# Helicopter carrying Iranian President and Foreign Minister has crashed -upd, all aboard died \[2024-05-19\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** breaking-news\ **Created:** [May 19, 2024, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772 "2024-05-19T16:37:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/81 "2024-05-20T16:05:28Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > It’s not clear who rescuers thought they were talking to over mobile phones or where that story came from. If they’re talking about a blizzard then the likely answer would be that some of them survived the crash but none of them survived the cold. This is probably why they were in such a hurry to find them. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/82 "2024-05-20T16:16:19Z")
['Experts react"](https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/new-atlanticist/experts-react/experts-react-iranian-president-ebrahim-raisi-is-dead-in-a-helicopter-crash-whats-next-for-the-regime/#:~:text=The%20deaths%20of%20Raisi%20and,the%20leader%20of%20Iran%2C%20Khamenei) to the impact of the Iranian president’s death. Sounds like those in charge are busily working to damp down any expectations of domestic instability and keep the “revolution” chugging along. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/83 "2024-05-20T16:22:04Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > > [@wolfpup](#): > > > > It’s not clear who rescuers thought they were talking to over mobile phones or where that story came from. > > If they’re talking about a blizzard then the likely answer would be that some of them survived the crash but none of them survived the cold. This is probably why they were in such a hurry to find them. Have you seen the crash site? I don’t think they talked to anyone on the phone. [![](https://c.ndtvimg.com/2024-05/51rbqk9o_iran-president-helicopter_625x300_20_May_24.jpg?im=FaceCrop,algorithm=dnn,width=1200,height=738) ](https://c.ndtvimg.com/2024-05/51rbqk9o_iran-president-helicopter_625x300_20_May_24.jpg?im=FaceCrop,algorithm=dnn,width=1200,height=738) ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/84 "2024-05-20T16:26:08Z")
Curious lie to make, then. Maybe it was a reference to the other helicopters? That also doesn’t look like land that recently saw a blizzard. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/85 "2024-05-20T16:31:57Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > Curious lie to make, then. Maybe it was a reference to the other helicopters? My guess is that the posters in this thread who speculated that Iran may have wanted to buy time where it was unclear if Raisi was alive or not to head off a possible opportunistic coup are correct. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/86 "2024-05-20T16:32:30Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > That also doesn’t look like land that recently saw a blizzard. I didn’t hear anything about a blizzard, but I _did_ see videos with extreme fog. ---
**Author:** ![Common\_Tater](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/common_tater/32/13846_2.png) [@Common\_Tater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Common_Tater)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/87 "2024-05-20T18:38:51Z")
> [@Mighty\_Mouse](#): > > they were under all kinds of pressure to fly when the weather was not good. Have you ever noticed the USPS doesn’t own any airplanes? I read somewhere this is a kind of legacy that goes way back to the earliest days of aviation, when they did have planes delivering mail, and they were pushing the pilots to fly in bad weather. Lots of crashes and dead pilots ensued, and that was the end of that. ---
**Author:** ![Common\_Tater](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/common_tater/32/13846_2.png) [@Common\_Tater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Common_Tater)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/88 "2024-05-20T18:46:36Z")
> [@Dorjan](#): > > my dad was a Bell Helicopter employee in the late 70s and I spent my toddler years in Iran as a direct result. Interesting! Iran has 79 F-14 Tomcats. I guess some of them still fly. How the Iranians get parts is a real mystery. I suppose cannibalizing the rest. The US government at one time even ensured that static displays at airfields and museums and the VFW etc around the country had the components removed. I think they have some F-4s as well. ---
**Author:** ![Dorjan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dorjan/32/12440_2.png) [@Dorjan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorjan)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/89 "2024-05-20T18:49:59Z")
Those Tomcats are kept flying by cannibalization and some clever reverse engineering. Iran actually has a very technically competent aerospace sector, what they manage to do with all the heavy sanctions in place is pretty impressive. ---
**Author:** ![Common\_Tater](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/common_tater/32/13846_2.png) [@Common\_Tater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Common_Tater)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/90 "2024-05-20T18:53:22Z")
Well right, but that’s why I’m skeptical of anyone trying to blame sanctions or lack of spare parts for the Late Unpleasantness. ---
**Author:** ![Dorjan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dorjan/32/12440_2.png) [@Dorjan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorjan)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/91 "2024-05-20T18:54:35Z")
I fully expect the Iranian government to do exactly that, regardless of if it had anything to do with the crash! ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/92 "2024-05-20T19:19:54Z")
> [@Mighty\_Mouse](#): > > When they became employees of a charter airline they suddenly became a lot more cautious. Reminds me of when I read a history of the island war in the Pacific. Marines on the ground swore they could tell whether an air support pilot was married or not by how low he made and how soon he pulled up after an attack run. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/93 "2024-05-20T19:40:44Z")
How do we know the lasers weren’t used to make the fog? 😁 ---
**Author:** ![Frodo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frodo/32/302_2.png) [@Frodo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frodo)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/94 "2024-05-20T19:43:43Z")
I don’t see why, even if you are a tech wizard using cannibalized and/or reverse engineered tech is probably riskier than using new parts from the manufacturer. ---
**Author:** ![Humans](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/dfb087/32.png) [@Humans](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Humans)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/95 "2024-05-20T20:20:39Z")
So who’s the new president. Are they going to call an election? ---
**Author:** ![JoseB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/joseb/32/1530_2.png) [@JoseB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoseB)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/96 "2024-05-20T20:34:12Z")
The first vicepresident (some guy called Mohammed Mokhber) automatically becomes president, and then elections have to be called within 6 months. New presidential elections apparently have been arranged for June 28. ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/97 "2024-05-20T20:43:40Z")
It is worth mentioning that it is unusual for the Head Of State & his Ministers to occupy the **same** aircraft, when there is more than one available. Security, that is, the Revolutionary Guard, would make all flight arrangements. So. Inside job. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/98 "2024-05-20T20:59:24Z")
> [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](#): > > It is worth mentioning that it is unusual for the Head Of State & his Ministers to occupy the **same** aircraft, when there is more than one available. Do you have a cite that this is typical Iranian policy? ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/99 "2024-05-20T21:49:18Z")
Plus, this was a minister; it’s not like he was flying with one of his twelve vice presidents. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772/100 "2024-05-20T21:58:59Z")
Hm, yes, that does seem the simplest explanation. It’s easy to see how a game of fog-of-war multi-lingual Telephone could turn “two surviving aircraft” into “two survivors”, and that’d also account for being able to get an approximate but not exact position. Meanwhile, to the pilots: If you (through whatever turn of events) find yourself flying close to the ground in dangerously-thick fog, wouldn’t the natural response to be to fly straight up? Ideally, that’d eventually get you above the fog, and at the very least get you further away from anything you could collide with. Any speculation on why this copter would be staying so close to the ground? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helicopter-carrying-iranian-president-and-foreign-minister-has-crashed-upd-all-aboard-died-2024-05-19/1001772.md?page=6)