# Hell. Why is it described as, well, hell? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 3, 2010, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107 "2010-05-03T02:26:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/41 "2010-05-03T20:48:42Z")
> [@raindog](#): > > There are basically 2 ‘forms’ of hell in the bible; one that is the nothing more than the grave essentially, and one that is where you go for complete, irredeemable, eternal destruction. > > The second version of hell is Gehenna, which was in the valley of Hinnom (sp?), and as others have pointed out was basically a garbage dump outside the city walls. Sulfur was used to burn the garbage, and criminals deemed not worthy of a burial were dumped to be burned. So I’m not crazy. Good to know. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/42 "2010-05-03T20:49:46Z")
> [@Marmite\_Lover](#): > > Satan is not the landlord. He is not even in hell. No one is yet. > > Satan is wandering the earth diverting everyone he can to his path. > He was given respite by God till Judgement Day. > It is only on Judgement Day, after the second coming of Jesus that we will all be judged. The end of the world. > Then Satan and his followers will be sent to hell. That would be the lake of fire where Satan will be spending quite a bit of time. > [@](#): > > I truly believe that American/Israeli Foreign Policy will bring about the end of the world ☹ Doubt it, it seems like the American empire’s time is up to me. Same cycle, and a harvest of the earth. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/43 "2010-05-03T20:51:00Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > Jewish concept of sin is very different from Christianity. We typically do not believe that sin is a black mark on your soul. In Judaism, sin simply means “missing the mark”. I’ve heard the missing the mark definition many times in conventional Christianity ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/44 "2010-05-03T21:03:33Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > I agree with this. But it would make more sense to me if Satan didn’t exist at all, and God ran the whole show. Having Satan as the ruler of Hell and all that’s evil makes the description of Hell inconsistent with what Satan would do if it were indeed his realm. We don’t think Satan is the ruler of Hell, either. Nor do we think people who go to Gehenna necessarily stay there for all eternity. There’s a caveat here. There really is no “official” Jewish position on what happens to you after you die. We don’t have dogma on this the way Catholics do. Different Jews believe different things. You could probably find some who think there’s an eternal hell at least for some people, there are some who believe in reincarnation in one form or another, and a whole lot of other different opinions. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/45 "2010-05-04T04:04:44Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > Most of the popular concept of hell comes from Dante and other literary sources. Dante (and Milton) seem to get a lot of the “blame” for current images, but as I noted, those images were pretty well defined in the first century B.C.E. In fact the popular images of hell, itself, pretty much all date back to the period just prior to the life of Jesus. The more nuanced questions of whether suffering is eternal have a murkier provenance, but hell as a place of fire and torment precedes Christianity. If it had not, then the words of Jesus in Luke 16 would have made no sense to his audience: > [@](#): > > [sup] **22** [/sup]And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham’s bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; [sup] **23** [/sup]And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. [sup] **24** [/sup]And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame. [sup] **25** [/sup]But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented. Devils with horns and pitchforks appear to be more of a late medieval or early Renaissance addition. They do appear in Dante’s Inferno, (Canto XXI), but they are not a prominent part of his depiction and they also appeared in other works from about the same period. One appearance of devils is very similar to that of fauns and satyrs and may have been an attempt to link ancient pagan belief to the Satanic, but it is not clear that the conection is direct. Prior to the Renaissance, the devil was more often portrayed as simply a monster, often serpentine, occasionally as a chimera of wolf, boar, and other beasts. ---
**Author:** ![appleciders](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85f322/32.png) [@appleciders](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/appleciders)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/46 "2010-05-04T05:07:16Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > Prior to the birth of Jesus of Nazareth, a number of Jewish works (that were never later accepted as Scripture by Jews or Christians) began using different images to describe punishment of sinners. Borrowing from the image of Gehennon, a valley, south of Jerusalem, where trash had been dumped for many years and where rubbish fires continued to burn pretty much all the time, very evil people were described as being thrown like rubbish onto those fires. Later, in apocalyptic works such as Assumption of Moses and the Syriac Apocalypse of Baruch, there are cryptic references, using that imagery, of the fires burning for all times. To the extent that theological commentators of the time paid any attention to the issue, they appear to have held that while the fires were eternal, the people thrown into those fires would be burnt up, rather than being held in eternal torment. In Esdras, Gehenna is identified as a furnace that is in sight of Paradise–an image that Jesus uses in the parable of the rich man and the beggar (Chapter 16). 