# Help me choose my next vacation spot. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 26, 2011, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650 "2011-09-26T13:48:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![BubbaDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bubbadog/32/333_2.png) [@BubbaDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BubbaDog)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2011, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/21 "2011-09-26T19:29:54Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Yes, the hikers clearly intended this whole escapade just to make it rich. > > 1. Get lost while hiking > 2. Spend 2 years in Iranian jail, being subjected to abuse > 3. Be shaken down for a million dollars in bail > 4. Profit! No way in hell did these chumps pull that stunt to make money, but if the celebrity-media sleazebags of the world can find dumbshits like Octo-mom and the Gosselins and turn it into shared profits I’m pretty sure that they are already knocking on the doors of these three chuckleheads. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2011, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/22 "2011-09-26T19:39:44Z")
> [@BubbaDog](#): > > No way in hell did these chumps pull that stunt to make money, but if the celebrity-media sleazebags of the world can find dumbshits like Octo-mom and the Gosselins and turn it into shared profits I’m pretty sure that they are already knocking on the doors of these three chuckleheads. That is a possibility. However, I think any editor worth his salt would recognize that any autobiographical work from these three would focus more on the plight of the Palestinian unionized illiterate migrant worker; the violence inherent in the Archer-Daniels-Midland-Zionist controlled trade in genetically modified patchouli oil; and helpful vegan/gluten-free/sugar-free/hyper-organic/free-range carob and hempseed pancakes – made without heat, of course, to lower one’s carbon footprint. Their book would be fucking unreadable. No publishing house is going to chase these hippies down to sign them for a lucrative contract; they’re going to run from them because the first thing these young activists would do is sue their publisher for not properly supporting the Sandinistas in the 1980s. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2011, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/23 "2011-09-26T20:13:14Z")
We could do a new reality show: _The Great Escape._ You get put in an Iranian prison, and the first group to get the Sultan of Oman to fork over $1M gets set free. The rest are sent to Exile Island in the Persian Gulf. Worth playin’ for? ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2011, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/24 "2011-09-26T20:28:16Z")
> [@Wilson](#): > > Hey now, upper Manhattan isn’t that unsafe anymore. Hasn’t been for decades. No, no, it’s Columbia, Maryland. I hear it’s a real hellhole (Hi, Irene) Roddy ---
**Author:** ![Vita\_Beata](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/a9a28c/32.png) [@Vita\_Beata](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vita_Beata)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2011, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/25 "2011-09-26T20:41:26Z")
[quote=“Ravenman, post:16, topic:597650”] Sure, they just need to show up for their next court date in Tehran, and I bet the judge will refund the cash bond. Time to refreshen those backpack supplies. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f07891/32.png) [@Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Plastic_Ninja)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2011, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/26 "2011-09-26T22:48:49Z")
We’re angry that three Americans are home after being imprisoned for two years for, by all accounts, being stupid? The spying thing holds no water with me. If they really were spies, there’s no way Iran would have let them go for a measly million. I’m all ready and willing to say that going hiking near Iran is stupid, but if we put every idiot in jail for two years, we’d have more people in jail than not. Yes, they should have to pay for their bail and their ticket home, but if some generous people wanted to bring three American citizens home from their cell in an as-close-to-enemy-as-can-be country, more power to 'em. We gloat at the misfortune of others enough. We really have to Grinch when fools get lucky? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2011, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/27 "2011-09-26T23:01:27Z")
> [@Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](#): > > We’re angry that three Americans are home after being imprisoned for two years for, by all accounts, being stupid? The spying thing holds no water with me. If they really were spies, there’s no way Iran would have let them go for a measly million. Didn’t we let that hot redhead go for free? If Iran determined that they had no useful information what’s the harm in selling them off. Not that I think they were spies. ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2011, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/28 "2011-09-26T23:12:38Z")
