# Help me fight Ignorance - Xenophobia regarding Islam **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 7, 2010, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988 "2010-02-07T03:03:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![BrightNShiny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@BrightNShiny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrightNShiny)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/21 "2010-02-08T20:43:29Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > _In proportion to their numbers_ Muslims have committed far more terrorism. The reason why white Christian males get a pass in America is because almost the entire damn country consists of white Christians. How do you _not_ give them a “pass” in such a situation? You know, every damn day I hear about 30 people blown to pieces in Iraq by Sunnis and then 45 more people blown to bits by the Shiites and so on and so on. It’s sickening, the amount of violence that Muslim terrorists in Iraq are committing (against their fellow Muslims.) But in Iraq, these Muslim terrorists “get a pass.” Why? I think you should probably be able to figure it out. See, this is what I mean. I specifically said “in the United States.” I wasn’t talking about Iraq, in which case the obvious threats come from Islamic extremists. I wasn’t talking about India, where the threat is from Hindu and Islamic extremists. I’m talking about the United States. And you bringing up Iraq here (as well as your dishonest attempt to portray McVeigh as the lone act of white male terrorism in the US) is simply doing what I’ve been saying – giving Christian extremists in the US a pass. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/22 "2010-02-08T20:46:00Z")
> [@BrightNShiny](#): > > You know full well there have been terrorist acts committed in the US by white Christian males other than McVeigh (Rudolph, Roeder) and those acts were done in the name of religion. McVeigh wasn’t Christian. He [self-identified as an agnostic](http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2001/jun/11/mcveigh.usa4) (although he accepted the last rites just before his executions). And he did not commit his bombing in the name of any religion. > [@](#): > > As I said, white male Christian terrorists always get a pass for some reason. By “a pass” I assume you mean being arrested, convicted, and sentenced to life in prison (or executed). Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![BrightNShiny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@BrightNShiny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrightNShiny)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/23 "2010-02-08T20:50:20Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > McVeigh wasn’t Christian. He [self-identified as an agnostic](http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2001/jun/11/mcveigh.usa4) (although he accepted the last rites just before his executions). And he did not commit his bombing in the name of any religion. He accepted last rites, but he wasn’t a Christian? And I notice that you, like **Argent Towers** are trying to ignore the other terrorists who did explicitly espouse a religious cause. Not all Muslim extremists espouse a specifically religious cause either–some of them espouse a political cause. Are you going to classify those people not as Muslim extremists? If that’s the case, then I’ll accept that McVeigh wasn’t a Christian terrorist, but he certainly was a white male one. > [@](#): > > By “a pass” I assume you mean being arrested, convicted, and sentenced to life in prison (or executed). No, by pass, I mean trying to pretend that Christian extremism isn’t a problem in the US. ---
**Author:** ![BrightNShiny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@BrightNShiny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrightNShiny)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/24 "2010-02-08T21:04:35Z")
Just to add, I find the certainty with which it is being claimed that McVeigh was not a Christian to be out of proportion to his conflicting and obscure statements. To [whit](http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,109478,00.html): > [@](#): > > TIME: Are you religious? > > MCVEIGH: I was raised Catholic. I was confirmed Catholic (received the sacrament of confirmation). Through my military years, I sort of lost touch with the religion. I never really picked it up, however I do maintain core beliefs. > > TIME: Do you believe in God? > > MCVEIGH: I do believe in a God, yes. But that’s as far as I want to discuss. If I get too detailed on some things that are personal like that, it gives people an easier way alienate themselves from me and that’s all they are looking for now. He was raised a Christian and said he maintained certain “core” beliefs. Perhaps he truly was an agnostic, perhaps he was a non-denominational Christian. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/25 "2010-02-08T21:14:11Z")
> [@BrightNShiny](#): > > He accepted last rites, but he wasn’t a Christian? And I notice that you, like **Argent Towers** are trying to ignore the other terrorists who did explicitly espouse a religious cause. Not all Muslim extremists espouse a specifically religious cause either–some of them espouse a political cause. Are you going to classify those people not as Muslim extremists? If that’s the case, then I’ll accept that McVeigh wasn’t a Christian terrorist, but he certainly was a white male one. Tim McVeigh was not a practicing Christian and he certainly didn’t blow the building up in the name of religion. This is in stark contrast to Muslims who specifically commit acts of terrorism in the name of God. Do you not understand the difference? Christians and Muslims commit individual crimes all the time (including murder) but the acts of terrorism by Muslim Extremists is specifically driven by religion. > [@BrightNShiny](#): > > No, by pass, I mean trying to pretend that Christian extremism isn’t a problem in the US. Christian terrorism is not a problem in the US by any fraction of a fraction of a fraction of Islamic terrorism. