# Health care horror story #13848732 **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 26, 2009, 8:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612 "2009-12-26T08:01:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 36
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/701 "2010-02-08T17:28:56Z")
Yesterday . a Detroit local news program ran a story about one of their ex-weatherman. He retired . When he did he was too young for Medicare. His doctor said he should get a colonoscopy. He checked out prices around town. They ran from 3500 to 9000 dollars. The uninsured pay more anyway. He found that he could go to Costa Rica and get one for 350 dollars. The doctor went to school in America and attends 3 seminars a year to stay current. He went there and got it, went on vacation and came out way, way ahead. He discovered that a heart valve transplant which runs 200,000 dollars in America can be had for 2000 in other places. In many cases the care is better. They do not have a drive to bring in the cheapest nurses and attendants they can find. They do not have this huge drive to make the greatest profit possible. If they are competing ,it is to provide the best care possible, not to squeeze as much money as possible out of the system. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/702 "2010-02-08T17:32:56Z")
[http://www.healthbase.com/resources/news/latest/wellpoint-introduces-international-medical-tourism-pilot-program.html](http://www.healthbase.com/resources/news/latest/wellpoint-introduces-international-medical-tourism-pilot-program.html) Here is a site that will hook you up for Vacation/medical procedures. By the way when he was in Costa Rica he had his dental work done for less than a third of the cost here. I know 2 people who had weight loss surgery done in Mexico for much less than half the cost here. ---
**Author:** ![Tarwater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9de0a6/32.png) [@Tarwater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tarwater)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/703 "2010-02-08T18:22:21Z")
I just found this thread. I thought I might post, but if this distracts too much from the napkin sandwich conversation, please feel free to ignore it: My brother has Anylosing Spondilitis, a condition that requires constant (and expensive) medical care. He’s a student and so has health insurance through his university, but the insurance company has recently slapped a pre-existing on his A.S., which means he’ll have to wait an entire year before they’ll pay for any treatments. This would cost him approximately $50,000 - $75,000. He does not have this money. However, there are charities that will help him provided he can show the appropriate financial need. But here comes the kicker: they only help people who lack health insurance, and in order to continue his college education, he HAS to have health insurance. So, at this point, he has two options: he can continue his education and hope that his A.S. won’t progress further and start fusing his bones together, which is almost guaranteed to happen and will leave him immobile and in excruciating pain, OR he can drop out of college and leave his health insurance plan and live off charity. Although, technically, he has another option: he can forgo treatment for his disease and join the circus, like another famous sufferer, Leonard Trask, the Wonderful Invalid, although neither of us are sure how realistic this option is because we’re both fairly sure the freak-show circuit is dwindling. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/704 "2010-02-08T18:51:52Z")
Or he could go to the ER for his treatments. The people who are opposed to UHC seem to prefer paying the higher costs of ER visits instead of the lower costs of UHC. Either way, they’ll be paying for someone else’s treatment; only this way they get to pay the higher costs they prefer. ---
**Author:** ![Meyer6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@Meyer6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meyer6)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/705 "2010-02-08T18:55:36Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Far more than those of you who respond to ideas that conflict with your own by throwing out random insults and making things up. Throwing out random insults? They were not random - every one was based on horrible, and often incorrect, things you have said yourself. Just for fun, I went through this thread and found the worst of the things you have said: > [@](#): > > Get over yourself > > you make an ass shooting your mouth off > > another example of how little you know > > Oh please, get real > > Must be nice to know what’s best for everyone… > > I hope you don’t really mean that, but since you have said so many ridiculous things, I fear you really do think this would be a good idea > > It’s your hangup > > dipshit > > Way to be a bigot. > > I’m sorry you are unable to follow a sentence > > you probably have the brains God gave goldfish > > Uh, hon? You need to read what the post is responding to, if you want to have a hope of not looking like a twit > > [my world] It’s a lot better than yours > > it is very selfish of you > > I am calling you a leech > > Adults take responsibility for pitfalls they experience in life, children whine. > > Shrug, whatever. Enjoy your ulcer. > > Did you even read the discussion? It’s pretty apparent that you didn’t. > > No, stupid, I said that it is unfair > > I am merely tired of supporting your lifestyle choices while at the same time paying more and more to support mine. > > it is still amazing how much you can throw that around and still think you yourself aren’t a hypocrite > > How can you look yourself in the face > > Everyone continuing to try to pretend that they do is just showing their ignorance. > > Wow, you think I’m a tool, and then you come up