# Health Care Decision - Feet-In-Mouth, Hypocrites and Lying Liars **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 28, 2012, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-decision-feet-in-mouth-hypocrites-and-lying-liars/626588 "2012-06-28T15:45:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Uncle\_Jocko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uncle_jocko/32/2932_2.png) [@Uncle\_Jocko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uncle_Jocko)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2012, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-decision-feet-in-mouth-hypocrites-and-lying-liars/626588/81 "2012-06-29T15:33:07Z")
> [@L. G. Butts](#): > > If yes, well good for you, but the majority of Americans with no insurance still go to the emergency room and get treated, driving up the health care costs for me and increasing my taxes. You see, hospitals are required to treat you by law whether you have insurance or not or can afford it or not. They defray the costs of covering people like you by increasing the cost of the procedures they perform on people like me (who has always has insurance whether employed or not) and by getting money from the government (which pays them by taxing my income and property and whatnot). So it’s all great that you state you will do without healthcare if you can’t afford it, but I don’t believe you because that is not how it has worked in practice. I, for one, am glad the government is forcing you to be a responsible member of our society instead of a free rider on my hard work. The conservative/Tea Party angle on this issue is interesting, yet baffling to me. Do they not realize that all of us who have insurance, or pay for health care in any way, are already being “forced” to subsidize the health care of those who don’t pay at the ER? People can’t choose to totally opt-out of the health care system, not really. They may claim they have the “Amurrican Freedom!” right to go it alone and conquer the plains without interference from the librul govmint, but as soon as they contract Lyme disease from all the deer ticks out there, they’re at the hospital getting their medicine … and ALL of us are paying for that. So, a government-sponsored plan to improve the status quo (by bringing in the majority of Americans under the coverage/premium umbrella) is SOCIALISTIC UNCONSTITUTIONAL UNAMERICAN EVIL (even though the premiums/proceeds are still going to private enterprise capitalists who run the insurance and health care businesses) … but forcing those of us who already purchase insurance on our own to subsidize the free-riders exerting their God-given right to not buy insurance is hunky-dory A-OK American can-do-it-ness. Gotcha. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2012, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-decision-feet-in-mouth-hypocrites-and-lying-liars/626588/82 "2012-06-29T18:03:10Z")
> [@LoonyMoon](#): > > What I object to about ObamaCare is that it is being forced on us when so many of us been pretty clear that we don’t want it. > > . Not wanting it would only be a morallly valid option if you were living in a country were you would be left to die if you couldn’t afford to pay for health services. You don’t live in such a country. As a result “not wantring it” just means that you want to be and stay a free rider. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2012, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-decision-feet-in-mouth-hypocrites-and-lying-liars/626588/83 "2012-06-29T20:14:32Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > People who otherwise might have died will live. Perhaps more importantly, people who would have otherwise suffered needlessly will be healthy. What’s the problem, again? Great. Let’s outlaw alcohol tomorrow, and enforce the law with vigor. Few people will be drinking and driving, fewer people dying of liver disease. You in? ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2012, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-decision-feet-in-mouth-hypocrites-and-lying-liars/626588/84 "2012-06-29T20:17:28Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > You’d learn more and faster by actually _using_ the abilities you are blessed with, instead of waiting for people to tell you something you don’t find comfortable to hear. You can’t expect the rest of us to fight your ignorance \*for \*you all by ourselves; you have to take the lead role yourself. YOU made a claim. Back it up. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2012, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-decision-feet-in-mouth-hypocrites-and-lying-liars/626588/85 "2012-06-29T20:22:21Z")
