# Hawaiian dopers are native Hawaiians so bad off they're actively discouraging tourism ? apparently celebrities are getting called out over it **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 31, 2023, 8:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853 "2023-07-31T08:16:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![CairoCarol](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cairocarol/32/3825_2.png) [@CairoCarol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairoCarol)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2023, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/21 "2023-08-01T22:07:15Z")
You are characterizing Hawaiian culture as if it is nothing but a relic of the past, that stopped developing when Captain Cook landed. To think of Hawaiian culture as nothing but outmoded methods of subsistence farming and hunting is like assuming that Western cultures are best characterized by how their people lived in 1200AD. Hawaiian culture is not static. It didn’t stop just because outsiders arrived. Many forces, both deliberate (such as the outlawing of the use of 'Ōlelo Hawai’i, the native language, and the largely successful attempts by missionaries to convert everyone to Christianity) and accidental, have acted to quash Hawaiian culture. But it lives on and has continued to adapt, change, and grow. Ancient Hawaiians wouldn’t recognize much of today’s Hawaiian music - that doesn’t make it any less rooted in Hawaiian culture, just because the ukulele is influenced by Portuguese instruments. A native Hawaiian group might advocate for change using strategies that are most effective within the Western-imposed system of justice; that doesn’t make their position any less fundamentally Hawaiian. Hawaiians may have a sophisticated understanding of how to protect habitat for endangered species that builds on research done by people from civilizations beyond Hawaii; that doesn’t make the authenticity of their core values, to _mālama 'āina_ (care for the land), any less. Western cultures evolve as conditions evolve and new influences appear. Indigenous cultures do as well. Yes, some cultures have been irretrievably lost because they’ve been overwhelmed by outsiders. But not Hawaiian culture - it faces challenges for sure, but it exists in a completely contemporary form. ---
**Author:** ![CairoCarol](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cairocarol/32/3825_2.png) [@CairoCarol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairoCarol)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2023, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/22 "2023-08-01T22:17:48Z")
> [@Jasmine](#): > > How would having no tourists benefit the natives? They wouldn’t see their once pristine and untamed land turned into enormous resorts that consume vast amounts of resources, drive up prices, and destroy habitat for native species. The wouldn’t have to fight for a spot at beaches overrun by tourists, or have no place to park on their own streets because so many tourists were there. If I were feeling eloquent (I’m not, and I have to go out soon) I could say much more. But you get the idea. Tourism is at best a mixed bag. Yes, it’s hard to imagine that Hawai’i can survive without it. But that doesn’t mean that it should be allowed to overrun and destroy what makes Hawai’i unique and beautiful. There is a big push right now toward “regenerative tourism.” I don’t personally know a lot about it, in particular whether it is only a pipe dream with little to no chance of changing the tourism industry in Hawai’i for the better. But it is certainly getting attention and seems like the ethical approach. ---
**Author:** ![3AxisCtrl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/3/ecd19e/32.png) [@3AxisCtrl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/3AxisCtrl)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2023, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/23 "2023-08-01T22:55:06Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > The Mauna Loa telescopes … They’re actually on Mauna Kea. Well worth visiting if you’re on the Big Island. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2023, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/24 "2023-08-01T23:03:12Z")
When I visited Hawaii, you couldn’t visit the telescope because of the protests. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2023, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/25 "2023-08-01T23:43:42Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > you couldn’t visit the telescope because of the protests. They don’t want anyone to go up there even without protests. There’s no visitor facilities up on top. The air is pretty thin and people will be getting altitude sickness. And the car rental argeement you signed says that’s off limits for those cars. ---