with this garbage > > you should educate yourself before you pop off > > You need to study up too > > well it isn’t me that is spending an employers time posted in here… > > The fact you call them zealots shows how little you know. > > You are being the dumbass > > Try reading. Here, I’ll help. > > No sir, you are the idiot. > > it is difficult for you to understand personal responsibility > > Wake up, open your eyes and quit believing Faux News. > > No social security benefits are means tested you moron > > Ya know, your lack of intelligence is almost painful. > > OK, I’ll spell it out for you since you aren’t getting it > > Do you research everything this sloppily? > > Thanks for another example of folks that descend, tell lies and offer nothing! > > Are you not intelligent enough to know that nothing exists in a vacuum? (Do you even know what that means?) > > you not only don’t seem to get the long range effects of the things you want, but you also get this side of violent because I dare to disagree with how you interpret the information. > > you don’t know how to spell > > You aren’t making sense. > > See, this is an example of your disconnect with reality. > > You are projecting your ego onto me. > > Do you no longer have a logical brain? > > I suppose that’s what you all do - assume the worst > > Twit. > > You make illogical leaps of assumption > > Those of you who are looking for victims might wish to do that, but I tend to make decisions based on facts, not assumptions. > > This really shows you have no idea what poor is. > > you have no clue > > Just makes you look foolish > > you can’t seem to follow a line of thought. > > go back and actually read what I wrote > > that certainly shows the depth of your bias. > > You also need to go back and read what I actually wrote. > > try reading what I actually write, not what your fears want to see. > > This would be one of those lies you all make up when you simply have no real answer. > > Gosh how many assumptions can one person make > > The fact that you think that is nonsense says quite a bit about you. > > Wow, four erroneous assumptions in one sentence! Is that a record? > > I realize that this is just the fear talking, but it’s still kind of amazing. > > Not that you deal in facts… > > Do you really not understand how social security works? > > Do you really not know these things? > > Knowing almost nothing about me yet you feel comfortable with that definition. > > Must have been a pretty dull point. > > Funny how you only remember little bits. > > the assumptions you jump to get wilder each time! > > It appears that you are afraid to look at any opinions or ideas that don’t match yours. Sad way to live. > > It’s so cute when you show you can’t understand the printed word and/or English. > > it’s just amazing what you assume. > > I’d say that maybe you should stop talking? Since your only contribution to this is to complain? > > Assuming of course that I believe anything you say. > > Aaaand, you are an idiot > > Does anyone, anywhere, take you seriously? > > If it weren’t so pathetic, it would be even more funny than it is. > > Again I wonder if anyone ever takes you seriously. > > Apparently, you also are unable to read, or retain what you do read. > > It’s amazing how you think you know anything at all about that. > > Of course, I never said anything like that but thanks for once again proving you cannot (or will not?) stop turning my posts into something they obviously aren’t. > > Bullshit. > > If that happens to you when you attempt to discuss things, you are doing it wrong. > > Perhaps I simply have friends with better manners. > > Check this out troll. > > You know, if you weren’t so typical of people in this country, this would continue to be funny. > > is it just that you don’t have an intelligent answer to what I said? > > all you can do is act like a preschooler > > That education also apparently doesn’t provide any maturity. Not to mention the numerous 'snort’s, :rolleyes:'s, and general negative insinuations. You are the one that made another poster _cry_ in another thread. So get down off that high horse, bub. You’re not nearly as lily-white as you’re trying to project yourself to be. ---
**Author:** ![Meyer6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@Meyer6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meyer6)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/706 "2010-02-08T19:02:39Z")
Hey, **Tarwater** - I’m sorry to hear about your brother. I didn’t mean to steal your thunder - I was composing my post for way too long and didn’t see yours. It is completely ridiculous that someone should be forced out of school in order to get the care they desperately need. In Canada or Britain or Australia your brother would face a much more level playing field in terms of reaching his potential (not that having AS is a very level playing field to start with). Suggesting the ‘spaghetti dinner’ approach is no answer. Why does anyone think it is appropriate for people in the first world to be forced to beg from others for their very lives? Yes, on a UHC we pay for each other, but the cost is spread evenly over people and time, and the costs tend to be lower to start with. It also doesn’t force people with desperately ill family members to put their focus on paying the bills rather than healing (or dealing with it, or dying with dignity if that’s what happens). That really is kicking someone while they’re down. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/707 "2010-02-08T19:08:04Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Or he could go to the ER for his treatments. > > The people who are opposed to UHC seem to prefer paying the higher costs of ER visits instead of the lower costs of UHC. Either way, they’ll be paying for someone else’s treatment; only this way they get to pay the higher costs they prefer. The ER does not provide on going care. You can not drop in once a day for medication. ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/708 "2010-02-08T19:13:58Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > snip > > How much money have you donated to help him out? Weak attempt at avoidance. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/709 "2010-02-08T19:48:36Z")