1 Enoch makes several references to Gehenna as a place of torment and punishment. > > Whether Christians added the notion of eternal punishment in later centuries or whether they borrowed popular imagery that was extant in the first century cannot be reliably established. Talking about what “the Jews” believed or what “the Christians” believed is rather pointless. There were many different beliefs held by various groups and there is not really a reliable way to determine when a specific belief arose, down to the month and year. > > It is true that mainstream Judaism of the time did not hold that the afterlife included eternal punishment for sinners and that that belief arose within Christianity, but setting a date for that belief–possibly springing from Mt 25:46, either as it was understood or misunderstood by later readers–is not really possible unless we suddenly stumble on a Dead Sea Scrolls-like trove of first or second century Christian writings–including arguments showing the discussion. > > ETA: Part of the discussion of early texts is confusing because they frequently used Matthew’s phrase of “eternal punishment” and juxtapose it against phrases of “eternal life.” The inference that has typically been drawn has been that the two situations, both eternal, corresponded to what happened to the person in those situations forever. There are a number of passages from multiple Christian authors from around the middle of the second century that use those images. Whether they saw the “eternal punishment” as torment or annihilation must be inferred based on the inclinations of the reader because the authors tended to assume their audience would understand their text and they do not tend to explain their remarks more clearly. Expanding on this… **tomndebb** , I mean this as an addition, not an argument with your post. Some non-canonical early Christian writings lay out pretty specifically a vision of a fiery hell. Check out the _Shepherd_ of Hermas, a second century Roman Christian, or the _Apocalypse of Peter_\*, both second century texts that were regarded as scripture by many early Christians but failed to make the cut when the New Testament was compiled. These may or may not be the original source of a vision of a fiery Hell in Christianity (there are people who make these arguments, but that’s a book-length answer, and controversial at best), but they’re certainly representative of belief in a fiery hell for sinners in second century Christianity. Here’s a nice chunk from the [Apocalypse of Peter](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apocalypse_of_peter)\*\*, in which God (or Jesus, the text just says “Lord”) explains to Peter what’s happening to sinners: > [@Apocalypse of Peter](#): > > …"And as soon as the whole creation dissolves, the people who are in the east shall flee to the west, and those who are in the west to the east… an unquenchable flame driving them shall bring them to the judgment of wrath, to the stream of unquenchable fire which flows, flaming with fire, and when the waves thereof part themselves on from another, burning, there shall be a great gnashing of teeth among the children of men… Then he (Jesus) shall command them to enter into the river of fire while the works of every one of them shall stand before them… the unrighteous, the sinners, and the hypocrites shall stand in the depths of darkness that shall not pass away, and their chastisement is the fire… Here’s a less fiery and more torture-y passage: > [@Apocalypse of Peter](#): > > "Behold another place: there is a pit, great and full. In it are those who have denied righteousness: and angels of punishment chastise them and there they kindle upon them the fire of their torment… behold two women: they hang them up by their neck and by their hair; they shall cast them into the pit. These are those who plaited their hair, not to make themselves beautiful but to turn them to fornication… And the men who lay with them in fornication shall be hung by their loins in that place of fire… And a bonus fire _and_ torture passage: > [@Apocalypse of Peter](#): > > "Ezrael the angel of Wrath shall bring men and women, with half of their bodies burning, and cast them into a place of darkness, the hell of men; and a spirit of wrath shall chastise them with all manner of torment, and a worm that never sleeps shall devour their entrails… And beside those who are there, shall be other men and women, gnawing their tongues; and they shall torment them with red-hot irons and burn their eyes. These are they who slander and doubt my righteousness. The whole thing makes you think that either the author isn’t bothered by writing the same exact word over and over, or else Koine Greek has lots of different words for “fire”. I mean, “the stream of unquenchable fire which flows, flaming with fire?” Really? These texts were accepted as scripture on par with the Gospels, the Epistles of Paul, and the Revelation of John by various different sects of 2nd, 3rd, and 4th century Christians. I’d also like to echo **tomndebb** here: speaking of what “Early Christians” believed is a huge generalization. Realistically, there were