**Author:** ![3AxisCtrl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/3/ecd19e/32.png) [@3AxisCtrl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/3AxisCtrl)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/26 "2023-08-02T00:14:32Z")
> [@dtilque](#): > > There’s no visitor facilities up on top. Partially true. The [Onizuka Center for International Astronomy Visitor Information Station](https://hilo.hawaii.edu/maunakea/visitor-information/station) is located on the access road at an elevation just above 9000’. That website says that visitors in questionable health should not proceed higher. If you do proceed on to the top (~13,800’) you won’t find any formal visitor facilities, but it’s well worth parking and walking around - spectacular views. I recall that the Keck Telescope had open doors and a small lobby with displays obviously aimed at visitors. > [@](#): > > The air is pretty thin and people will be getting altitude sickness. Not a high risk for fit people in generally good health. You should be ready to head down promptly if anyone shows symptoms. Remember to take warm clothing. > [@](#): > > And the car rental argeement you signed says that’s off limits for those cars. In practice, what this means is that if you have a problem, the tow & other costs are entirely your responsibility. Despite what you might hear, the road (though unpaved) is suitable for 2WD vehicles. The driver definitely needs to know how to descend a (very, very) long hill without cooking the brakes. ---
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/27 "2023-08-02T00:36:56Z")
Here is another article on Hawaii overtourism, driven by [Southwest Airlines’ entry into the market in 2019](https://www.sfgate.com/travel/article/hawaii-travel-changed-by-southwest-pandemic-18265282.php?IPID=SFGate-HP-CP-Spotlight). _The landscape was forever altered just four years ago when Southwest Airlines began flying routes to Hawaii from the West Coast. The airline is credited with single-handedly increasing tourism by providing its customers with a low-cost access to the islands._ ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/28 "2023-08-02T00:39:30Z")
> [@3AxisCtrl](#): > > They’re actually on Mauna Kea. Thanks, I always get the Maunas mixed up. What did the protestors have against the telescopes? And I’ve heard that the naked-eye view of the skies up there looks about like what you’d see from a city… until you take a puff from your supplemental oxygen bottle, and the heavens open up. Apparently, a loss of dim-light sensitivity is one of the first symptoms of low oxygen. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/29 "2023-08-02T00:51:05Z")
> [@CairoCarol](#): > > You are characterizing Hawaiian culture as if it is nothing but a relic of the past, that stopped developing when Captain Cook landed. To think of Hawaiian culture as nothing but outmoded methods of subsistence farming and hunting is like assuming that Western cultures are best characterized by how their people lived in 1200AD. Good points overall. It seems in many of these discussions, the natives want to live as if they had never encountered Westerners. Doubtless Hawaiian society and culture from e.g 1780 would have changed some between then and 2020 had they and Westerners somehow never crossed paths. But I will argue that the differences of natural Hawaiian cultural evolution over those ~250 years are utterly swamped by the adaptions they’ve had to make to first 1780s Western culture and to the far faster rate of cultural and economic change in the same 250 years of _Western_ evolution. Plus of course the large number of immigrants which make them a minority, and a somewhat downtrodden minority, in their own homeland. That has cultural, social, and economic impact far beyond the mere numbers. To stretch a phrase, I don’t doubt that native Hawaiians today have Western culture with Hawaiian characteristics. But Hawaiian culture today is not what it would have been had Captain Cook and all subsequent visitors followed Captain Kirk’s Prime Directive, rather than exploiting whatever they could. What I am utterly unqualified to talk about is whether and to what degree the Native Hawaiians, or other indigenous people around the world, want to retain or go back to their pre-encounter world. Or whether they’re trying to live a mostly western life overlapped with mild (or major) Native characteristics. And do they think that’s good enough? Genuine enough? Or are they pining for the lost Old Ways and mostly going through the motions of keeping a separate culture alive? ---
**Author:** ![3AxisCtrl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/3/ecd19e/32.png) [@3AxisCtrl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/3AxisCtrl)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/30 "2023-08-02T01:09:27Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > What did the protestors have against the telescopes? The standard answer is that the mountain is considered sacred - building things there is sacrilegious. A cynical view (heard from a guy who worked at one of the telescopes) is that the threat of blocking access to multi-billion-dollar facilities can yield financially attractive concessions (e.g. donations to other causes the protesters support). > [@](#): > > Apparently, a loss of dim-light sensitivity is one of the first symptoms of low oxygen. I can verify this, from experience in a small airplane at night. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Knig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@Typo\_Knig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Knig)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/31 "2023-08-02T01:12:19Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > > [@3AxisCtrl](#): > > > > They’re actually on Mauna Kea. > > Thanks, I always get the Maunas mixed up. > > What did the protestors have against the telescopes? > > And I’ve heard that the naked-eye view of the skies up there looks about like what you’d see from a city… until you take a puff from your supplemental oxygen bottle, and the heavens open up. Apparently, a loss of dim-light sensitivity is one of the first symptoms of low oxygen. I think there are some telescopes and other facilities on Mauna Loa, as well. Or I could be mixing up my locations. An astronomer friend said the same thing about the night sky view form the mountain top. But astronomers rarely travel to telescopes anymore. Their work is done remotely, just the staff has to be there. The staff does not want many cars near the 'scopes, so they can keep the air clear and keep smog from building up on the mirrors. Re: Protests, it was a very frustrating situation for the astronomers, who got all the required permits from the local government, and had worked with native groups during the planning phase. Then around the time of groundbreaking, other native groups protested. I’m not saying they’re wrong, it was just unexpected since the telescope folks followed the process. I understand that the protestors considered the mountain sacred, and the TMT was just too much for them. Imagine the French reaction if the charred remains of Notre Dame de Paris was permitted to be turned into a radio telescope lab, and maybe the rest of central Paris later since it was an ideal location for such things. Luckily for the French, central Paris is not a singularly great place to put radio telescopes. I suspect future telescopes my be built on the Azores, assuming there are not the same issues there. ETA: Ninja’ed! Or is that cultural appropriation 😉 ---
**Author:** ![3AxisCtrl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/3/ecd19e/32.png) [@3AxisCtrl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/3AxisCtrl)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/32 "2023-08-02T01:23:49Z")
> [@Typo\_Knig](#): > > I think there are some telescopes and other facilities on Mauna Loa, as well. No - there’s not even a road to the top. Unlike Mauna Kea (dormant), Mauna Loa is an active volcano. Over the past ~200 years, it has averaged an eruption every 5 years. Last one was in 2022. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/33 "2023-08-02T01:27:59Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > It seems in many of these discussions, the natives want to live as if they had never encountered Westerners. …where in these discussions have indigenous peoples ever said anything like this? ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/34 "2023-08-02T03:16:52Z")
That kinda jumped out at me, too. I’m hardly an expert, but i did eavesdrop on a lot of Hawaiians when i visited Hawaii, and they have some complaints, but “I’d rather live like it’s 1780” was not among them. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/35 "2023-08-02T03:44:55Z")
…what indigenous people largely want are: - that all treaties and agreements are honoured and respected - acknowledgement of historic wrongs, and how those historic wrongs have lead to the situation we have today where indigenous folks generally are more likely to be unhoused (in Hawaii they are 265% more likely to not have a home), poorer health outcomes, poorer education outcomes, more likely to end up in prison…etc, and to listen to indigenous people on the best way to fix this - Recognize that “the control of the tourism industry and its policies is in the hands of largely American and Japanese business interests” and that indigenous folk are kept out of both the decision-making process and the generated wealth For more info check here: > **[Paradise Lost - The Damage Done by the Tourism Industry in Hawai'i — SnoQap](https://www.snoqap.com/posts/2022/8/29/paradise-lost-the-damage-done-by-the-tourism-industry-in-hawaii)** > > For decades, people from the mainland U.S. and abroad have seen Hawai’i as an island paradise of beautiful beaches, local generosity, and stunning vistas. This has led to a massive tourist industry across almost all of the Hawaiian Islands which sees... As for the article in the OP: when I clicked it the story was no longer available, but a search for the headline suggests it was originally published by the Daily Mail, that the story is framed around a couple of anonymous Tweets, and it largely misses the point, which isn’t a surprise for the Daily Fail. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/36 "2023-08-02T03:52:23Z")
