# Hee-haw, y'all. The 2020 Democratic Presidential Primary **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [November 12, 2018, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415 "2018-11-12T17:52:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 72
**Author:** ![Lamoral](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lamoral/32/16078_2.png) [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 11:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1421 "2019-06-28T11:00:27Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > As much as I hate to say it, the real winner of the debates…was Donald Trump. If we are defining ‘winner’ as the person who most consistently gave good, authoritative sounding answers, didn’t choke or appear confused, or stumble over their words, or sound obnoxious or arrogant, I think the winner was Buttigieg. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1422 "2019-06-28T11:02:51Z")
Okay, Biden’s stock will go down a bit and Harris’ will go up. But we’re really talking about busing in 2019? People have evolved over the last 50 years. Society has and so has Biden. People can have a bad debate and bounce back. Obama seemed disinterested in his first debate with Romney and came back well. Biden needs to return fire the next time and if he can’t, he’s going down hard. Everyone looked worthy of the stage last night with the glaring exception of Maryanne Williamson. Why was she on stage and not Steve Bullock? It’s like we were watching Share A Little Tea With Goldie from the Smothers Brothers show. Heavens to Betsy, no more of her! ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 11:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1423 "2019-06-28T11:06:12Z")
> [@Covfefe](#): > > Andrew Yang’s name recognition is going to spike after that debacle. It’s interesting because he got hardly any airtime at all. Initially, as I was watching, I thought “That’s it, he’s screwed,” and he could be. But he seems to be taking it well on twitter. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1424 "2019-06-28T11:10:12Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Okay, Biden’s stock will go down a bit and Harris’ will go up. But we’re really talking about busing in 2019? People have evolved over the last 50 years. Society has and so has Biden. People can have a bad debate and bounce back. Obama seemed disinterested in his first debate with Romney and came back well. Biden needs to return fire the next time and if he can’t, he’s going down hard. > > Everyone looked worthy of the stage last night with the glaring exception of Maryanne Williamson. Why was she on stage and not Steve Bullock? It’s like we were watching Share A Little Tea With Goldie from the Smothers Brothers show. Heavens to Betsy, no more of her! That may be true, but Williamson actually made some comments that probably resonated with viewers. I think that she did fairly well relative to other 1 percenters. Bennet also probably did better than expected. Gillibrand didn’t stand out but there were no negatives. Swalwell just looked desperate and was really annoying. It was clear he was trying to land some haymakers. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1425 "2019-06-28T11:12:30Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I think that she’s going to get it in the next debate. Biden will try to land some punches, but I don’t know if he can. The problem with being a senator and serving in an administration for as long as he has is that he’s got a pretty long record that’s easy to pick apart. > > Obama was a senator barely 2 years. It was hard to pick apart his voting record because he didn’t have any. His most important decisions were probably what positions to support in public access TV interviews. Biden, OTOH, has a record of getting things done, but it’s easy to distort his record. Idk who will take on Harris. They either have issues with black voters like Sanders or Warren or they are patronizing of them. Can’t see anyone going after her. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 11:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1426 "2019-06-28T11:19:15Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Oh golly jeepers! You could just knock me over with a feather! I must sit down now. > :smack: … Get ready, what follows is really hard to believe. I feel…vapors…coming on… > > “Users from pro-Trump communities on 4chan and Reddit implored fellow members to vote for lower-polling candidates in online polls, specifically Tulsi Gabbard and Bill de Blasio, in the hours after Wednesday’s Democratic debate — a sign that digital manipulation efforts related to U.S. politics and elections remain very much alive.” > [Trolls target online polls following first Democratic presidential debate](https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/trolls-target-online-polls-following-first-democratic-presidential-debate-n1023406) Oh so cute. You get a sticker for not blaming it on the Russians. Baby steps. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 11:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1427 "2019-06-28T11:20:53Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Idk who will take on Harris. They either have issues with black voters like Sanders or Warren or they are patronizing of them. Can’t see anyone going after her. I was surprised that Harris didn’t attempt to go after Buttigieg more considering how close they are in the polls. I probably wouldn’t go right after Harris but use her prosecutorial record against her as a way to counter punch. ---
