# Help! Evil Muslims are out to get meeeeeee! (For Valteron and Perciful) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 25, 2010, 12:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476 "2010-06-25T12:37:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 18
**Author:** ![Girl\_From\_Mars](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3da27b/32.png) [@Girl\_From\_Mars](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Girl_From_Mars)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 9:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/341 "2010-07-06T09:41:01Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Now, we can’t identify who the radical Muslims are. But it would be great if we could identify them, right? Well, we do know that they will be a subset of Muslims. So we start there. Start to do WHAT there? Ideal world - what would you like to see happen? To explain why I think your idea of profiling all the Muslims above is troubling, let me give you an couple of examples. There’s a 35 year old black man from Indianapolis who was raised in a rough neighborhood. After going to Catholic school for a short time as a child before being raised Baptist by his grandmother, he converted to Islam in his teenage years. Another man like me, he’s a 34 year old white Australian who was born in Adelaide. I seem to have been luckier than him though in terms of a childhood; while my parents are still together and encouraged me in education, his split when he was a kid. He got into a bit of trouble with drugs and theft, before straightening out and finding himself a a wife, and a job on a cattle station in Queensland. He has kids, the marriage breaks up and he moves to Japan to become a horse trainer. Later he converts to Islam. Firstly, what would you propose to do to monitor these men, which would not affect me too? Which man is more dangerous to you? ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/342 "2010-07-06T13:16:13Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > It all depends how you define the words you put in quotes, doesn’t it? If you define them as “being interned”, yesm the same thing happened. Did they go through the same process? No they didn’t. And no one said they did. **elanorigby** was under the impression that only the Japanese were interned (which is how I took her post, anyway, and she didn’t correct that impression). I put an an end to that bit of ignorance with a couple of sentences. Your imputing that I said that they went through the same process, as well. Nope, didn’t say it. Because I know that’s not the case. At the very least, the sheer numbers of Germans on the east coast made treating them the same as the Japanese (even if the desire to do so was there) quite impractical. > > So, you were wrong about my promulgating ignorance, except in those who imagined me saying the same things that you imagined. On the bright side you’ve helped further fight **elanorigby’s** ignorance. I’m sure she appreciates it. > > As much I appreciate the assistance. Nope. You are still wrong. The significant point was that we did not do to “German-Americans” what we did to “Japanese-Americans.” Specifically, we locked up U.S. citizens of Japanese descent _en masse_ while we did not do the same thing to U.S. citizens of German descent. That is a difference and not merely one of methodology and you were cointinuing to promulgate ignorance–just different ignorance than that which you chose to interpret. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/343 "2010-07-06T13:21:46Z")
This might cheer up **Valteron** and **Perciful**. At this very moment, neo-nazi type white people are actively planning to harm Muslims because they just might be terrorists. How would you like to be classed among that minority group? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/344 "2010-07-06T13:40:06Z")
> [@Bridget\_Burke](#): > > Personally, I’m concerned that **magellan01** is apparently living in America. But I don’t know exactly where. > > I would prefer to know where somebody who has that sort of malignant idiocy in his brain hangs out. So I can know not to go there. If you do go there, remember to be wary. With extra wariness. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/345 "2010-07-06T15:15:08Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > Nope. You are still wrong. The significant point was that we did not do to “German-Americans” what we did to “Japanese-Americans.” Specifically, we locked up U.S. citizens of Japanese descent _en masse_ while we did not do the same thing to U.S. citizens of German descent. > > That is a difference and not merely one of methodology and you were cointinuing to promulgate ignorance–just different ignorance than that which you chose to interpret. You are precious. You now insist on defining what **elanorigby** meant by “do that” _and_ what I interpreted her to mean by it. Your powers of divination so eager to flex their muscles, you then insist on defining “same thing” in a way that I _must_ be wrong, even when I pointed out there is a more logical reference (the fact of internment, plain and simple) in which my statement is not only completely correct, but unspectacular in the fact it was conveying. But I expect nothing less from one of the lead Muslim apologists on these boards. Keep up the good work. Because every Muslim is deserves just as much scrutiny as every Quaker. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/346 "2010-07-06T15:17:55Z")
> [@Bridget\_Burke](#): > > Personally, I’m concerned that **magellan01** is apparently living in America. But I don’t know exactly where. > > I would prefer to know where somebody who has that sort of malignant idiocy in his brain hangs out. So I can know not to go there. I live in your brain. In the nice roomy part walled off by politically correctness. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/347 "2010-07-06T15:26:55Z")