early Christian sects that believed in Jesus as only a man, akin to a prophet, sects that thought he was entirely divine and only _seemed_ to be human, sects that thought he was either human or divine but sure as hell not related to the Jewish YHWH, sects that thought Jesus was just one cog in a giant universe of other supernatural figures that controlled the world, and so on. Early Christianity is a giant mess of churches that believed wildly different things. \*Almost certainly not written by the apostle Peter. Possibly by the same author as 2 Peter in the New Testament, as they have a similar style, but this is a pretty speculative claim with no hard evidence. Basic reasoning for saying these are late forgeries: no way a Galilean peasant fisherman speaks Greek this well. \*\*The wikipedia page has some good background but no source text. I’m quoting from the J.K. Elliott translation from Bart Ehrman’s “Lost Scriptures”. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/47 "2010-05-04T14:36:42Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > If you’d like to. Raindog is a Jehovah’s Witness, if that helps you understand his theology. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/48 "2010-05-04T15:25:24Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > Whether Christians added the notion of eternal punishment in later centuries or whether they borrowed popular imagery that was extant in the first century cannot be reliably established. Talking about what “the Jews” believed or what “the Christians” believed is rather pointless. There were many different beliefs held by various groups and there is not really a reliable way to determine when a specific belief arose, down to the month and year. Back when I researched this sort of thing to sate my own curiosity, I seem to recall that a lot of hell imagery and the dualist concept of the universe as Good Creator God (Ahura Mazda) vs Destructive Evil God (Angra Mainyu) draws from Zoroastrianism, established in the 6th century BC. This seems to make sense, as there is a marked shift, as noted above, of the role of satan between the Old and New Testaments. In the Old Testament, satan is one of God’s court and performs tasks (usually of the adversarial or testing type) at His behest. By the New Testament, satan becomes Satan, a powerful adversary presented as a direct counterpoint to God the Creator. Now, as for Hell, though what I’ve read suggests it’s borrowed from Zoroastrianism, or at least heavily influenced by it, the earliest religious texts I could find in that religion that mention it are from around the 6th century. The [Book of Arda Iraf](http://www.avesta.org/pahlavi/viraf.html) contains a Dante-esque account of the afterlife, including visits to heaven and hell. (There are 13 chapters on Heaven, and 85 on Hell.) It’s fascinating reading describing a host of sins and their punishments. It’s quite gruesome and well worth a read if you’re into the concept of sin and Hell. Sinners are stabbing themselves, women are hung up by their breasts, (one is condemned to somehow digging a hill were her breasts), serpents are eating tongues, the eternal ingesting of excrement and vomit abounds, etc. Fun Sunday afternoon reading. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/49 "2010-05-04T15:45:22Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > two things jumped out at me from this post. > > If your first paragraph is taken at face value, what would be the difference between heaven and hell? I think eternity in heaven would be just as miserable, with nothing to do and nowhere to go. Even if it’s less “gloomy”, I’ve never been under the impression that there were activities to sign up for. Doing just about ANYTHING for eternity would get to be miserable, wouldn’t it? > > From the second paragraph I pulled out, if judaism did not hold that the afterlife included eternal punishment for sinners, then 1) what DID it hold for sinners, and 2) what was the motivation for the average jew to love thy neighbor and play by the rules? The concept of Hell seems to work only if there is punishment for actions during your life on earth. Without a threat of punishment, why would a jew think he had to follow the commandments? Jewish afterlife beliefs evolved over time, but once they devoloped their eschatology (largely derived from Persian/Zorastrian beliefs after the Babylonian exile), the belief was that _Sheol_ was only temporary. There would eventually be a resurrection of all the dead, everybody would be judged, then the good people would be given eternal life in paradise, and the bad people were simpy annihilated. The punishment for bad people was deletion from all existence. This might not sound like too bad a deal compared to eternal, burning hell, but they were thinking more in terms of reward for themselves than punishment for others. