# Help with writing numbers as words **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 5, 2010, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298 "2010-08-05T17:33:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Indistinguishable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/90ced4/32.png) [@Indistinguishable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indistinguishable)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2010, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/41 "2010-08-06T17:27:08Z")
That was **CookingWithGas** , not me. (Your quote links to the wrong post; I assume you made a mistake editing the nested quote out of the post you meant to quote) ---
**Author:** ![qpw3141](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/6bbea6/32.png) [@qpw3141](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/qpw3141)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2010, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/42 "2010-08-06T17:32:05Z")
> [@qazwart](#): > > I believe the British have adapted that 1,000,000,000 is a billion, but they still call 1,000,000,000,000 a thousand billion rather than a trillion. Nope, we started using billion for 1,000,000,000 when it became common for sums of money and trillion has gone the same way. Generally speaking the only time you’re going to use trillion is when talking about money - obviously there’s the odd exception - so it makes a lot more sense to use it rather than talking about thousands of billions. > [@acsenray](#): > > Most Americans also use “and” in stating numbers. Only when you ask them about it do they deny it. I’m glad you said that because I would have sworn I’d commonly heard Americans using ‘and’. Rather like omitting ‘of’ after ‘couple’ some do and some don’t. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2010, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/43 "2010-08-06T17:33:01Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > Most Americans also use “and” in stating numbers. Only when you ask them about it do they deny it. I don’t know if most say it or not, but it’s certainly common in the US. Here’s a trailer for [101 Dalmatians](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGKG6zVc58g#t=20). I know for me, at any rate, it’s more natural putting the “and” in it. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2010, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/44 "2010-08-06T19:07:25Z")
One older computer stored images using forty thousand nine hunder and sixty memory units, leadin to the expression ‘A picture is worth A000 words’. ---
**Author:** ![Arnold\_Winkelried](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Arnold\_Winkelried](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arnold_Winkelried)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2010, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/45 "2010-08-06T23:33:25Z")
> [@Polycarp](#): > > There is an excellent reason for not writing numbers with “and”: numbers written in series. Consider the relative clarity of the following: > > “Examples of perfect squares are sixteen, eighty-one, one hundred twenty-five, and one hundred forty-four.” > > “Examples of perfect squares are sixteen, eighty-one, one hundred and twenty-five, and one hundred and forty-four.” > > The first is clearly 16, 81, 125, and 144 – but the second causes a double-take. Until you get to the Oxford comma and penultimate and, it could be "16, 81, 10 > [@Indistinguishable](#): > > Not at all. The first might just as well be “16, 81, 100, 25, and 144”, “16, 80, 1, 125, and 144”, and “16, 80, 1, 100, 20, 5, and 144”, for all we know. As well as “16, 80, 1, 100, 25, and 144”, “16, 81, 120, 5, and 144”, “16, 80, 1, 120, 5, and 144”… you get the idea. Indistinguishable, you seem to be saying that someone could read “Examples of perfect squares are sixteen, eighty-one, one hundred twenty-five, and one hundred forty-four.” and think that it means “Examples of perfect squares are 16, 80, 1, 100, 20, 5, and 144.” I fail to understand how anyone could read what Polycarp wrote and assume that it meant what you wrote. Unless that person assumes that Polycarp has totally screwed up his punctuation. But then, if the person assumes, we all now what happens! ---
**Author:** ![Indistinguishable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/90ced4/32.png) [@Indistinguishable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indistinguishable)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2010, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/46 "2010-08-06T23:38:20Z")
I was thinking in terms of spoken language, not written language. In written language, the punctuation is enough to disambiguate in _both_ of **Polycarp** ’s examples. My point is that whatever clarification standardizing on “and”-less number names can offer in such contrived situations is of only extraordinarily minor significance. (Indeed, I feel it is of no genuine significance at all…) ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/47 "2010-08-07T00:43:24Z")
> [@qpw3141](#): > > > [@acsenray](#): > > > > Most Americans also use “and” in stating numbers. Only when you ask them about it do they deny it. > > I’m glad you said that because I would have sworn I’d commonly heard Americans using ‘and’. > > Rather like omitting ‘of’ after ‘couple’ some do and some don’t. Yes, witness my aforementioned Texas math teacher insisting on it. But I’ve actually had discussions with Brit editors and writers over here who have asked me why Americans don’t use the “and,” so they’ve obviously noticed a lack of Americans doing it. I honestly don’t use it myself. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/48 "2010-08-07T01:39:04Z")
> [@qpw3141](#): > > [quote=“Gary “Wombat” Robson, post:31, topic:549298”] > > 1. It adds unnecessary words. “Two thousand two” is shorter than “Two thousand and two,” and the “and” adds absolutely nothing. You could say that about a lot of words used to make English sentences. [/QUOTE] If they add nothing, take them out. ---
