# Help Fenris win a bet! What's the meaning of Harry Chapin's "Cat's in the Cradle"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 18, 2002, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-fenris-win-a-bet-whats-the-meaning-of-harry-chapins-cats-in-the-cradle/109755 "2002-05-18T23:07:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Morgainelf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/71e660/32.png) [@Morgainelf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgainelf)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2002, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-fenris-win-a-bet-whats-the-meaning-of-harry-chapins-cats-in-the-cradle/109755/41 "2002-05-20T17:49:44Z")
Nothing more to add, but this thread is making me incredibly sad today. My little girl is 16 months old today, and I had a hard time coming to work this morning. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Pergau](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7c8e57/32.png) [@Pergau](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pergau)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2002, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-fenris-win-a-bet-whats-the-meaning-of-harry-chapins-cats-in-the-cradle/109755/42 "2002-05-21T12:33:29Z")
Lawoot, I see what you mean, but I think that a “good Father” is someone that manages to get over these problems. But the definition is personal and unless you’re Snake from the Simpsons, if the cap fits… ---
**Author:** ![Sauron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce7236/32.png) [@Sauron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sauron)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2002, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-fenris-win-a-bet-whats-the-meaning-of-harry-chapins-cats-in-the-cradle/109755/43 "2002-05-21T13:08:49Z")
Forgot to mention this – note the regret the singer expresses, the sense of lost time, at the beginning of each section in the song. He continually says “just the other day” – his son was born, turned 10, came home from college. All these things seem to have happened in the recent past to him, and yet they encompass a man’s lifetime. By contrast, he’s “long since retired.” He realizes the time he could’ve spent bonding with his child, he spent doing other things. So, **Fenris** , when do we find out your take on the song? ---
**Author:** ![Kilvert\_s\_Pagan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c37758/32.png) [@Kilvert\_s\_Pagan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kilvert_s_Pagan)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2002, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-fenris-win-a-bet-whats-the-meaning-of-harry-chapins-cats-in-the-cradle/109755/44 "2002-05-22T01:29:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by lawoot \* > \*\* > > Who says he isn’t a good father? > > This song could almost illustrate my father’s life. The sadness that his generation must have felt, because his was the FIRST\* that had to spend lots of time on the road ‘doing business’, and thus were UNABLE to give their families the attention that previous generations (who were largely rural and/or stayed close to home) could - because it was what was required of them to survive. > > Imagine “Cat’s in The Cradle” for the current generation - with BOTH parents absent. > > \*by First, I mean that a larger number of his generation were on the road than ever before. Couple that with the baby boom, and you get MANY families with absent fathers. \*\* [cathartic defensive belated hijack] This topic hits very close to home. **Lawoot** and I are brothers. At Dad’s eulogy, I noted how Dad had taken the song very personally. My point was meant to illustrate Dad’s regrets, as opposed to that he was a bad parent. He was a wonderful parent. I agree with **Lawoot** regarding the way Dad’s generation was the first to be on the road. But there was another side to this: the males in his generation weren’t very good at expressing themselves emotionally, nor at making life choices influenced by emotion. Dad became a marvelous grandparent, and was able to spend his retirement as a volunteer, helping his grandson’s soccer league. They now have trophies and plaques in Dad’s honor in Tucson, and Sandy Chapin can take some comfort in the fact that, at least for a while, she helped. [/cdbh] ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2002, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-fenris-win-a-bet-whats-the-meaning-of-harry-chapins-cats-in-the-cradle/109755/45 "2002-05-24T01:42:34Z")
Hey **Fenris** , did you win or lose? Haj ---
**Author:** ![Silentgoldfish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@Silentgoldfish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silentgoldfish)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2002, 10:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-fenris-win-a-bet-whats-the-meaning-of-harry-chapins-cats-in-the-cradle/109755/46 "2002-05-24T10:20:11Z")
Yeah, you can’t get much later in the week than this! ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2002, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-fenris-win-a-bet-whats-the-meaning-of-harry-chapins-cats-in-the-cradle/109755/47 "2002-05-24T12:21:36Z")
My friend’s POV was similar to **Lawoot’s** , with the added interpretation that dad was proud that the son had grown up with a sense of responsiblity, just like he’d had: the son is providing and caring for his own son. Mine is much more the traditional interpretation, and I’m gonna win (we’ll be getting together on Sunday), in large part because of **Rocking Chair’s** info about the background of the song. If the _songwriter_ intended it to be cautionary, not complimentary, it should be a slam-dunk. and **HappyHeathen** : After quibbling for 2 hours over the wording of that post, using words like “bittersweet”, “sad”, “tragic”, we decided to draw a line in the sand with “good” on one side and “bad” on the other. :: shrug :: Thanks everyone!! Fenris ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2002, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-fenris-win-a-bet-whats-the-meaning-of-harry-chapins-cats-in-the-cradle/109755/48 "2002-05-24T22:48:03Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Fenris \* > \*\*Mine is much more the traditional interpretation, and I’m gonna win (we’ll be getting together on Sunday) \*\* We know you’ll have a good time then… ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2002, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-fenris-win-a-bet-whats-the-meaning-of-harry-chapins-cats-in-the-cradle/109755/49 "2002-05-25T00:09:12Z")
fenris, i’m glad my sick day from school could help you out. i was home sick one day, my mum would let me watch tv from the couch when i was sick. harry had a new album out and he was zipping around the country doing talk shows. he sang two songs live on the show. flowers are red and little girls grow crooked. i was amazed by them. he had written them after his kids had told him what they were learning in school. which lead to a discussion on his kids, and cat’s in the cradle. mrs chapin wrote the main part of the song after the birth of their son josh in '74. mr chapin added the chorus and music. the song hit #1 in dec of that year. i remember him saying he always had at least one of his kids with him when he toured. the reason the memory is so vivid is that i thought his kids were such lucky ducks to be able to travel with their dad and best of all: get out of school!!! have you tried [www.harrychapinmusic.com](http://www.harrychapinmusic.com) and [www.harrychapin.com](http://www.harrychapin.com)? ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2002, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-fenris-win-a-bet-whats-the-meaning-of-harry-chapins-cats-in-the-cradle/109755/50 "2002-05-25T00:10:15Z")
Bwah-ha-ha! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2002, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-fenris-win-a-bet-whats-the-meaning-of-harry-chapins-cats-in-the-cradle/109755/51 "2002-05-25T00:25:56Z")
AAAK! I didn’t refresh before posting! That “Bwah-ha-ha” was for **Rilch** ’s witty comment! I wasn’t laughing at your post, **rocking chair**!!! Fenris ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2002, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-fenris-win-a-bet-whats-the-meaning-of-harry-chapins-cats-in-the-cradle/109755/52 "2002-05-25T00:41:28Z")
i figured. although it could be interpreted as an “i’ve got him now, dinner is mine!” laugh. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2002, 9:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-fenris-win-a-bet-whats-the-meaning-of-harry-chapins-cats-in-the-cradle/109755/53 "2002-05-25T09:23:39Z")
Thank you, **Fenris**! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-fenris-win-a-bet-whats-the-meaning-of-harry-chapins-cats-in-the-cradle/109755.md?page=2)