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/50 "2010-05-04T17:28:04Z")
> [@olivesmarch4th](#): > > Ok, so this is going to sound like I pulled it completely out of my ass, but I remember seeing a History Channel documentary once, years ago, in which it was implied that the Hebrew word that is often translated as hell was actually the name of a site near Jesus’ stomping grounds. It was, in essence, a garbage dump, that was always on fire. > > So the theory was that Jesus used the garbage dump as a kind of metaphor, which is one possible reason we have this idea of hell as burning and sulfur and horriblness. > > Does anybody know if this has any truth to it? > [@AClockworkMelon](#): > > Who knew they had tire fires back then? Well, obviously, they did. And the Lord inspired the creation of the internal combustion engine, so mankind would have to invent rubber tires. Because apparently, these tires are consumable. And that’s why [Jesus Saves Tires](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=561890). Just like it says in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/51 "2010-05-04T18:10:42Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > From the second paragraph I pulled out, if judaism did not hold that the afterlife included eternal punishment for sinners, then 1) what DID it hold for sinners, We admit that we don’t know what comes after death, for sinners or righteous people. There’s various speculation, but that’s all it is. I suspect that Judaism focuses less on an afterlife partly because Christianity has devoted so much attention to it over the centuries. Judaism may have become a more this-worldly religion to differentiate itself from Christianity, or because we didn’t want to look like we were trying to imitate the Christians. > [@](#): > > and 2) what was the motivation for the average jew to love thy neighbor and play by the rules? The concept of Hell seems to work only if there is punishment for actions during your life on earth. Without a threat of punishment, why would a jew think he had to follow the commandments? That’s your business as an individual Jew. Judaism just says you’re supposed to obey the commandments, not why you’re supposed to obey them. Whether or not you do obey the commandments counts for more than why you think you’re supposed to, in Judaism. There’s been a lot of Jewish debate over what, exactly, you are supposed to do to obey the commandments, but less debate over the reasons why you’re supposed to obey them. In fact, there are some commandments that we acknowledge that we don’t know why you’re supposed to do them. ---
**Author:** ![Locrian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/locrian/32/14146_2.png) [@Locrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Locrian)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/52 "2010-05-04T23:58:33Z")
I doubt Satan would really be that bad as god in comparison. If he’s welcoming sinners with open arms, as the OP states, wouldn’t you all be buds? I don’t believe in any afterlife, but assuming heaven and hell exist, [let’s look at the numbers.](http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2006/08/who-has-killed-more-satan-or-god.html) God killed (est) 33,000,000 throughout the bible. Satan killed 10 people. Yes, just ten, all in the book of Job, with god’s influence and blessing. God forgives basically everything except atheism, so in heaven we can hang with Hitler, Hussein, Himmler, Manson (eventually), Susan Smith, Andrea Yates and the like. In hell we get atheists like myself? Hmmm. Then pray for me to go to hell and spit on Himmler for me, cool? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Marmite\_Lover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Marmite\_Lover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marmite_Lover)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2010, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/53 "2010-05-14T21:46:18Z")
> [@Anne\_Neville](#): > > We admit that we don’t know what comes after death, for sinners or righteous people. There’s various speculation, but that’s all it is. > > I suspect that Judaism focuses less on an afterlife partly because Christianity has devoted so much attention to it over the centuries. Judaism may have become a more this-worldly religion to differentiate itself from Christianity, or because we didn’t want to look like we were trying to imitate the Christians. > > That’s your business as an individual Jew. Judaism just says you’re supposed to obey the commandments, not why you’re supposed to obey them. Whether or not you do obey the commandments counts for more than why you think you’re supposed to, in Judaism. There’s been a lot of Jewish debate over what, exactly, you are supposed to do to obey the commandments, but less debate over the reasons why you’re supposed to obey them. In fact, there are some commandments that we acknowledge that we don’t know why you’re supposed to do them. WOW this is an eye opener!:eek: Now it all makes sense. That’s why God sent prophet after prophet to the Jews, then gave up on them. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2010, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/54 "2010-05-14T22:54:27Z")
To me Hell is a very intense refiners fire, where our tendencies to do anything outside of Love for each other and God caused much pain in our life. It is God’s reform school, run by demons so we learn we never want to go back there. I also believe there is a place worse, outer darkness, where if we even resist the fires of Hell, we get our very own universe with nothing in it. Jesus overcame all and can rescue from both places. ---