**Author:** ![Covfefe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ee7513/32.png) [@Covfefe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Covfefe)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 11:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1428 "2019-06-28T11:29:54Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Idk who will take on Harris. They either have issues with black voters like Sanders or Warren or they are patronizing of them. Can’t see anyone going after her. Warren doesn’t have issues with black voters and I don’t know where that idea could come from other than her ethnic heritage issue. Look at the policies she’s rolled out in recent months. She’s really the only one in the race with the potential to thread the needle winning them over creditably in addition to “middle America”. Harris is going to have a tougher time threading that needle; I’m not seeing the versatile bona fides. ---
**Author:** ![Boycott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boycott/32/6741_2.png) [@Boycott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boycott)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1429 "2019-06-28T12:17:53Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I was surprised that Harris didn’t attempt to go after Buttigieg more considering how close they are in the polls. I probably wouldn’t go right after Harris but use her prosecutorial record against her as a way to counter punch. Going after the frontrunner is a high risk high reward strategy. It paid off for her because she was able to make it personal citing her upbringing. Biden made a decent jab initially about being a public defender not a prosecutor but it’s the line of attack somebody else could have successfully run with. He was caught in an awkward position as soon as she made it about herself. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1430 "2019-06-28T12:19:06Z")
> [@Covfefe](#): > > Warren doesn’t have issues with black voters and I don’t know where that idea could come from other than her ethnic heritage issue. Look at the policies she’s rolled out in recent months. She’s really the only one in the race with the potential to thread the needle winning them over creditably in addition to “middle America”. Harris is going to have a tougher time threading that needle; I’m not seeing the versatile bona fides. I agree. I think Harris might have capitalized on Joe’s inability to articulate a comeback, but I think she put herself in the wrong lane last night, and that could be a problem if she emerges as a front runner. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1431 "2019-06-28T12:24:33Z")
> [@Boycott](#): > > Biden made a decent jab initially about being a public defender not a prosecutor but it’s the line of attack somebody else could have successfully run with. He was caught in an awkward position as soon as she made it about herself. You reminded me of a thought I had last night while watching Biden. In so many ways, Biden reminded me of watching Bob Dole stumble through the primaries and on the campaign trail in the general. He kept talking about “how the sausage is made in politics” stuff in interviews and debates, and it just did not sell. This is probably one of the reasons why a lot of political pundits have said in the past that senators often have a hard time running for president. Yes, Warren and Harris are senators, but their record isn’t as long and they don’t have the same kind of inter-generational baggage Biden does. Sanders has been in the Senate forever, but he’s running a campaign so hard to the left that nobody can challenge his credentials as a progressive. It’s Biden who’s potentially the roadkill here. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1432 "2019-06-28T12:33:40Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I was surprised that Harris didn’t attempt to go after Buttigieg more considering how close they are in the polls. I probably wouldn’t go right after Harris but use her prosecutorial record against her as a way to counter punch. The question is not “how” but “who”. She had to take down Biden because he was set to sweep the southern states. She’ll need those delegates. Buttigieg has no constituency. He has a few undecideds now but they won’t stick. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1433 "2019-06-28T12:39:29Z")
> [@Win\_Place\_Show](#): > > What if you meld the two nights together, what does your ranking look like? > > I’m asking this sincerely, as for the better part of the last 2+ years, for the most part I’ve found myself nodding along with most of the posts I’ve read on here, and you’re consistently one of the people I tend to agree with the most. Sorry, I missed this. Speaking strictly of the debates and not necessarily where they rank in terms of polling and support, I think the top five are: 1. Harris 2. Castro (the dominant performers) * * * 1. Buttigieg 2. Warren 3. Sanders (all not too far behind) * * * 1. Booker (honorable mention) Biden may have sustained the most damage, but I don’t think it’s because people are going to label him a racist or racially insensitive or blind. I think the bigger problem I saw with Biden - and what I was afraid of beforehand - was that he had moments were he just looked like a 76-year old man. Hard of hearing. Confused. That’s not something that’s going to go away either. There’s a reason that Trump uses the moniker “Sleepy Joe”. He knows it’s a label that can stick. Like most sociopaths, Trump is obsessed with detecting the weaknesses in people. He found Biden’s, just like he has found weaknesses in almost every other opponent he has faced. Beto O’Rourke was also pretty badly injured. Look, he’s obviously a nice guy, but he looked like he was having indigestion the entire time. He just did not look like he was very comfortable out there. And Castro just torched him. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1434 "2019-06-28T12:40:58Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > The question is not “how” but “who”. > > She had to take down Biden because he was set to sweep the southern states. She’ll need those delegates. Buttigieg has no constituency. He has a few undecideds now but they won’t stick. I honestly don’t know. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1435 "2019-06-28T12:44:40Z")
