# Health care horror story #13848732 **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 26, 2009, 8:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612 "2009-12-26T08:01:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 31
**Author:** ![spinky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@spinky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spinky)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2010, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/601 "2010-01-30T06:59:56Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > No, if you would go back and actually read what I wrote, you will see that experience has taught me that when people say they cannot afford X and want the taxpayer to provide it, generally that means they just don’t want to have to pay for it. Hey, dummy. When you write “You say X, I hear Y,” you are explicitly **announcing** your assumption that when someone says X, they actually mean Y. So when you say, “He says ‘can’t afford’, I hear ‘I have this car payment, I like to party on Fridays and Saturdays’, etc,” you are making the assumption that the reason he can’t afford health care is that he spent the money on stuff like car payments and partying. Because you’re a fucking jerk. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2010, 8:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/602 "2010-01-30T08:08:20Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > No excuse - at fourteen I knew stealing was wrong. Good for you! Back then I didn’t yet realize that stealing from big corporations was really stealing. I suppose that would be something good parents would teach their kid. > [@Meyer6](#): > > Wait a minute, a few pages back you said you left home at 18 and that after about age 10 your Dad was making good money. So why the napkin sandwiches at 14? Please don’t tell me this was just something you did for kicks as a teen. Funny how you only remember little bits. Remember that bit about abuse? That included not bothering to give me anything to eat for lunch or on weekends at times. I also ran away from home a couple of times. Regarding this - “I know which ones won’t teach them to be responsible for themselves and to quit expecting “someone else” to fix their lives. Funny how all of your ideas seem to foster dependence - why is that?” - note that I didn’t say that _all_ of the things you listed won’t teach them responsibility. Why are you fixated on education out of that? > [@](#): > > ETA - the idea that you are striking ‘fear’ into us is _hilarious_, thanks for the laugh. I never said I was striking fear into anyone - the assumptions you jump to get wilder each time! However, it is a fairly common reaction that people who are afraid of things strike out randomly and irrationally, which is what you all tend to do. It appears that you are afraid to look at any opinions or ideas that don’t match yours. Sad way to live. > [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Your ignorance on display yet again. [The “I” stands for insurance.](http://www.ssa.gov/pgm/links_disability.htm) How is it you don’t know this? Clearly, we cannot depend on anything you say. Oh gosh, my tendency to be a human and make mistakes has been found out! Whatever will I do! And good on you for pointing out something that is really immaterial to the central point of that post, which is the fact I pay income tax on that. ---
**Author:** ![spinky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@spinky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spinky)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2010, 9:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/603 "2010-01-30T09:49:45Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Regarding this - “I know which ones won’t teach them to be responsible for themselves and to quit expecting “someone else” to fix their lives. Funny how all of your ideas seem to foster dependence - why is that?” - note that I didn’t say that _all_ of the things you listed won’t teach them responsibility. You said that **all** of his ideas (including public education) foster dependence, and then later you claimed that you never said public education fosters dependence. He is calling you out on that lie. So now that we’ve established that you are a liar and will denounce your own statements at the drop of a hat, which one is it? Do you think public education fosters dependence or not? ---
**Author:** ![Idle\_Thoughts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/838e76/32.png) [@Idle\_Thoughts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idle_Thoughts)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2010, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/604 "2010-01-30T20:38:45Z")
Curlcoat is a troll! Give it up people! She knows she’s lying. She just wants the last word! ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2010, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/605 "2010-01-30T22:17:34Z")
As long as the last words are “napkin sandwich”, I’m good. ---
**Author:** ![Meyer6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@Meyer6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meyer6)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2010, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/606 "2010-01-31T00:38:28Z")
Okay, a review about napkin sandwiches (potential band name - I think so!): In the monster thread _Anything else you motherfuckers need?_, there was this discussion between **curlcoat** and **cwthree** : > [@curlcoat](#): > > I was simply too busy trying to stay alive to be able to go to college > [@cwthree](#): > > Too busy trying to stay alive? Unless you were living in a cardboard box under a bridge, I don’t believe that. People put themselves through school even if it means living in lousy circumstances for a while, if school is important to them. > [@curlcoat](#): > > As I said, don’t care what you wish to believe. If you experiences don’t include having to eat napkin sandwiches and live in unheated houses on the Canadian border, then maybe you can’t understand what “busy trying to stay alive” means. Thus placing the napkin sandwich experience firmly in the college-age years, when she was somehow practically starving and freezing while earning minimum wage (and if you didn’t make the whole $400/month, curly, whose fault was that? You should have worked harder). But now, suddenly, the napkin sandwiches have moved back in time to when she was 14, in order to make it seem less obviously stealing and to make her parents seem more cruel. Yep, she lies. The longer she keeps talking the more lies will come out. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2010, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/607 "2010-01-31T05:21:45Z")