**Author:** ![dhkendall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a9adbd/32.png) [@dhkendall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dhkendall)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2010, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/55 "2010-05-14T23:08:41Z")
> [@Stink Fish Pot](#): > > Now, Hell is run by Satan. The Devil. Angel of Darkness. Antichrist. Beelzebub. Lucifer. Mephistopheles. Prince of Darkness. THAT guy. So, if run by Satan, why would it necessarily be a bad place for an eternal destination? > > If you believe in God and Satan, then wouldn’t it be, of a practical matter, that Hell would be made as pleasant as possible for sinners by the landlord? After all, you would be one of “his”. Someone who did not live a good life, who did horrible things to other people, who committed sins (or ate a hot dog on Friday). It would seem to me that Satan would welcome sinners with open arms and not punish those that would be sent to Hell. > > Unless, of course, God controls Hell. In which case, the idea of Hell being a bad place to go makes perfect sense. I would not want my soul to be damned to Hell if God controls Hell. Punishment would be severe. But as I understand it, Satan controls Hell, which makes eternal punishment a puzzlement. In effect, Satan would be doing God’s work. Why would Satan do that? > > What is the explanation for this seemingly obvious flaw in the idea of Heaven and Hell? The second one. First few chapters of the book of Job pretty much spells it out that Satan is God’s bitch. To put it less crudely, Satan can’t do thing 1 without God’s say-so. So, if God wants Hell to be a place of fire and brimstone and torture, Satan has to go along with it, because, well, the Bible seems to indicate that Satan has no choice, he has to listen to what God tells him to do. ---
**Author:** ![fuzzypickles](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9d8465/32.png) [@fuzzypickles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fuzzypickles)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/56 "2010-05-15T04:37:20Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > I also believe there is a place worse, outer darkness, where if we even resist the fires of Hell, we get our very own universe with nothing in it. Reminds me of the Vas Corp Mani (Armageddon) spell from the Ultima video game series. Every person, creature, and object in the game is destroyed, leaving you alone in a vast, empty world with no one to talk to and nothing to interact with. That part of the game gave me nightmares. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/57 "2010-05-15T05:07:13Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > I also believe there is a place worse, outer darkness, where if we even resist the fires of Hell, we get our very own universe with nothing in it. I remember C.S. Lewis found this idea particularly disturbing. IIRC he said that if you start from the premise that you (that is, the soul part of you) are indeed immortal and _cannot_ die, then (in the absence of God and everything else) even minor bad mental habits become exponentially worse over time until you’re alone in what’s literally a hell of your own making. Or see Stephen King’s “The Jaunt” for another view of what a mind’s eternity in isolation would end up like. ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/58 "2010-05-15T12:10:50Z")
> [@Marmite\_Lover](#): > > Satan is not the landlord. He is not even in hell. No one is yet. > > Satan is wandering the earth diverting everyone he can to his path. > He was given respite by God till Judgement Day. > It is only on Judgement Day, after the second coming of Jesus that we will all be judged. The end of the world. > Then Satan and his followers will be sent to hell. > > I truly believe that American/Israeli Foreign Policy will bring about the end of the world ☹ According to Matthew ch 16 v 27-28, Jesus was going to return in glory with His angels while some of them were still living. mark also makes reference to this) He thought the world was going to end during that century. Said that generation would not pass away until all things (He spoke of) was accomplished. So the second coming has come and gone.(as I see it!) The end of every person’s world will end at their death. each generation thinks it is while they are alive, at least it seems that way to me! ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/59 "2010-05-15T12:35:13Z")
> [@monavis](#): > > According to Matthew ch 16 v 27-28, Jesus was going to return in glory with His angels while some of them were still living. mark also makes reference to this) He thought the world was going to end during that century. Said that generation would not pass away until all things (He spoke of) was accomplished. So the second coming has come and gone.(as I see it!) > > The end of every person’s world will end at their death. each generation thinks it is while they are alive, at least it seems that way to me! Matthew 16: 27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works. 28 Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom. “The coming in glory with angels” and the “coming in his kingdom” are not necessarily the same. The former speaks of Christ’s Return, the latter of His Ascension to the Divine Throne, which was witnessed by the Apostles in Acts 1, Stephen at his martyrdom (Acts 7), Paul at his conversion (Acts 9), and John in receiving the Revelation. Christ indeed foretold that the generation would witness the end of the Aion (‘world’ is a bad translation) and the Aion of the Mosaic Covenant did indeed end with the destruction of the Temple, the Priesthood & the Jewish nation (Matthew 24). ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2010, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107/60 "2010-05-15T16:55:56Z")
And once again we are about to enter a new Aion… Aquarius, right? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hell-why-is-it-described-as-well-hell/538107.md?page=4)