[Harris/Buttigieg](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/28/opinion/debate-harris-buttigieg-biden.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage) starting to make a lot of sense to me. Loves me some Mayor Pete, but he’s got plenty of time, and the major knock on him is lack of experience which VP would provide. Harris seems like a no brainer from most angles, and watching the two of them out-intellect Trump would be glorious. And both seem able to counter punch well without dropping into the mud. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1436 "2019-06-28T12:44:50Z")
My thoughts on the horse race aside, my own personal favorite from the debate was Pete Buttigieg. I felt like he was the most stable, most balanced, most substantive candidate among the entire field. I also thought he answered questions with integrity. He didn’t shy away or make excuses for his problems with South Bend’s police force and his responsibility to address the issue going forward. One political problem he faces, however, is that there are several other mayors and former mayors in the campaign, and I expect that they will be a lot more confrontational than they were last night. I have a bad feeling that De Blasio in particular would be a real pain in Buttigieg’s side if they were ever to share the debate stage. Ditto Castro. Hickenlooper went easy on Pete. They won’t. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1437 "2019-06-28T13:01:50Z")
> [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](#): > > I don’t have any quibbles with this post and I don’t think Joe Biden is in any way racist. However, watching him tonight I do have serious concerns. There was something about his manner and reaction to what was happening that made me feel he is in some sort of decline … This is no decline. He’s never been the best in a debate environment. And Harris is amazing in that venue. What she did was highlight Biden’s relative weakness in his ability to weather criticisms. There were good responses to that possible. The fact that he could not make those plays was what she demonstrated. She declared her brand: she will prosecute the case against Trump in a way no one else can. It was that more than identity politics. Is that enough to be most electable? She’s strong, quick, smart, and able to give enough emotion for people to connect with. Her answer to dealing with Mitch is heavy on Executive orders. How will that play in key states? ---
**Author:** ![Les\_Wizerables](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c89c15/32.png) [@Les\_Wizerables](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Les_Wizerables)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1438 "2019-06-28T13:22:07Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > This is no decline. He’s never been the best in a debate environment. And Harris is amazing in that venue. What she did was highlight Biden’s relative weakness in his ability to weather criticisms. There were good responses to that possible. The fact that he could not make those plays was what she demonstrated. > > She declared her brand: she will prosecute the case against Trump in a way no one else can. It was that more than identity politics. > > Is that enough to be most electable? > > She’s strong, quick, smart, and able to give enough emotion for people to connect with. Her answer to dealing with Mitch is heavy on Executive orders. > > How will that play in key states? Yup. What Harris did wasn’t simply about Biden and busing. It was about showing Democrats that she can do what they have been craving for almost four years now- hold Donald Trump fully accountable for his various forms of bigotry, corruption and incompetence. They want to see him reduced to a blubbering puddle and his massive flaws exposed instead of lost in the shuffle. If she can do that to someone like Biden with far less ammunition to work with, it’s hard not to fantasize about what she’d do to Trump. I don’t know if it would really matter in a general election, but that’s 17 months away (just typing that made me a little nauseous). Plenty of time to fine-tune the approach if she gets that far. But in June of 2019, it was a masterstroke. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1439 "2019-06-28T13:24:54Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > That may be true, but Williamson actually made some comments that probably resonated with viewers. I think that she did fairly well relative to other 1 percenters. The only thing I can figure out is that she’s auditioning to become Ambassador to the Planet Zoltar. ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2019, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415/1440 "2019-06-28T13:41:51Z")
I really hated almost everything Harris said last night. I don’t like her style and I don’t like her politics. She was a lower tier candidate for me any how and i voted against her for senator but last night I disliked almost everything that came out of her mouth. Its really disappointing to see how well received she was both here and on 538. I’ll vote for her for president but, man, I won’t like it. The big winners for me were Bennet and Gillibrand while neither is my favorite now they both had positions that didn’t seem insane and had great stage presence. I’d be very happy if Sallwall and Walters never came across my screen again they were both terribly annoying and had nothing good to say except for the first “pass the torch” shot which was great and led me to expecting interesting things from the guy. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415.md?page=71) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hee-haw-yall-the-2020-democratic-presidential-primary/824415.md?page=73)