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/26 "2010-02-08T21:17:40Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Tim McVeigh was not a practicing Christian Scot, sugar, etc. etc. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Inbred\_Mm\_domesticus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/aca169/32.png) [@Inbred\_Mm\_domesticus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inbred_Mm_domesticus)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/27 "2010-02-08T21:20:03Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > You really aren’t aware of nations with Islam as the official state religion? Really? Seriously? > > \*\*From Wiki: > > - Afghanistan (Islamic state) > - Algeria > - Bahrain > - Bangladesh > - Brunei > - Comoros > - Egypt > - Indonesia (Uses Islamic jurisprudence in private law[citation needed], and in Aceh special territory as a basic law. Officially also recognize Roman Catholicism, Protestantism, Buddhism, Hinduism and Confucianism as religion, but they have much less influence in government and law)[citation needed]. > - Iran (Islamic state) > - Iraq > - Jordan > - Kuwait > - Libya > - Malaysia > - Maldives > - Mauritania (Islamic state) > - Morocco > - Oman > - Pakistan (Islamic state) > - Qatar > - Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic > - Saudi Arabia (Islamic kingdom) > - Somalia (the newly established coalition government announced in March 2009 that it would implement shari’a as the nation’s official judicial system.[22]) > - Tunisia[23] > - United Arab Emirates > - Yemen (Islamic state) > > Sunni Islam > > ``` > * Algeria[citation needed] > * Comoros[citation needed] > * Malaysia > * Maldives[citation needed] > * Mauritania > * Pakistan[citation needed] (as national-sanctioned religion) > * Saudi Arabia (as state-sanctioned religion) > * Somalia > * Jordan > * Indonesia (Aceh Special Province Only) > > ``` > > Shi’a Islam > > ``` > * Iran (as state-sanctioned religion)** > > ``` > > As for the second point that The Bith Shuffle made about animosity between the Muslim World and the West are you not aware of the celebrations that occurred in Islamic countries after 9/11? Is this because you didn’t know there were Islamic countries? I see a list of countries representing dozens of ethnicities and several different forms of government in your quote. Do they act as a Muslim hive mind that makes the use of the label “The Muslim World” something accurate or even useful? No. Will this imaginary world be able to overwhelm the populations of “The West” such that they can make a significant dent in the traditions favored by those in “The West”? No. The statement is silly and nothing more than an extension of prejudice where people tend to ignore the individual differences of an outgroup. As far as statment #2 goes, I was in a 99% Muslim country on 9/11 and only so saw sadness, heard dozens of apologies once it was found out that I am an American, and people uncontrollably sobbing because their loved ones were in New York. Thanks to our willingness to allow immigration, people all over the world have a direct connection with the USA. I personally don’t want that to change because of xenophobes. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/28 "2010-02-08T21:20:03Z")
> [@Inbred\_Mm\_domesticus](#): > > Can you please point, on a map, maybe make a link to it, where we can find the “Muslim World”? > **[File:Muslim distribution.png](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Muslim_distribution.png)** > > About high numbers of Muslims in Russia (30 million - 21%) > Wayback Machine (2005 figure: 21 million). > Wayback Machine (an article from 1961! lists a figure of 30 million). Not specifically indicated if this figure was for the RSFSR or the entire Soviet Union. See the upper right-hand corner for the date. > About the percentage of Muslims in Albania (79.9%) > Wayback Machine I’d say that the 90-100% region is pretty well defined. ---
**Author:** ![Inbred\_Mm\_domesticus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/aca169/32.png) [@Inbred\_Mm\_domesticus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inbred_Mm_domesticus)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/29 "2010-02-08T21:22:17Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > [File:Muslim distribution.png - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Muslim_distribution.png) > > I’d say that the 90-100% region is pretty well defined. Who cares, my point is made above, there is a ton of variation in terms of liberal values in what is called the Muslim World and I notice that your site and **Magiver** ’s don’t even point to the same terrain. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/30 "2010-02-08T21:26:27Z")
> [@BrightNShiny](#): > > No, by pass, I mean trying to pretend that Christian extremism isn’t a problem in the US. It’s not, really. But since you seem to think it is, can you supply why. How many Christian extremists (whatever that means) have committed acts of terrorism in the U.S., in how long a time and resulting in how many deaths. Also, since you seem to think that the ignorant xenophobes among us unfairly point to Muslim extremists as the main problem, are you prepared to assert that the FBI is expending as much effort in looking into terrorist threats from white Christians are they are Muslim extremists? If not, wouldn’t that mean that the white Christian terrorists should be having a field day, since the FBI is looking elsewhere? ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/31 "2010-02-08T21:27:52Z")
