# Help me understand this conspiracy group **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 17, 2011, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-this-conspiracy-group/599940 "2011-10-17T18:39:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Oliveritaly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oliveritaly/32/15233_2.png) [@Oliveritaly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oliveritaly)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-this-conspiracy-group/599940/1 "2011-10-17T18:39:14Z")
I doubt I’m bring anything new here and I’m not going to directly link the message board I’m referring too (though I think it will be painfully obvious who I am talking about) but help me please. Are these people for real? Do they really, truly and honestly believe the earth is flat or do they cling to that line because it gives them attention. There is an ‘organization’ (.org) that I somehow stumbled upon that is a society that believes the earth is flat. Are the ‘hard-core’ flat earth people getting into bed at night and just giggling like fools at the effort people put on the arguments trying to talk them out of the belief? I find most conspiracy theories fascinating but I haven’t found one yet that I bought into … the level of effort that someone might go to in order to ‘link it all together’ is what gets me but WOW the flat earth guys, holy crap man. That said these folks are just over the top? After reading a few bits I had to ask, are they just REALLY dedicated trolls? I don’t want to link to their forums because I think that’s not allowed but again it’s a flat earth society and they are an organization. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-this-conspiracy-group/599940/2 "2011-10-17T18:45:30Z")
You can link to it. I assume it’s[the one described in this Wikipedia article](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_Earth_Society). Perhaps the article will answer your questions. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-this-conspiracy-group/599940/3 "2011-10-17T18:45:50Z")
> [@Oliveritaly](#): > > There is an ‘organization’ (.org) Anyone can own a .org domain name. _Anyone._ There are no controls applied to them. As for your actual question: It’s impossible to know for certain. We can guess, and we can look at evidence one way and the other, but the only person who can possibly know a person’s motivations is that person. ---
**Author:** ![Oliveritaly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oliveritaly/32/15233_2.png) [@Oliveritaly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oliveritaly)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-this-conspiracy-group/599940/4 "2011-10-17T18:53:05Z")
Derleth, good point, thank you. Not sure why I thought general questions was the place to be, likely because in my head it was, “Duh! The earth is round so there MUST be a factual answer to this”. If this should be moved then I hope a mod will forgive me and move it. I did read that wiki Tripolar but it didn’t help me much. So many of the ‘answers’ on their forum to questions that, well, question their beliefs were just weird to me. I’d love to hear both of your thoughts or opinions on the matter. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-this-conspiracy-group/599940/5 "2011-10-17T19:01:15Z")
One of the founders of the older Flat Earth Societies was on the up and up. He really did believe it was flat because the Bible said so. He got on “60 Minutes” type shows and all that. His Earth model was like the UN flag (which he interpreted as supporting him). The North Pole in the middle, a mysterious ice wall at the edge around Antarctica. I don’t think he would have considered himself a conspiracy type. This was about religion and beliefs about that fall into another mental category. However, it seems that the majority of people joining the old FES were doing it for fun. Gift memberships were common gag gifts. A lot of scientists would have a membership certificate on the wall for fun. Things have gotten a bit messy with these groups. Splinters and all that. ---
**Author:** ![Oliveritaly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oliveritaly/32/15233_2.png) [@Oliveritaly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oliveritaly)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-this-conspiracy-group/599940/6 "2011-10-17T19:06:37Z")
Thanks, FTG. I read part of that icewall bit. The how to ‘defend’ it part was a facinating read into crazy until … until I realized it was just that. I honestly do get the impression that a lot of the posters there are just faking it. I could be wrong but wow that’s a lot of effort. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-this-conspiracy-group/599940/7 "2011-10-17T19:52:57Z")
Reminds me of [The Man Will Never Fly Memorial Society](http://manwillneverfly.com/). Many of the members are pilots. ---
**Author:** ![appleciders](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85f322/32.png) [@appleciders](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/appleciders)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2011, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-this-conspiracy-group/599940/8 "2011-10-17T20:08:29Z")
The “Flat Earth Society” used to distribute educational videos to school districts. I had a high school biology teacher who showed us their materials to demonstrate lousy scientific methods (and presumably to have an easy thing to do after reading through the syllabus on the first day). Much of it has the same fallacy as evolution denial-- their reading of the Bible leads them to believe that the world must be flat, so they gather together evidence that it is and reject evidence that it’s not. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2011, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-this-conspiracy-group/599940/9 "2011-10-18T03:44:09Z")