> [@vivalostwages](#): > > Weak attempt at avoidance. Not to mention he had 2 insurance policies in place. Two. But they can only use one. The other pays zip while taking premiums for years. That of course was a rule health insurance companies pushed through. Many years ago if you and your wife both had coverage, anything that the first one did not pick up, the second likely would. You felt some level of security . Now you can be covered and feel insecure. Nice system we got here. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/710 "2010-02-08T19:49:00Z")
> [@Tarwater](#): > > My brother has Anylosing Spondilitis, a condition that requires constant (and expensive) medical care. Nitpick/typo correction: _ankylosing spondylitis_ ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/711 "2010-02-08T20:27:33Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > _ankylosing spondylitis_ Which require the _elusive spondulix_. ---
**Author:** ![Tarwater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9de0a6/32.png) [@Tarwater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tarwater)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/712 "2010-02-08T21:06:03Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Nitpick/typo correction: _ankylosing spondylitis_ Arrgh, shit. You’re right. It’s one of those words that I have to spell consciously too, so I’m not sure how I messed it up. ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/713 "2010-02-08T23:26:50Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > How much money have you donated to help him out? The whole point of the anecdote was that the system needs to be fixed because many people are falling through the cracks. It’s not a solicitation or even a suggestion regarding donations. I would have thought that was glaringly obvious. ---
**Author:** ![Kolga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e56c9b/32.png) [@Kolga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolga)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2010, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/714 "2010-02-09T00:46:06Z")
> [@vivalostwages](#): > > I would have thought that was glaringly obvious. You’ve been around long enough to know better. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2010, 8:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/715 "2010-02-09T08:12:33Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > He has more money than I do. Ok, so those who have more money than you do must be able to pay for everything without your help? Just your help or the help of anyone/everyone? > [@Meyer6](#): > > Throwing out random insults? They were not random - every one was based on horrible, and often incorrect, things you have said yourself. Just for fun, I went through this thread and found the worst of the things you have said: Pay attention - _random_ insults, not responses to posts. Such as the various times you all take pot shots at my husband, my marriage, my friends. None of which have anything to do with the subject. And I do note that you have no defense for the fact that you all also just flat make things up. There is very little “fighting ignorance” in here, its just a little clique of folks with beliefs set in stone and a knee jerk fear response to any whisper of difference. > [@](#): > > You are the one that made another poster _cry_ in another thread. Ah, I am to be responsible for the fact that you all took something I said and twisted it up so badly that she said she cried over it? I think not. > [@vivalostwages](#): > > Weak attempt at avoidance. Avoidance of what? > [@](#): > > The whole point of the anecdote was that the system needs to be fixed because many people are falling through the cracks. It’s not a solicitation or even a suggestion regarding donations. I would have thought that was glaringly obvious. I’d have thought it was at least obvious, if not glaringly so, that I was asking if you all were practicing what you preach. Or is it that you want _other people_ to pay for the health care for the folks that are falling thru the cracks as you say? ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2010, 8:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/716 "2010-02-09T08:14:34Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > Not to mention he had 2 insurance policies in place. Two. But they can only use one. The other pays zip while taking premiums for years. That of course was a rule health insurance companies pushed through. Many years ago if you and your wife both had coverage, anything that the first one did not pick up, the second likely would. You felt some level of security . Now you can be covered and feel insecure. Nice system we got here. Missed this one in all of the trash posts. Why is the other one paying zip? And if it pays zip, why are they paying premiums? ---
**Author:** ![Enderw24](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ba9def/32.png) [@Enderw24](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enderw24)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2010, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/717 "2010-02-09T12:38:41Z")
OK…I’ll finally bite the bullet and give you ONE serious response in this godforsaken thread. > [@curlcoat](#): > > Missed this one in all of the trash posts. Why is the other one paying zip? And if it pays zip, why are they paying premiums? One’s paying zip because it can. They’re paying premiums one two probably because the next medical disaster that strikes could work out the reverse way. The second insurance company could be the primary one to insure while the first pays zip. Again, because it can. This. System. Is. Fucked. Up. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2010, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/718 "2010-02-09T17:55:59Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Missed this one in all of the trash posts. Why is the other one paying zip? And if it pays zip, why are they paying premiums? Because insurance companies got the legislation forced through congress by use of Lobbyists and extraordinary political pressure . That is the system we have. ---