I’ll be happy to forego the revelation of further lies if it means she’ll stop talking… ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2010, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/608 "2010-01-31T05:39:01Z")
> [@ntucker](#): > > Hey, dummy. When you write “You say X, I hear Y,” you are explicitly **announcing** your assumption that when someone says X, they actually mean Y. So when you say, “He says ‘can’t afford’, I hear ‘I have this car payment, I like to party on Fridays and Saturdays’, etc,” you are making the assumption that the reason he can’t afford health care is that he spent the money on stuff like car payments and partying. Because you’re a fucking jerk. It’s so cute when you show you can’t understand the printed word and/or English. Note the word “generally” in what you quoted - it makes a big difference. Also, even if I do assume that someone would rather party than buy insurance, the fact that I asked, in order to give whoeverthatwas the opportunity that he was actually unable to afford insurance, shows that I don’t automatically apply my bias to all situations. Unlike many here. > [@](#): > > You said that **all** of his ideas (including public education) foster dependence, and then later you claimed that you never said public education fosters dependence. He is calling you out on that lie. So now that we’ve established that you are a liar and will denounce your own statements at the drop of a hat, which one is it? Do you think public education fosters dependence or not? Again, you missed some of the words in what I wrote in your rush to try to “prove” me a liar. However, I will answer you question - no. > [@Idle\_Thoughts](#): > > Curlcoat is a troll! Give it up people! > She knows she’s lying. She just wants the last word! You really have some sort of major attraction to me don’t you? Following me around just to post your thoughts on me. Wow. > [@Meyer6](#): > > Thus placing the napkin sandwich experience firmly in the college-age years, No, it’s just amazing what you assume. My years of “busy staying alive” spanned more than the classic college-age years. Some of them included prior to 18 years of age. > [@](#): > > (and if you didn’t make the whole $400/month, curly, whose fault was that? You should have worked harder). If the hours/jobs aren’t available, how hard I worked is immaterial. > [@kaylasdad99](#): > > I’ll be happy to forego the revelation of further lies if it means she’ll stop talking… Well, since no lies have been revealed, I’d say that maybe you should stop talking? Since your only contribution to this is to complain? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2010, 6:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/609 "2010-01-31T06:14:38Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > If the hours/jobs aren’t available, how hard I worked is immaterial. What do you mean “aren’t available”? You just didn’t try hard enough to find work! Lazy, entitlement-using slob! You should have been out there 18 hours a day,finding more work that was clearly there! Next you’ll be telling us that its NOT the fault of the current crop of unemployed that they don’t have good jobs that have healthcare!! And we all know, you think that it’s someone’s fault if they did not plan sufficiently. ETA: Napkin Sandwich ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2010, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/610 "2010-01-31T06:31:05Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > What do you mean “aren’t available”? You just didn’t try hard enough to find work! Lazy, entitlement-using slob! You should have been out there 18 hours a day,finding more work that was clearly there! [Check out these lazy immigrants](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I-MHt8uTa4c). ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2010, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/611 "2010-01-31T12:11:12Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > [Check out these lazy immigrants](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I-MHt8uTa4c). Hah! Most apt\*\* Johnny.\*\* 😃 ETA: Napkin Sandwich. ---
**Author:** ![Meyer6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@Meyer6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meyer6)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2010, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/612 "2010-01-31T19:56:21Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Again, you missed some of the words in what I wrote in your rush to try to “prove” me a liar. However, I will answer you question - no. So if public education is fine, then why is public health care not okay? Your rush to extend your ‘busy trying to stay alive’ years is funny - almost as funny as napkin sandwiches (but not quite). You know, lots of young people live on minimum wage - I’ve done it myself - and most don’t need to eat napkins or live without heat. All that crack must have really eaten into your budget! ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2010, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/613 "2010-02-01T05:08:24Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > What do you mean “aren’t available”? You just didn’t try hard enough to find work! Lazy, entitlement-using slob! You should have been out there 18 hours a day,finding more work that was clearly there! > > Next you’ll be telling us that its NOT the fault of the current crop of unemployed that they don’t have good jobs that have healthcare!! And we all know, you think that it’s someone’s fault if they did not plan sufficiently. You see no difference between someone who isn’t making much money but is able to take care of the basics, and people who are making varying amounts of money and insist they must have a basic given to them, at least partially subsidized by the government? > [@Meyer6](#): > > So if public education is fine, then why is public health care not okay? Education means there is a chance the people will go forth and support themselves. Health care is something that people should be using that education to pay for, along with food, shelter, gas, etc. No matter how you want to spin it, health care is not nearly as necessary to a person’s ability to make a living as an education is. Of course, it would be nice if all government funded education was actually worth the money. > [@](#): > > Your rush to extend your ‘busy trying to stay alive’ years is funny Your inability to understand anything outside of your experience doesn’t equal me rushing to do anything. > [@](#): > > You know, lots of young people live on minimum wage - I’ve done it myself - and most don’t need to eat napkins or live without heat. That’s nice. Unfortunately for me, at that time, it didn’t happen. Assuming of course that I believe anything you say. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2010, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/614 "2010-02-01T05:14:40Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Education means there is a chance the people will go forth and support themselves. Health care means there is a chance people will survive to support themselves. See, you are practically a liberal; search your feelings, you know it to be true! **napkin sandwiches** ---
**Author:** ![Meyer6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@Meyer6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meyer6)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2010, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/615 "2010-02-01T05:47:32Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > That’s nice. Unfortunately for me, at that time, it didn’t happen. It didn’t happen because: a) you didn’t work hard enough to make money b) you are extremely bad at budgeting c) you were too stupid to take advantage of social programs or d) you secretly like the taste of napkin sandwiches ? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2010, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/616 "2010-02-01T05:58:00Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > You see no difference between someone who isn’t making much money but is able to take care of the basics, and people who are making varying amounts of money and insist they must have a basic given to them, at least partially subsidized by the government? I for one, draw the line at subsidizing delicious napkin sandwiches for the lazy, good for nothing, minimum wage earning, won’t find another job, pity me because my family was mean, people. You know the sort. When I go into my local dining establishment, only to be told “Sorry sir, one napkin each, and only one packet of relish and ketchup” … Well, my blood boils. I know that those lazy, good for nothing (etc, see above) people have been STEALING. Yes, Stealing MY PRECIOUS napkins and condiments for their GOD-DAMNED napkin sandwiches. HOW DARE THEY! I am subsidizing their sodding lifestyle of napkin sandwiches and cocaine and orgies and GOD KNOWS what else! ## I tell you, I draw the line. Right here people. On the SDMB. A line. Drawn. There it is. Don’t you dare bring your napkin sandwiches over this line. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2010, 7:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/617 "2010-02-01T07:43:04Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Health care means there is a chance people will survive to support themselves. See, you are practically a liberal; search your feelings, you know it to be true! As I said, no matter how you spin it, health care isn’t as important to (the average) person’s ability to be able to support themselves as an education is. > [@Meyer6](#): > > It didn’t happen because: > > a) you didn’t work hard enough to make money No. > [@](#): > > b) you are extremely bad at budgeting Extremely? No. Bad at it? Possibly, tho my memory of it is that there wasn’t much there to budget. > [@](#): > > c) you were too stupid to take advantage of social programs Stupid? You really think it’s _stupid_ to be responsible for oneself and not - what is the term you all keep using - suck off society’s teat? Wow. > [@](#): > > d) you secretly like the taste of napkin sandwiches Aaaand, you are an idiot. ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2010, 10:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/618 "2010-02-01T10:28:32Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > As I said, no matter how you spin it, health care isn’t as important to (the average) person’s ability to be able to support themselves as an education is. This sentence is so stupid as to be totally meaningless. Just for emphasis, I’ll quote it again: > [@](#): > > As I said, no matter how you spin it, health care isn’t as important to (the average) person’s ability to be able to support themselves as an education is Can you please rephrase it so that it makes some sort of sense to the likes of me, an average punter? Cos’ I’m so dumb and can’t make heads nor tails of what chew are on about. > [@](#): > > Stupid? You really think it’s _stupid_ to be responsible for oneself and not - what is the term you all keep using - suck off society’s teat? Wow. Oh wow indeed. Comes a time, **curlie** , when all of us have to grow some balls, limbs and intestinal fortitude to take life by the short and ‘curlies’ and get OFF the tittie to become a grown-up. You are still stuck in the pre-weaned phase it seems, and unable to become fully realised until you are truly independent. Curlie, take my advice and shake off the shackles of THE MAN, and become wholly self-actualised…you’ll not regret it for a minute dear. 😃 Oh, and napkin sammiches too. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2010, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/619 "2010-02-01T15:15:38Z")
> [@kambuckta](#): > > Can you please rephrase it so that it makes some sort of sense to the likes of me, an average punter? Cos’ I’m so dumb and can’t make heads nor tails of what chew are on about. I think she means you can’t tarmac a drive or flip burgers without a college degree, but you can with a pancreatic cancer. Remember the [del]MST3K[/del]\*\*curlcoat \*\*mantra : “it’s just hypocrisy, I should really just relax”. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2010, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/620 "2010-02-01T16:40:02Z")
Napkin sandwiches. ETA: Napkin sandwiches. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612.md?page=30) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612.md?page=32)