> [@BrightNShiny](#): > > Just to add, I find the certainty with which it is being claimed that McVeigh was not a Christian to be out of proportion to his conflicting and obscure statements. To [whit](http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,109478,00.html): > > He was raised a Christian and said he maintained certain “core” beliefs. Perhaps he truly was an agnostic, perhaps he was a non-denominational Christian. But wouldn’t you grant that he was not a “Christian extremist”? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/32 "2010-02-08T21:33:52Z")
> [@BrightNShiny](#): > > Not all Muslim extremists espouse a specifically religious cause either–some of them espouse a political cause. Are you going to classify those people not as Muslim extremists? Your problem is going to be that Islam does not recognize the distinction between religion, and political organization. So it is quite difficult to maintain the distinction between political and religion motivation, in the case of Islamic terrorism. But let’s try to avoid that by using an objective standard, and then comparing Christian terrorism with Islamic terrorism using that. Let’s choose deaths. That’s measurable. So, the first attack on the World Trade Center killed six people and wounded another 1.042 others ([cite](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1993_World_Trade_Center_bombing)). 9/11 killed another 3,066 (I assume you don’t need a cite on that). So in the last decade, Islamic terrorists in the US have killed 3,072 people. Could you please come up with a count of all the people killed by Christian terrorists in the US during the same period? I can only think of three, and that’s if you go back further to 1996. Then we can compare the totals and see which is the greater problem, Islamic terrorism and Christian terrorism. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![BrightNShiny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@BrightNShiny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrightNShiny)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/33 "2010-02-08T21:41:59Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > It’s not, really. But since you seem to think it is, can you supply why. How many Christian extremists (whatever that means) have committed acts of terrorism in the U.S., in how long a time and resulting in how many deaths. I’m not playing this game, because deaths are not the only measure of extremist activity, and if I were to compile deaths by Christian groups in this country for it’s entire history (such as terrorist acts committed by the KKK), it would certainly add up to far more than the 2800 or so deaths from 9/11. However, compiling deaths over the entire history of the United States is rather pointless, since nobody is bombing churches over civil rights anymore. Right now, in the US, in the present, we have two groups that pose a threat to national security - Christian and Islamic extremists. > [@](#): > > Also, since you seem to think that the ignorant xenophobes among us unfairly point to Muslim extremists as the main problem, are you prepared to assert that the FBI is expending as much effort in looking into terrorist threats from white Christians are they are Muslim extremists? If not, wouldn’t that mean that the white Christian terrorists should be having a field day, since the FBI is looking elsewhere? The FBI certainly does spend a lot of time looking at Christian extremists, and they have successfully thwarted several plots over the years (such as this [WMD](http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article5350.htm) plot). It’s not the FBI that I think gives the pass (fortunately for the rest of us, the FBI understands the threat and is actually concerned about our domestic security). It’s people like you who try to pretend there isn’t a problem with Christian extremists. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/34 "2010-02-08T21:43:15Z")
> [@Inbred\_Mm\_domesticus](#): > > I see a list of countries representing dozens of ethnicities and several different forms of government in your quote. Do they act as a Muslim hive mind that makes the use of the label “The Muslim World” something accurate or even useful? No. Are you trying to imply that Muslims don’t see regions of the world as distinctly Muslim? Are you so full of political correctness that you can’t acknowledge this? Are you really willing to say that there isn’t a problem with Islamic extremism as a distinct anti-Western condition? As we speak the Supreme Leader of Iran Ayatollah Ali Khamenei is threatening some kind of event this week against Western powers. > [@Inbred\_Mm\_domesticus](#): > > As far as statment #2 goes, I was in a 99% Muslim country on 9/11 and only so saw sadness, heard dozens of apologies once it was found out that I am an American, and people uncontrollably sobbing because their loved ones were in New York. For discussion purposes what country would that be because I’m willing to bet there was open celebration of 9/11 in the streets by extremists. Do you not understand the term Muslim extremists? It’s a term that accurately describes the fanatical side of the religion. It does not represent the entire religion but it’s an acknowledgment of fact that the fringe element exists and is actively promoting random acts of violence. ---
**Author:** ![BrightNShiny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@BrightNShiny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrightNShiny)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/35 "2010-02-08T21:43:19Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > But wouldn’t you grant that he was not a “Christian extremist”? Why should I grant that? His statements were conflicting, and it’s just as reasonable to call him a Christian extremist as it is to say he was an agnostic extremist. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/36 "2010-02-08T21:46:50Z")
> [@Inbred\_Mm\_domesticus](#): > > Who cares, my point is made above, there is a ton of variation in terms of liberal values in what is called the Muslim World and I notice that your site and **Magiver** ’s don’t even point to the same terrain. The people committing the acts of terror are Muslim extremists. They all belong to a larger group called Muslims. Yes, they are a minority. But given the sheer numbers, there are many, many millions who believe that violence against innocents is justified. [Here is an excellent post by George Kaplin from another thread that sheds some light.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9323153&postcount=18) ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/37 "2010-02-08T21:49:37Z")