> [@Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](#): > > We gloat at the misfortune of others enough. We really have to Grinch when fools get lucky? We Grinch (that made me laugh, btw :D) because their stupidity was such that it very easily could have caused a very serious international incident. Fortunately, it really didn’t, but when your stupidity is such that it could jeopardize global stability, that’s a special fucking kind of stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2011, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/29 "2011-09-26T23:33:43Z")
“Jeopardize global security?” Why not say that the tresspass could have turned the space-time continuum into shreds? And you call the hikers clueless. Huh. ---
**Author:** ![Darth\_Panda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ee7513/32.png) [@Darth\_Panda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Panda)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2011, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/30 "2011-09-27T00:33:33Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Didn’t we let that hot redhead go for free? If Iran determined that they had no useful information what’s the harm in selling them off. > > Not that I think they were spies. I never get hot redheads for free ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2011, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/31 "2011-09-27T01:26:16Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > “Jeopardize global security?” Why not say that the tresspass could have turned the space-time continuum into shreds? Yeah, I’m really not sure exactly what that’s all about. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2011, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/32 "2011-09-27T01:28:58Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > It’s bail, not a payoff; theoretically, it might be paid back. It’s not bail; it’s ransom. Nobody expects them to return to Iran. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2011, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/33 "2011-09-27T01:35:16Z")
The Iranians might. Anyway, I did say “theoretically”. ---
**Author:** ![Yeticus\_Rex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/a698b9/32.png) [@Yeticus\_Rex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yeticus_Rex)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2011, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/34 "2011-09-27T23:00:59Z")
> [@BubbaDog](#): > > I’m thinking of taking a vacation where I can get some real scenic hiking. > > There’s a lot of places available to me - > so here are my choices > > 1. My back yard - the good ol’ \*\*U S \*\*of **A** > 2. Europe - explore the rich history and beauty > **3. A war-torn country in the troubled Mideast where everybody is trying to kill one another** > > Activities I could pursue > > 1. Staying somewhere very public and protected > \*\*2. Use well armed, well trained local guides for protection > 2. Wander around close to unmarked disputed borders with nations hostile to your native country.\*\* > > I’ve though it over and decided I would rule out number three for each category. I’d have to be one of the stupidest people ever to walk the face of this earth if I made those choices. > > But then again, I could get a lot of [attention](http://news.yahoo.com/freed-us-hikers-describe-harrowing-ordeal-iran-083556057.html)if I made it out alive. > > Maybe even a book deal. Hey, [2 out of 3](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44359943/ns/world_news-christian_science_monitor/t/ucla-math-major-joins-libya-rebels-vacation/) ain’t bad… ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2011, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/35 "2011-09-27T23:16:45Z")
There was an idiot named [Billy Hayes](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midnight_Express_%28film%29) who had a pretty successful book and movie deal awhile back about his imprisonment in a Turkish jail. Of course, his story had a colorful escape angle. I expect at a minimum a book deal to come out of the hikers’ story. They can explain in more detail the irony of being tossed in the cooler by the Iranians even though they opposed U.S. policy towards Iran. ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2011, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/36 "2011-09-27T23:34:23Z")
> [@Wilson](#): > > Hey now, upper Manhattan isn’t that unsafe anymore. Hasn’t been for decades. Perhaps the OP is a Harvard alum. ---