> [@Typo\_Knig](#): > > I think there are some telescopes and other facilities on Mauna Loa, as well. Or I could be mixing up my locations. As @3AxisCtrl says, there’s none there. You’re probably thinking of Haleakala on Maui. > **[Haleakalā Observatory](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haleakal%C4%81_Observatory)** > > The Haleakalā Observatory, also known as the Haleakalā High Altitude Observatory Site, is Hawaii's first astronomical research observatory. It is located on the island of Maui and is owned by the Institute for Astronomy of the University of Hawaiʻi, which operates some of the facilities on the site and leases portions to other organizations. Tenants include the Air Force Research Laboratory (AFRL) and the Las Cumbres Observatory Global Telescope Network (LCOGTN). At over 3,050 meters (10,010 f Th... ---
**Author:** ![CairoCarol](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cairocarol/32/3825_2.png) [@CairoCarol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairoCarol)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/37 "2023-08-02T03:59:46Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > …what indigenous people largely want are: > > - that all treaties and agreements are honoured and respected > - acknowledgement of historic wrongs, and how those historic wrongs have lead to the situation we have today where indigenous folks generally are more likely to be unhoused (in Hawaii they are 265% more likely to not have a home), poorer health outcomes, poorer education outcomes, more likely to end up in prison…etc, and to listen to indigenous people on the best way to fix this > - Recognize that “the control of the tourism industry and its policies is in the hands of largely American and Japanese business interests” and that indigenous folk are kept out of both the decision-making process and the generated wealth Excellent post and abso-fucking-lutely on the mark, to my non-indigenous, but hopefully reasonably honorable ally-who-wants-assist-in-the-background-while-Indigenous-people-lead-everything ears. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Knig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@Typo\_Knig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Knig)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/38 "2023-08-02T04:03:28Z")
Thank you both! I sit corrected! ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 11:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/39 "2023-08-02T11:01:43Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > The deep problem for any “native” culture anywhere is that it comes from a low population density state of near economic stasis. Subsistence farming / gathering / hunting and a few locally traded handicrafts is about it. Even developed/prospering locales are complaining. Jobs aside, heavy tourism overloads local infrastructure and resources. During tourism seasons (spring and fall) in Kyoto, there are long lines for restaurants and buses, and the tourist destinations are so packed that it can be hard for Japanese folks themselves to get in for a look. > **[Japan is ‘rammed’ with visitors – and Chinese tourists aren’t even back yet](https://www.scmp.com/week-asia/economics/article/3216975/japan-rammed-tourists-and-chinese-visitors-arent-even-back-full-force)** > > While firms are pleased to see post-pandemic visitors there is concern that issues including cultural misunderstandings and overcrowding will also return en masse. Many places in Europe are dealing with similar issues: > **[Tourists Go Home! Fed Up With Over-tourism, European Hotspots Impose Bans,...](https://www.forbes.com/sites/ceciliarodriguez/2023/07/31/tourists-go-home-fed-up-with-over-tourism-european-hotspots-impose-bans-fines-taxes-and-traps/?sh=66d789ef65f5)** > > Mass tourism in many iconic European destinations has sparked an intense backlash as towns and cities apply severe restrictions. Here are some of the most recent. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2023, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853/40 "2023-08-02T12:19:12Z")
Good points and an excellent post but, at least according to the few natives I talked to there, tourism isn’t the the reason many natives have had to leave the islands and live in places like Nevada. The reason is the wealthy and privileged who have driven real estate prices so high that many Hawaiian citizens simply can’t afford to live there. I was at an outdoor cafe where a young brother and sister in their twenties were entertaining patrons with ukulele music. I engaged them in conversation and was shocked at some of the things they told me. They were living in a home designed for 4 people but was housing 12 people who all had at least one job. It took their combined financial efforts to maintain that residence. Goods were sky high, but mostly because of the fact that Hawaii is 2,000 miles from anywhere. On tours there, much was said about the “invasives” and their effect on that beautiful habitat. Unfortunately, we can’t put the toothpaste back in the tube, and even eliminating tourism entirely can’t fix the problem. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hawaiian-dopers-are-native-hawaiians-so-bad-off-theyre-actively-discouraging-tourism-apparently-celebrities-are-getting-called-out-over-it/987853.md?page=3)