGCbfLu_J53dK9ObckllJmKMMC7cmANk%3D&_csid=zNvYkWBLWPj5W6NNibG4PA#_) > [@](#): > > Uber maintains automobile liability insurance on behalf of all U.S. rideshare driver-partners while logged onto the Uber app. > > As a ride-sharing driver, you are also required to maintain auto insurance that meets your state’s minimum financial responsibility. > > Driver-partners who have a livery or limo business must maintain all compulsory licensing and commercial insurance requirements in accordance with state or local law. and this [https://www.uber.com/newsroom/an-update-on-insurance/](https://www.uber.com/newsroom/an-update-on-insurance/) > [@](#): > > Beginning March 1, along with James River and Progressive, Allstate and Farmers Insurance will be our chosen commercial insurance providers for the millions of ridesharing trips Uber connects between drivers and riders every day in the US. We are proud to work with some of the most innovative and trusted insurance companies bringing their industry-leading experience to riders and drivers. > > Every Uber driver-partner is covered while online; from the moment a driver turns on the app to wait for a trip request, while driving to pick up a rider, and until the trip ends. There is also protection for riders during an Uber trip. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2018, 6:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/53 "2018-06-08T06:51:13Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Good. More businesses need to side step certain regulations. So you’re arguing it’s okay to break the law as long as there’s money to be made? ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2018, 7:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/54 "2018-06-08T07:34:21Z")
If they fixed that then great - but it’s an example of how Uber doesn’t do jack unless forced to do so. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2018, 10:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/55 "2018-06-08T10:56:07Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > I don’t get the Uber hate. Union worship. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2018, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/56 "2018-06-08T11:59:33Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > If they fixed that then great - but it’s an example of how Uber doesn’t do jack unless forced to do so. There was nothing broken about that. I still don’t understand how this helps taxi cabs. If they wanted to do that, they should force Uber to always charge surge rates! As I said above, the only reason I would take a taxi these days is if I had time to spare and I felt the surge price vs the taxi price was enough of a difference that I decided to take a taxi instead for its price advantage. That advantage has now been removed, so why would I take a taxi? Why in the hell would you want your competition to be forced to charge _less_? Is the hope that forcing them to not allow surge pricing supposed to work by driving them out of the market because of lower profits or something? That’s the only way this remotely makes a lick of sense to me, but I don’t think that’s going to have an effect in this regard. Look, if you want to regulate ride sharing services, hey, go for it (and I’m not against some sort of licensing/regulations, though I support these services), but I don’t see how a half-ass measure like this is supposed to work. It doesn’t incentivize using cabs at all; in fact, quite the opposite. I personally, for reasons \*\* Procrustus\*\* stated above, would gladly pay _more_ for an Uber or Lyft than a taxi. It’s not about money to me. But for those who are price sensitive, how is this supposed to help taxi companies out? ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2018, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/57 "2018-06-08T14:08:18Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > Union worship. I love labor unions. Cab divers are treated like shit by cab owners. Uber is no worse, and probably usually better. If Uber driers unionize, all the better . ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2018, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/58 "2018-06-08T14:13:57Z")
> [@Spiderman](#): > > I’d bet that Uber requires the owner of the vehicle to have proper insurance. If you have a private policy & the insurance co finds out you’re using your vehicle for commercial purposes, whether Uber/Lyft or pizza delivery, then there goes your claim. If you don’t have valid primary insurance, then Uber’s secondary insurance doesn’t have to pay out because the driver didn’t meet the terms & conditions to drive for them. Which means the victim, even if you were just a pedestrian on the sidewalk, is SoL! > > With 50 different states insurance rules & multiple different companies, I bet some victim is going to get screwed…badly. > Have we seen a life altering (loss of limb, paralysis, etc.) or fatal accident from Uber/Lyft where the driver didn’t have appropriate primary / commercial insurance yet? Even if it has happened, Uber might pick up the tab for the first one, or two, but when it becomes somewhat regular & gets expensive I don’t see them continuing the practice. [And how would anyone know?](https://www.uber.com/legal/terms/us/) ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2018, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/59 "2018-06-08T14:17:30Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Look, if you want to regulate ride sharing services, hey, go for it They aren’t engaged in “ridesharing”; they are a taxi/livery service. It’s really difficult to have a meaningful conversation when nonsense words are used in place of actual words. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2018, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592/60 "2018-06-08T14:32:45Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > They aren’t engaged in “ridesharing”; they are a taxi/livery service. > > It’s really difficult to have a meaningful conversation when nonsense words are used in place of actual words. > **[Dictionary.com | Meanings & Definitions of English Words](https://www.dictionary.com/browse/ridesharing?s=t)** > > The world's leading online dictionary: English definitions, synonyms, word origins, example sentences, word games, and more. A trusted authority for 25+ years! > [@](#): > > adjective Also ride·share. > > ``` > of or relating to the sharing of rides or transportation, especially among commuters: The agency was set up to devise a ridesharing program. > > ``` > > \*\* of or relating to a car service with which a person uses a smartphone app to arrange a ride in a usually privately owned vehicle.\*\* [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaii-wont-let-uber-gouge-customers/815592.md?page=4)