**Author:** ![Shirley\_Ujest](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@Shirley\_Ujest](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shirley_Ujest)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2011, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/37 "2011-09-28T01:33:35Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > We could do a new reality show: _The Great Escape._ > > You get put in an Iranian prison, and the first group to get the Sultan of Oman to fork over $1M gets set free. The rest are sent to Exile Island in the Persian Gulf. > > Worth playin’ for? Set it in Detroit. No money. No phones. No car. No food. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2011, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/38 "2011-09-28T04:26:53Z")
> [@Baracus](#): > > Something that seems to get overlooked on a regular basis is that two of the three lived/worked in Syria, so Iraq was much more their backyard than the Colordao Rockies. Not that that doesn’t make them stupid for choosing to hike right near the border with fucking Iran, but it was not quite the Herculian effort in stupidity as if they had traveled half-way across the world to get there. And as the [relevant Wiki article notes](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009%E2%80%932011_detention_of_Americans_by_Iran), it’s not as though their destination in Iraqi Kurdistan wasn’t widely recommended and regarded by locals as fairly safe: > [@](#): > > They had been living and active in the Middle East, and were on holiday in Iraqi Kurdistan, an autonomous region of Iraq free from the sectarian struggle that dominates much of Iraq. They had been advised of the suitability of the region for a holiday by friends who had been there and through Internet research; and were recommended the Ahmed Awa waterfall, a popular Kurdish tourist destination, by a number of local people whilst they were in Sulaymaniyah. After visiting the waterfall, they continued walking within what they believed to be Iraqi Kurdistan, up to and including the time they were detained by Iranian border guards. In fact, tourism in Iraqi Kurdistan is [undergoing an actively encouraged boom](http://www.ekurd.net/mismas/articles/misc2011/2/state4732.htm) at present: > [@](#): > > Noting how safe the region is, the New York Times last month [Jan 2011] listed Kurdistan as No. 34 on its 41 places to travel in 2011. It beat out Miami. […] > > Another popular spot is the waterfall at Ahmed Awa, not far from the scrabble border with Iran where the American hikers were apprehended. Mustafa, the tourism minister, said that as part of a comprehensive plan his ministry is developing, the government will provide warnings to tourists about the dangers of venturing off the beaten path. In fact, he said, tourists should follow only recommended routes so they don’t accidentally leave the Kurdistan region or wander into Iran, easy to do if you’re unfamiliar with the surroundings. > > Without turning this into an endorsement of traveling to the Kurdistan region, which the U.S. State Department still advises against, I must say that the Kurdistan region doesn’t feel dangerous. Iraqis from all over the country are friendly, and their culture is beckoning, perhaps because it has been off-limits for so many decades. > > “It’s more safe than many European cities, even New York,” said Akram Jibouri, general manager and owner of the Safeer Hotel in Erbil. While I agree that the three American hikers who were apprehended were reckless and/or careless in not staying far enough away from the Iranian border, it wasn’t _prima facie_ stupid of them to visit that part of Kurdish Iraq in the first place. For Americans living and working in nearby Middle Eastern countries, Kurdistan isn’t an unreasonable tourist destination. But we shouldn’t allow inconvenient facts to get in the way of hating on the liberal hippies, of course. In particular, let us by all means ignore the fact that one of them was working at the American Language Center in Damascus, a cosmopolitan English-language instruction facility for children of political and professional elites and international employees that’s hardly a hotbed of anti-American activity. ---
**Author:** ![DWMarch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwmarch/32/1010_2.png) [@DWMarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DWMarch)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2011, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/39 "2011-09-28T04:54:56Z")
I just want to know what’s so valuable and secret in Iran that is also kept right within walking distance from the border and not protected by some simple security like a fence. If the Iranians are that dumb they deserve to be spied on. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2011, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650/40 "2011-09-28T05:22:29Z")
> [@DWMarch](#): > > I just want to know what’s so valuable and secret in Iran that is also kept right within walking distance from the border and not protected by some simple security like a fence. IMHO, the pearl of great price in this case was the rather abstract asset “pan-Islamic” credibility. Iran, as a demographically non-Arab and non-Sunni Muslim country, is regarded with some wariness by its Middle Eastern neighbors, which interferes with its aspirations of regional leadership. Vitriolic anti-US and anti-Israel rhetoric is a cheap way for Iran to bolster its Islamic-fundamentalist “street cred”. And flaunting the arrest and imprisonment of a couple of accidentally strayed hikers from the Great Satan makes it look even more badass. The whole thing was deliberate political theater whose target audience was radicalized Arab Muslims. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-choose-my-next-vacation-spot/597650.md?page=1)