# Help me understand "Gay Pride"? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 7, 2019, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670 "2019-07-07T14:34:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 10:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/221 "2019-07-10T10:46:21Z")
> [@MarvinKitFox](#): > > Gay pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being gay. > This is commonly seen as a good thing. > > Black Pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being black. > This is commonly seen as a good thing. > > White Pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being white. > These bigots should be crucified. Literally if possible, otherwise at the minimum on the altar of public condemnation. Are you prepared to discuss this post or is this a drive-by? ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 11:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/222 "2019-07-10T11:07:43Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Well my friend really has had little adversity in his life connected to his gayness. His coming out was easy, it didnt hurt his career, and he’s a good looking guy so finding a partner wasnt a problem. 50 years ago, this would not have been true, at least not for most gay people. The fact that this is possible today is no accident. It’s the end result of decades of hard work in changing the hearts and minds of people who once believed homosexuality was vile. Not the least of which is standing up in droves saying out loud to anyone and everyone that you are proud to be gay, not ashamed. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 11:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/223 "2019-07-10T11:11:10Z")
> [@MarvinKitFox](#): > > Gay pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being gay. > This is commonly seen as a good thing. > > Black Pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being black. > This is commonly seen as a good thing. > > … You have gay people and black people, gay black people doing what? Standing in your yard waiting for you to emerge from your house so they can get all up in your grill? Give me a fucking break. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/224 "2019-07-10T12:44:55Z")
> [@MarvinKitFox](#): > > White Pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being white. > These bigots should be crucified. Literally if possible, otherwise at the minimum on the altar of public condemnation. Not seeing much White Pride there, but maybe you could hold a White Petulance parade. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/225 "2019-07-10T12:52:46Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Your thread title asks for help understanding gay pride, but you really don’t seem interested at all in understanding it. It’s worth noting that [he’s got form going back a few years](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=756662). So I expect his earnest questions about gay pride to be just as sincere as his previous questions on similar topics. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/226 "2019-07-10T22:30:06Z")
> [@MarvinKitFox](#): > > Gay pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being gay. > This is commonly seen as a good thing. > > Black Pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being black. > This is commonly seen as a good thing. > > White Pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being white. > These bigots should be crucified. Literally if possible, otherwise at the minimum on the altar of public condemnation. When has anyone in America been persecuted for being white? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/227 "2019-07-10T22:32:34Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > When has anyone in America been persecuted for being white? Nazis are white. They are also really into white pride. I think that what **Marvin** was driving at? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/228 "2019-07-10T22:53:12Z")
> [@MarvinKitFox](#): > > Gay pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being gay. > This is commonly seen as a good thing. > > Black Pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being black. > This is commonly seen as a good thing. Irish pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being Irish. (See also: St. Patrick’s Day.) This is commonly seen as a good thing. Scottish pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being Scottish. This is commonly seen as a good thing. German pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being German. This is commonly seen as a good thing. Swedish pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being Swedish. This is commonly seen as a good thing. Welsh pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being Welsh. This is commonly seen as a good thing. Italian pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being Italian. This is commonly seen as a good thing. Polish pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being Polish. This is commonly seen as a good thing. French-Canadian pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being French-Canadian. This is commonly seen as a good thing. And so on and so on and so on and so on and so on for pretty much every single **actual ethno-cultural group** that is historically identified as racially white. > [@MarvinKitFox](#): > > White Pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being white. > These bigots should be crucified. Literally if possible, otherwise at the minimum on the altar of public condemnation. Because so-called “White Pride”, unlike the ethno-cultural pride associated with all the abovementioned groups that count as racially white, **is purely a made-up concept whose only ethno-culturally defining feature is “not being nonwhite”**. In other words, it exists only as a legacy of historical racism and bigotry. If you want to celebrate St. Patrick’s or Syttende Mai or Saint David’s Day or Dyngus Day or any other festival expressing pride in being part of a particular ethno-cultural group that is racially classified as white, there’s nothing at all wrong with that: knock yourself out and have a ball. But if you’re demanding acceptance for a so-called “white pride” celebration of an identity that literally has no meaning, history or purpose other than traditional racist denigration of nonwhite people, that’s bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2019, 7:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/229 "2019-07-11T07:42:30Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Well my friend really has had little adversity in his life connected to his gayness. His coming out was easy, it didnt hurt his career, and he’s a good looking guy so finding a partner wasnt a problem. Why would a gay guy who works with someone who’s pretty clearly not friendly to LGBT issues tell him about problems he encounters (if we pick it up on this board, I’m sure it comes across in person even more)? Most people I know would not recount incidents of harassment or threats to work colleagues in general, and especially wouldn’t if they’re a minority and the other person is a non-minority that they’re not on very close terms with. If the guy was harassed by parts of his family and other people he knew when he came out, I wouldn’t expect him to unload all of that on a work colleague. Same with dating woes, most people I know (especially minorities dealing with minority issues) aren’t going to talk about the tricky parts of their love life, they’ll just present a ‘no problems’ picture to the world. And again while it’s possible that it didn’t hurt his career, if it did he would be incredibly foolish to talk about it with a co-worker, as that could hurt his career even more - whether by ‘he’s spreading rumors that the VP hates gays, so awful’ or ‘he admitted he’d rather work with the tech at OtherCorp but chose here because we won’t fire him for being gay’. Even ignoring the silliness of using one incidental acquaintance as the sole sample, there’s good reason to believe that the acquaintance would give him a very sanitized tale. ---