**Author:** ![Indistinguishable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/90ced4/32.png) [@Indistinguishable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indistinguishable)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/49 "2010-08-07T01:40:00Z")
Why? There’s no prize for scraping with the bare minimum number of words. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/50 "2010-08-07T02:18:41Z")
> [@Indistinguishable](#): > > Why? There’s no prize for scraping with the bare minimum number of words. Because. ---
**Author:** ![Indistinguishable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/90ced4/32.png) [@Indistinguishable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indistinguishable)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/51 "2010-08-07T02:19:14Z")
🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/52 "2010-08-07T02:27:13Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > > [@Indistinguishable](#): > > > > Why? There’s no prize for scraping with the bare minimum number of words. > > Because. 'Cause. ---
**Author:** ![Markxxx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5daacb/32.png) [@Markxxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Markxxx)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/53 "2010-08-07T05:37:04Z")
[quote=“Indistinguishable, post:19, topic:549298”] > [@ZipperJJ](#): > > …But who cares? Say whatever you want. We don’t have to be in lockstep. That’s just the kind of thinking that lost us China 😃 ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/54 "2010-08-07T07:41:18Z")
> [@These are my own pants](#): > > > [@PlainJain](#): > > > > Thank you. > > Though **Indistinguishable** makes a good point, my posts are in British English where you should always use an ‘and’ if it is appropiate. I am pretty sure the Britain, like America, and unlike France, has no legally empowered National Grammar board that decides such things. In either case, the “and” is common usage and does not detract from understanding, so it’s OK. Unless your employer has ruled you- at work- must follow some private guide of some sort. ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 7:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/55 "2010-08-07T07:50:23Z")
Dimensionally, the word “and” could be eliminated in all of the above cases with a colloquial or understood syntax and sequence. Sort of like the standard GPS coordinates. The “and” could also be superfluous and confusing in some structures… ---
**Author:** ![qpw3141](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/6bbea6/32.png) [@qpw3141](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/qpw3141)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 7:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/56 "2010-08-07T07:58:05Z")
> [@spark240](#): > > > [@qpw3141](#): > > > > You could say that about a lot of words used to make English sentences. > > If they add nothing, take them out. My name isn’t Hemingway. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Pearse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/richard_pearse/32/13144_2.png) [@Richard\_Pearse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Pearse)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 9:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/57 "2010-08-07T09:53:41Z")
> [@Indistinguishable](#): > > Why? There’s no prize for scraping with the bare minimum number of words. Don’t you mean, “Why? No prize scraping with min words”? ---
**Author:** ![Superhal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Superhal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superhal)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 10:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/58 "2010-08-07T10:18:06Z")
Woot, just in time. “And” is used for the last two digits only if the last two digits are the tens place, the ones place, or cents… **IF it is being spoken**. In writing, no “and” is used if the number is over 2 digits long, at 3 digits or more, the number is usually written numerically: 1,100 = one thousand, one hundred. 1,011 = one thousand and eleven. 1,110 = one thousand, one hundred, and ten. $1000.10 = one thousand dollars and ten cents. 1,111 = eleven hundred and eleven, up to 2000. Exceptions: Years Money without cents (although many will use it, e.g. one thousand and eleven dollars.) Numbers less than 100. Hundreds system of thousands (e.g. thirteen hundred) where “hundred” is dropped, (e.g. 9999 = ninety nine, ninety nine.) I did not find this in a book, I just use this rule and have found it to be accurate of all examples of use I have found. ---
**Author:** ![Asympotically\_fat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e47c2d/32.png) [@Asympotically\_fat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asympotically_fat)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 10:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/59 "2010-08-07T10:41:15Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > > [@These are my own pants](#): > > > > Though **Indistinguishable** makes a good point, my posts are in British English where you should always use an ‘and’ if it is appropiate. > > I am pretty sure the Britain, like America, and unlike France, has no legally empowered National Grammar board that decides such things. > > In either case, the “and” is common usage and does not detract from understanding, so it’s OK. Unless your employer has ruled you- at work- must follow some private guide of some sort. C’mon you’re wasting your time with that post, dropping the ‘and’ is unheard of in British English. Languages **do** have rules, there can dialetical differences in these rules and how stringently they are applied. In this case in British English though you have a very strong rule about the use of the ‘and’ in numbers. ---
**Author:** ![Superhal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Superhal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superhal)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2010, 10:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298/60 "2010-08-07T10:44:40Z")
Arrgh. It should read “under 3 digits” not “over 2 digits.” ☹ [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/help-with-writing-numbers-as-words/549298.md?page=4)