> [@Girl\_From\_Mars](#): > > Start to do WHAT there? Ideal world - what would you like to see happen? > > To explain why I think your idea of profiling all the Muslims above is troubling, let me give you an couple of examples. > > There’s a 35 year old black man from Indianapolis who was raised in a rough neighborhood. After going to Catholic school for a short time as a child before being raised Baptist by his grandmother, he converted to Islam in his teenage years. > > Another man like me, he’s a 34 year old white Australian who was born in Adelaide. I seem to have been luckier than him though in terms of a childhood; while my parents are still together and encouraged me in education, his split when he was a kid. He got into a bit of trouble with drugs and theft, before straightening out and finding himself a a wife, and a job on a cattle station in Queensland. He has kids, the marriage breaks up and he moves to Japan to become a horse trainer. Later he converts to Islam. > > Firstly, what would you propose to do to monitor these men, which would not affect me too? Which man is more dangerous to you? First, I’ve said nothing about monitoring anyone. Second, you are now asking me to evaluate _individuals_. At that point, Muslimness becomes just one of many factors, easily overridden by other particulars. For instance, something as simple as type of mosque. My only point has been that in the quest ot keep the U.S. safe from further Islamic barbarity, it behooves us to 1) look at Muslims in general in order to 2) discern which of them is a murderous radical. ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/348 "2010-07-06T15:27:04Z")
Nixon was a Quaker. Just sayin’. I’m not going to engage you any more, **magellan**. It’s a futile exercise and I have limited patience for the dick measuring and nitpicking that is constant in the Pit anyway. You seem to lack the ability to see this topic from any POV than your own. No doubt you will now puff yourself up on your ridding yourself of one opponent—oops, Muslim apologist–and I am happy to allow you to think that. But I will give you one small piece of advice: when you start saying what others should and should not feel, you have already lost any argument. In this case, you have stated that Muslims should not mind being subjected to additional scrutiny. You don’t control other people or their feelings. You also don’t seem to be able to enter into other people’s feelings. I’m sure you’ll take that as liberal me doesn’t want to hurt Muslim’s widdle feewings. But that is not my point at all. Again, I’m not going to bother trying to explain to you my point. My time has more value in other places. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/349 "2010-07-06T15:29:02Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > But I expect nothing less from one of the lead Muslim apologists on these boards. :dubious: You are nuts. Peanuts, walnuts, brazilnuts, filberts, almonds and pecans. Totally nuts. **tomndebb** , one of the lead Muslim apologists on these boards? Seriously? He argues for just treatment and you call it Muslim apologetics. From a Catholic. Al Qaeda flew a 747 through your freakin’ brain. If you start digging a fallout shelter now you may be able to hide in there until all the Muslims forget about killing you for being an infidel. Quick! Go! I’ll stall them! ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/350 "2010-07-06T15:30:21Z")
I think I speak for everyone reading when I say, Magellan is obviously full of shit. No one thinks he’s winning this argument. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/351 "2010-07-06T15:36:49Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > First, I’ve said nothing about monitoring anyone. Second, you are now asking me to evaluate _individuals_. At that point, Muslimness becomes just one of many factors, easily overridden by other particulars. For instance, something as simple as type of mosque. My only point has been that in the quest ot keep the U.S. safe from further Islamic barbarity, it behooves us to 1) look at Muslims in general in order to 2) discern which of them is a murderous radical. Fair enough. After all, > [@Gyrate](#): > > ‘I’m not saying that all Muslims are terrorists or that they should all be treated as though they might be potential terrorists in all situations until they demonstrate otherwise or that they should be discriminated against in any way; I’m just saying that we need to be wary of all of them.’ ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/352 "2010-07-06T15:38:08Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > First, I’ve said nothing about monitoring anyone. Second, you are now asking me to evaluate _individuals_. At that point, Muslimness becomes just one of many factors, easily overridden by other particulars. For instance, something as simple as type of mosque. My only point has been that in the quest ot keep the U.S. safe from further Islamic barbarity, it behooves us to 1) look at Muslims in general in order to 2) discern which of them is a murderous radical. If you weren’t so fucking stupid you might stop to think what this entails. How do you monitor the type of mosque a given Muslim goes to? Do you require a form stating what mosque you attend? Do you have FBI watching all mosques in America? Do you want enough surveillance to get a name on each of the attendees? Are you actually that dim? I’m personally not willing to destroy the US’ freedom of religion so a simpering coward like you can have an illusion of peace. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/353 "2010-07-06T15:50:45Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > If you weren’t so fucking stupid you might stop to think what this entails. How do you monitor the type of mosque a given Muslim goes to? Do you require a form stating what mosque you attend? Do you have FBI watching all mosques in America? Do you want enough surveillance to get a name on each of the attendees? Are you actually that dim? He never said any of that! It’s not his problem! He’s not talking about that stuff! That’s for other people to sort out! He’s not responsible! > [@](#): > > I’m personally not willing to destroy the US’ freedom of religion so a simpering coward like you can have an illusion of peace. We must destroy our freedoms to keep them safe! ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/354 "2010-07-06T15:52:48Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > My only point has been that in the quest ot keep the U.S. safe from further Islamic barbarity, it behooves us to 1) look at Muslims in general in order to 2) discern which of them is a murderous radical. It behooves us to look at everyone to discern which of them is a murderous radical, dipshit. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/355 "2010-07-06T17:11:35Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > I seem to recall a thread a while back where someone recommended requiring that all passengers step on Koreans as they board. So now we only want the Japanese to fly commercial aircraft? I’m saying he’s \*specifically \*scared of \*this \*group because they’re mostly brown people. As opposed to, say, freaking out about the IRA. It probably doesn’t matter to him but only 25% of muslims are Arabs. > [@](#): > > Maybe we can just get all the illegals we round up condensed into a single area. We could call it a Condensation Park! And then since it’s silly to have them just sitting there, we could probably come up with something for them to do. In fact, I hear these illegals are all lazy and just get welfare all the time, so maybe we could post some kind of motto to encourage them. Hrm, how about "Labor Releases You "? We could put it in big letters, right over the gate. Can’t we just shoot them, it would be cheaper. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/356 "2010-07-06T17:24:42Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > What the hell? What makes you think his father and brothers are in the more violent subset of Americans? A violent individual is more likely to commit a violent act than non-violent relatives. The comparison only becomes valid when comparing all people, violent or not, to your relatives–then your relatives are more likely to commit violent acts towards you. > > Most rational people are more afraid of violent individuals are more afraid of violent individuals than non-violent ones. If you aren’t, what’s wrong with you? Yeah, a lot of those murderous family members were not unusually violent before they killed their relative. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/357 "2010-07-06T17:54:11Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > How about this…how about we look at just those instances that have actually happened, leaving The Cole and the embassies abroad out of it: > > the 1993 WTC bombing—6 killed, 1,042 injured > 9/11—2,976 killed, 6291+ injured (not to mention financial toll and the scar on the city and the nation) > the Fort Hood shooting—13 dead, 30 wounded > Sgt. Asan Akbar throws hand grenades into tent and opens fire—2 dead, 14 wounded > the Times Square bomber > the numerous arrests made in the U.S. of those planning similar attacks. > > Now, as large as those numbers are, the important thing is that they were not unrelated acts. They all come from the same place: radical Islam and it’s desire to see Americans dead. > > It seems that you look at that and shrug your shoulders. If so, I ask: if there was another attack, would that change your view? Five more attacks? Ten? Fifty? Is their any number of attacks/attempts that would cause you to say, “What the fuck is it with Islam? Enough already!!!”? What’s the number? Or is their no number for you. And you’ll go on thinking Islam is as peaceful a religion (“is”, not “can be”) as Quakerism, or (shudder) Christianity until you happen to be in something they blow up? And right up until 9/11 the Oklahoma City bombing was the worst terrorist attack on American soil. Should we treat white Republicans the same way you suggest we treat Muslims? because it is clear his radical political ideology was as much (if not more of) a factor in his actions than religion was a factor for the terrorists on 9/11. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/358 "2010-07-06T17:56:55Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > I’m Pro Choice myself. But if you think that the percent of Christians that wish to do you physical harm is proportionate to the percent of Muslims in the U.S. who wish to do you harm, then yes, you should be just as wary of Christians. But I do not think that to be near the case. You’re not talking about personal precautions. If you just personally wanted to exercise extra precautions around brown people, we would all just point at you and laugh but you want to pass laws and institute policies that will treat all muslims differently than others. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/359 "2010-07-06T17:58:57Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > And right up until 9/11 the Oklahoma City bombing was the worst terrorist attack on American soil. Should we treat white Republicans the same way you suggest we treat Muslims? because it is clear his radical political ideology was as much (if not more of) a factor in his actions than religion was a factor for the terrorists on 9/11. Nitpick: Timothy McVeigh wasn’t really any more of a Republican than he was a Democrat, though he was certainly more conservative than liberal. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476/360 "2010-07-06T18:03:51Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > So now we only want the Japanese to fly commercial aircraft? I’m sure it was **Korans** and not **Koreans**. I can’t imagine Muslims having any objection to stepping on a Korean. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476.md?page=17) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-evil-muslims-are-out-to-get-meeeeeee-for-valteron-and-perciful/544476.md?page=19)