> [@BrightNShiny](#): > > I’m not playing this game, because deaths are not the only measure of extremist activity, and if I were to compile deaths by Christian groups in this country for it’s entire history (such as terrorist acts committed by the KKK), it would certainly add up to far more than the 2800 or so deaths from 9/11. > > However, compiling deaths over the entire history of the United States is rather pointless, since nobody is bombing churches over civil rights anymore. Right now, in the US, in the present, we have two groups that pose a threat to national security - Christian and Islamic extremists. But you’re trying to equate their threat by degree. You can’t just say that they fall into two groups and then assume they’re equal. You must be kidding. > [@BrightNShiny](#): > > The FBI certainly does spend a lot of time looking at Christian extremists, and they have successfully thwarted several plots over the years (such as this [WMD](http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article5350.htm) plot). It’s not the FBI that I think gives the pass (fortunately for the rest of us, the FBI understands the threat and is actually concerned about our domestic security). It’s people like you who try to pretend there isn’t a problem with Christian extremists. Convince me. You seem to be working from the assumption that both groups are equal threats. ---
**Author:** ![BrightNShiny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@BrightNShiny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrightNShiny)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/38 "2010-02-08T21:51:48Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Your problem is going to be that Islam does not recognize the distinction between religion, and political organization. So it is quite difficult to maintain the distinction between political and religion motivation, in the case of Islamic terrorism. This is utter nonsense, since there’s no shortage of secular-based philosophies that were developed by Muslims (such as Baathism, pan-Arabism, Pakistani secularist philosophy, etc.). But I would also add that there are Christians who also do not distinguish between religion and political organization in the US. There’s not some clear cut line that divides political from religious motivations except in the case of explicitly atheistic political movements. > [@](#): > > But let’s try to avoid that by using an objective standard, and then comparing Christian terrorism with Islamic terrorism using that. Let’s choose deaths. That’s measurable. As I’ve pointed out multiple times in this thread, there is no particular reason to use this as the sole metric, and that over the entire history of the US, the death toll from Christians is much higher. > [@](#): > > So, the first attack on the World Trade Center killed six people and wounded another 1.042 others ([cite](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1993_World_Trade_Center_bombing)). 9/11 killed another 3,066 (I assume you don’t need a cite on that). > > So in the last decade, Islamic terrorists in the US have killed 3,072 people. Could you please come up with a count of all the people killed by Christian terrorists in the US during the same period? I can only think of three, and that’s if you go back further to 1996. > > Then we can compare the totals and see which is the greater problem, Islamic terrorism and Christian terrorism. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You want to limit the statistics in such a way so that you can see which is the “greater” problem, not whether or not both of them are a problem. Personally, I think people stockpiling WMDs in Texas is a problem, regardless of how many people do it, but I can see that since it’s not a “greater” problem, it’s not relevant. Honestly, I never thought I’d see the day when people would so blatantly spit on our national security. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/39 "2010-02-08T21:53:15Z")
> [@BrightNShiny](#): > > Why should I grant that? His statements were conflicting, and it’s just as reasonable to call him a Christian extremist as it is to say he was an agnostic extremist. WHAT?! A Christian extremist is not someone who is just 1) Christian and 2) extreme. His extremism must be in hi Christianity, or the degree he wishes to impose or protect it. You seem to be trying really hard to construct a reality that doesn’t exist. The very thing you seem to be arguing against. I think you need to think this through a little more. ---
**Author:** ![BrightNShiny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@BrightNShiny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrightNShiny)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2010, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988/40 "2010-02-08T21:53:29Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > But you’re trying to equate their threat by degree. You can’t just say that they fall into two groups and then assume they’re equal. You must be kidding. I didn’t equate the threat by degree. They are both threats, and neither should get a pass. > [@](#): > > Convince me. You seem to be working from the assumption that both groups are equal threats. Nope, I would never claim that, because it depends on how you want to analyze the statistics. Why don’t you convince me that people blowing up buildings, shooting people and stock piling WMDs doesn’t constitute a significant threat? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-fight-ignorance-xenophobia-regarding-islam/527988.md?page=3)