It’s really weird how Magellan’s ideological conditioning keeps him from understanding that not having a mortgage and paying higher taxes is the same as not having health insurance and paying higher taxes. It’s like he literally is unable to process information when it conflicts with his imaginary, world-view. Maybe this is why he can’t understand that SSM isn’t a bad thing. Maybe he’s so broken and beholden to his ideology that he simply can’t face reality, much less process it and form understandings that conflict with his delusions. It’s sad. He’s like a clockwork man with a stripped gear. Lurching around, inept and unseeing. Just existing, with nothing happening behind his eyes but the same reel of tape playing over and over. Poor thing. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2012, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-decision-feet-in-mouth-hypocrites-and-lying-liars/626588/86 "2012-06-29T20:46:51Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > People who otherwise might have died will live. Perhaps more importantly, people who would have otherwise suffered needlessly will be healthy. What’s the problem, again? > [@](#): > > Update: Rock Perry has weighed in on the issue, in his usual understated manner: > > > [@](#): > > > > This ruling will be a stomach punch to the American economy. It is a shocking disappointment to freedom-loving Americans desperate to get our country back on track. Obamacare is bad for the economy, bad for health care, bad for freedom. Americans have made clear their overwhelming opposition to its convoluted, burdensome and overreaching mandates. > > > > Freedom was frontally attacked by passage of this monstrosity - and the Court utterly failed in its duty to uphold the Constitutional limits placed on Washington. Now that the Supreme Court has abandoned us, we citizens must take action at every level of government and demand real reform, done with respect for our Constitution and our liberty. From [The Houston Press](http://blogs.houstonpress.com/hairballs/2012/06/scotus_obamacare_cnn_effing_up.php). Yes, I confirmed that those are Ricky Boy’s words. Elsewhere, he’s also pointing out Romney’s weakness, due to “Romneycare.” And claims he’ll be working to beat Obama–but he’s really hoping that Romney loses; he’ll be glad to accept the nomination, next time! (Really–I live here but don’t know a soul who’s ever had a good thing to say about the idiot.) ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2012, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-decision-feet-in-mouth-hypocrites-and-lying-liars/626588/87 "2012-06-29T21:02:41Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Etc. There’s a slightly-different brand of fool that believes the need for health care is optional. Tell us, what happens when you decide not to insure yourself, and you get hit by a bus or diagnosed with metastatic cancer or something else serious? Do you say “Well, that’s the choice I made, I’m responsible, now goodbye, cruel world”? Of course not. You depend on _the rest of us_ to provide the care you need, via the extra costs we pay for emergency care for the uninsured. \*You \*are not the one taking responsibility for your life and health. _Those who do pay_ are. How have Democrats lost the opportunity to scream this from the rooftops? I mean, this sounds like it would appeal to the staunchest of Rush listening Republicans. How has there been a complete failure to get this concept out there? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2012, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-decision-feet-in-mouth-hypocrites-and-lying-liars/626588/88 "2012-06-29T21:54:12Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > YOU made a claim. Back it up. Would it make a difference if I did? :rolleyes: This is on the level of being demanded to prove that water is wet. Some ignorance is simply beyond our poor power to fight effectively, out here in the reality-based community. It’s only good for pointing at and chuckling ruefully. Yours, for instance. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2012, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-decision-feet-in-mouth-hypocrites-and-lying-liars/626588/89 "2012-06-29T23:31:52Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Great. Let’s outlaw alcohol tomorrow, and enforce the law with vigor. Few people will be drinking and driving, fewer people dying of liver disease. You in? Prohibition _did_ reduce alcohol consumption. The problems with it were in the “unintended consequences” area. What are the unintended consequences of Obamacare? ---
**Author:** ![gamerunknown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6bbea6/32.png) [@gamerunknown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gamerunknown)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2012, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-decision-feet-in-mouth-hypocrites-and-lying-liars/626588/90 "2012-07-01T00:12:46Z")
> [@Bob Ducca](#): > > Foreigner pretending to be American to bitch about our politics detected. Oh, I’m guilty of that too. I have citizenship, but have no desire to live in a country without public healthcare. ---
**Author:** ![jshore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b5e925/32.png) [@jshore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jshore)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2012, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-decision-feet-in-mouth-hypocrites-and-lying-liars/626588/91 "2012-07-02T01:06:25Z")
> [@jasg](#): > > [Here](http://www.kaiserhealthnews.org/Graphics/2010/022310-Bill-comparison.aspx) is a good comparison of the 1993 Republican proposal and the 2010 PPACA. …although I am sure some Republicans would say that Chafee was a RINO (Republican in Name Only). What I think is even more telling is the fact that the individual mandate [was originally put forth as an idea by the Heritage Foundation](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/chris-weigant/the-individual-mandates-c_b_1386716.html), a think-tank about as far from the Left as you can get. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-decision-feet-in-mouth-hypocrites-and-lying-liars/626588.md?page=4)