> [@ftg](#): > > One of the founders of the older Flat Earth Societies was on the up and up. He really did believe it was flat because the Bible said so. He got on “60 Minutes” type shows and all that. His Earth model was like the UN flag (which he interpreted as supporting him). The North Pole in the middle, a mysterious ice wall at the edge around Antarctica. Yep. Ol’ Charles K. Johnson, and his wife Marjorie. I’ve seen him on tv, and read some of what he wrote. He’s wonderfully naive, to the point of illiteracy. But he was sincere. Marjorie came back from a trip to Australia, and had a signed and notarized affidavit, declaring that never, not once, the whole time while she had been there, had she been upside down! Another interesting point about his “society” was that no member had any way of communicating with any other member: members could only communicate with Johnson himself. If he chose to publish their letters, he would remove their names, and identify them only as “Member, Massachusetts” or “Member, California,” or whatever. It wasn’t a pyramid in organization, but a pinnacle. Johnson maintained total central control, so full and absolute that a Stalinist would have been jealous! > [@](#): > > I don’t think he would have considered himself a conspiracy type. This was about religion and beliefs about that fall into another mental category. He did accuse scientists of being part of a vast conspiracy, going back to Greek times. Apparently the whole “Greek Mud Ball” theory was satanic, designed to cause people to doubt the Gospels. > [@](#): > > However, it seems that the majority of people joining the old FES were doing it for fun. Gift memberships were common gag gifts. A lot of scientists would have a membership certificate on the wall for fun. . . . Yep! Me, for instance! I still carry my membership card around with me and show it proudly. I often argue flat-earth cosmology…for fun… (Sort of the way some people argue that Sherlock Holmes or P.D.Q. Bach were real persons. Yeah, we know better…but who cares, so long as everyone has a good time, and the wink is tipped?) Trinopus (you mean P.D.Q. Bach wasn’t a real person?) ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2011, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-this-conspiracy-group/599940/10 "2011-10-18T04:12:27Z")
Who think the earth is flat? Just look outside, it’s obviously bumpy. ---
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2011, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-this-conspiracy-group/599940/11 "2011-10-18T04:16:27Z")
The first thread I clicked in that forum had a flat earth believer asking for cites about which part of the earth is illuminated during daytime. That was enough for me. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2011, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-this-conspiracy-group/599940/12 "2011-10-18T04:47:57Z")
I missed the part about all the turtles holding it up…??? ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2011, 5:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-this-conspiracy-group/599940/13 "2011-10-18T05:51:13Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > I missed the part about all the turtles holding it up…??? No, the ELEPHANTS hold it up. The turtle holds up the elephants. ---
**Author:** ![paperbackwriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/53a042/32.png) [@paperbackwriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/paperbackwriter)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2011, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-this-conspiracy-group/599940/14 "2011-10-18T15:32:46Z")
> [@Mosier](#): > > The first thread I clicked in that forum had a flat earth believer asking for cites about which part of the earth is illuminated during daytime. That was enough for me. [Here you go,](http://www.universetoday.com/73622/terminator/) for all the good that will do. Sincere Flat-Earth believers will explain that away as being part of the scientific conspiracy, I’m sure. ---
**Author:** ![GoodOmens](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/d26b3c/32.png) [@GoodOmens](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GoodOmens)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2011, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-this-conspiracy-group/599940/15 "2011-10-18T17:11:55Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Who think the earth is flat? Just look outside, it’s obviously bumpy. You’ve never been to Kansas, then. ---
**Author:** ![Apollyon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/apollyon/32/4238_2.png) [@Apollyon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apollyon)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2011, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-me-understand-this-conspiracy-group/599940/16 "2011-10-18T19:41:31Z")
> [@Interrobang](#): > > You’ve never been to Kansas, then. Indeed yes: research proving that [Kansas is flatter than a pancake](http://improbable.com/airchives/paperair/volume9/v9i3/kansas.html)\*. 🙂 - (for certain values of “research”, “prove”, “pancake”, and “Kansas”.