**Author:** ![Haldurson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/51bf81/32.png) [@Haldurson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Haldurson)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2019, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/230 "2019-07-12T02:41:00Z")
I had a best friend growing up who was gay. He was bullied all the time, and I was bullied simply for being his friend. While it may be true that being gay is a lot more accepted today, that does not mean that the fight for being treated like a normal human being with all the rights accorded to human beings in this country is over, just as the fight for civil rights did not end when blacks were given the vote, or even when Obama was elected. Change is slow, and it’s not all in one direction, because there’s always push back when people seen as evil or unworthy of equal treatment start to make progress. And the rejection of gay pride is part of that push-back, just as the rise of hate crimes and neo-nazis and white nationalism was backlash against a black president. Here’s the thing – the way I look at it is if someone is concerned over the existence of a gay pride movement, even if it’s simply because they don’t understand it, then that’s a sign that we still have a ways to go as civilized people. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2019, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/231 "2019-07-12T04:01:14Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Nazis are white. They are also really into white pride. I think that what **Marvin** was driving at? They weren’t persecuted for being white. They were prosecuted for genocide. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2019, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/232 "2019-07-12T04:02:08Z")
> [@That\_Don\_Guy](#): > > I am under the impression that “queer” is used as a short version of “genderqueer,” which in turn is used as a synonym for “asexual” or perhaps “nonbinary.” Then again, I always thought the Q in LGBTQ stood for “questioning” (as in, “Am I homosexual/bisexual or not?”; I think the “new” letter for that is U, for “unsure”), so what do I know? **Zyada** mostly covered the etymology of “queer.” It started as just meaning “strange,” usually with slightly unsavory overtones. It evolved into a specifically anti-gay slur, then was reclaimed as a self identification, basically as an umbrella term for anyone who’s not heterosexual. “Genderqueer” evolved from that usage, to basically mean anyone whose gender representation/identity isn’t strictly traditional or their assigned gender. It covers a wide range of identities. “Nonbinary” is usually considered a subset\* of genderqueer, and refers to some who identifies as neither male or female. “Asexual” isn’t a gender identity, it’s a sexual orientation, and means someone who is not interested in sex at all. The Q in LGBTQ can sometimes mean “questioning,” although that’s pretty rare these days. Beyond “LGBT” the rest of the alphabet soup gets pretty arbitrary. You might see a U, or a ?, or even a second Q. \*The subset concept is a little tricky here, because you might meet someone who identifies as nonbinary, but not genderqueer, for any reason from the politically inscrutable to the purely aesthetic. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2019, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/233 "2019-07-12T04:04:32Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > They weren’t persecuted for being white. They were prosecuted for genocide. And in WWII, they killed all the people who committed genocide. And you know what you call it when you kill all the people? ---
**Author:** ![Miss\_Mapp](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miss_mapp/32/369_2.png) [@Miss\_Mapp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miss_Mapp)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2019, 11:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/234 "2019-07-12T11:13:27Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Irish pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being Irish. (See also: St. Patrick’s Day.) > This is commonly seen as a good thing. > > Scottish pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being Scottish. > This is commonly seen as a good thing. > > German pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being German. > This is commonly seen as a good thing. > > Swedish pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being Swedish. > This is commonly seen as a good thing. > > Welsh pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being Welsh. > This is commonly seen as a good thing. > > Italian pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being Italian. > This is commonly seen as a good thing. > > Polish pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being Polish. > This is commonly seen as a good thing. > > French-Canadian pride: Being LOUD and IN-YOUR-FACE about your pride in being French-Canadian. > This is commonly seen as a good thing. > > And so on and so on and so on and so on and so on for pretty much every single **actual ethno-cultural group** that is historically identified as racially white. Most of these ethnic groups have been at one time the minority population in the UK or Canada or, in the US, were considered those dirty foreign immigrant people with the funny accents and suspect religious practices (usually Catholicism). They may all look like plain old White People today, but a few generations back, they were seen as Not Quite White or Not the Right Kind of White. In short, it’s not being White they’re expressing pride in. They are standing up together be proud of their ethnicity for the same reason any other group expresses pride at who they are: because they were once made to feel ashamed of it. ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2019, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/235 "2019-07-12T13:26:25Z")
This is fair, and may be why we don’t have any kind of national celebration of in-yer-face Englishness. Well, unless you count Wimbledon. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2019, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/236 "2019-07-12T15:52:30Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > And in WWII, they killed all the people who committed genocide. And you know what you call it when you kill all the people? Ah, am I being whooshed here? I certainly hope so. No, they didn’t kill anywhere near all the people who committed genocide. Only a relative handful were tried; and not all the ones who were tried were executed. And comparing executing people after trial and conviction for crimes they chose to commit to killing people because of a social category they were born into is . . . not a good comparison. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2019, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/237 "2019-07-12T16:04:02Z")
> [@thorny\_locust](#): > > Ah, am I being whooshed here? Yes. You are being whooshed very, very hard. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2019, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/238 "2019-07-12T21:17:08Z")
Glad to hear it. ---
**Author:** ![Zyada](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zyada/32/3028_2.png) [@Zyada](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zyada)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2019, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/239 "2019-07-13T13:53:45Z")
I found this post today on tumbler, and it’s important: > [@](#): > > THAT IS WHY WE GROUP TOGETHER. That’s a huge part of why we have Pride, for example. To remind ourselves that we stand in solidarity with each other, even if we don’t know each other, that we share our struggles, and that we are NOT alone, and that the thing we are denigrated for being is actually such a beautiful thing. Read the whole thing here: [Here’s the thing about oppression. It’s more than just the effect it has on you.](https://oldfartfangirl.tumblr.com/post/186257242994/heres-the-thing-about-oppression-its-more-than) ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2019, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670/240 "2019-07-15T13:13:40Z")
Alan Turing will be on the British fifty-pound note: [Alan Turing will be the face of the £50 note | CNN Business](https://www.cnn.com/2019/07/15/business/alan-turing-50-pound-note/index.html) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-gay-pride/836670.md?page=11)