**Author:** ![Meyer6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@Meyer6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meyer6)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2010, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/719 "2010-02-09T20:07:29Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Pay attention - _random_ insults, not responses to posts. Such as the various times you all take pot shots at my husband, my marriage, my friends. None of which have anything to do with the subject. > > Ah, I am to be responsible for the fact that you all took something I said and twisted it up so badly that she said she cried over it? I think not. Yeah, imagine someone being upset when you tell them their kids should have been aborted. :rolleyes: As for being insulting, the entirety of your very first response to me was “Did you even read the discussion? It’s pretty apparent that you didn’t”, even though I hadn’t called you any names or anything in my post. Is that your idea of being polite? Many of your insults are totally random stabs at peoples intelligence, lifestyle, education, etc. - and many of our insults are direct responses to your posts. Just because you don’t like them doesn’t make them random. I know you try to couch your baseless assertions with terms like ‘I assume’, or ‘it’s likely’ or ‘probably’, but guess what, genius - that still counts as making things up! People can read meaning into your posts and conclude that you are making shit up, like: -the baby in the OP will certainly never have a normal life -we all get our politics from Fox News -most people on welfare will be there for generations because they like it -people commonly choose to buy SUVs and big houses and have tons of kids instead of buying insurance -the rest of us live in some utopia where we believe everything would be free if there was UHC -Medicaid covers everyone who cannot cover themselves -somehow switching to UHC would require several years, during which everyone in the US would have no medical coverage at all while the new system was implemented _(this was my favourite, personally)_ -smoking, alcohol, MVAs, and STDs hardly make up any medical costs for the average insurance company, but routine pregnancy is the bankbreaker -nobody now alive, and apparently nobody that was ever a baby, will pay into your personal SSDI -there could be an entire generation with no babies born in the US with no reprocussions whatsoever -those of us with an education are lying about it, or have gotten by easy in some way, and that our parents handed us everything -we also had numerous benefits in life such that we never had to work and struggle like you did -2 people having 2 kids is somehow doubling the population -even though the proposals have only high income earners paying for UHC, inevitably the cost would come down to the unlucky middle class -evidence from other countries is useless because the USA is just that special -occasional misspelling from someone else is evidence of a subpar education/intellect, but it’s unfair when you get busted for not knowing what the I in SSDI means (and trying to use that to make a point!) -life was very difficult for you because you were ‘working to stay alive’, when you have admitted that you had a normal minimum wage type income, didn’t budget well, and could have gone back to your parents if necesary -the average income in America couldn’t possibly be only $25,000, and that that amount is impossible to live on (based on living in Orange County!) -taxpayers bailed out individuals who couldn’t maintain their mortgage -nobody should be trying to live on minimum wage, no matter how they ended up in the job -those of us who disagree with you are ‘threatened’, fearful, and even close to violent (how can one even be violent over the internet 😕), rather than just disagreeing with you -that ‘there are zero laws regarding who can be a parent’ - really? Ever heard of child protective services? -and the classic "He says “can’t afford”, I hear “I have this car payment, I like to party on Fridays and Saturdays” - which is a masterful case of making shit up You make shit up! You insult people! Yet you get all butthurt when you take some flak in return (and ignore the fact that nobody is agreeing with you, and nobody is insulting the rest of us). Welcome to the pit. ---
**Author:** ![Fuji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a9a28c/32.png) [@Fuji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuji)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2010, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612/720 "2010-02-09T20:57:50Z")
> [@Meyer6](#): > > -evidence from other countries is useless because the USA is just that special > -nobody should be trying to live on minimum wage, no matter how they ended up in the job Yeah, these were the two “philosophies” she clung to so tenaciously in earlier threads that I gave up all hope of having an honest, rational discourse on the issue of UHC with her. I admire your patience in dealing with this grasping, infantile cow. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612.md?page=35) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/health-care-horror-story-13848732/522612.md?page=37)