# "Helter Skelter" and Charles Manson - Why the connection? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 22, 2005, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678 "2005-03-22T03:47:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![saramamalana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/74df32/32.png) [@saramamalana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/saramamalana)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/1 "2005-03-22T03:47:27Z")
Well there’s the question right there. My friends and I all know that for some reason that Beatles song is associated with Charles Manson, but no one knows exactly why. We know that they didn’t write the song about Manson, and we’ve determined that they came out around the same time, but why is that association made? What’s the connection? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Blue_Sky)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/2 "2005-03-22T03:52:43Z")
From [this site](http://www.francesfarmersrevenge.com/stuff/serialkillers/manson.htm): > [@](#): > > In 1968, Charlie forecasted a racial war. The Beatles released their White Album, which had the song “Helter Skelter.” The lyrics fit Charlie’s theory of war: “look out helter skelter, helter skelter, helter skelter. She’s coming down fast, yes she is, yes she is.” The Armageddon now had a name. It was “Helter Skelter.” YMMV. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/3 "2005-03-22T03:55:04Z")
It was Manson’s understanding that the Beatles were communicating with him via the White Album – that it outlined the steps required to bring about the apocalypse. He had his followers commit the murders with the expectation that they would be blamed on black criminals, which would start a race war. Manson and his family were going to sit out the conflagration hiding in the desert and then come out after the races had destroyed each other to repopulate the earth. IIRC – I wrote my senior thesis on this (religion major, seminar on the Apocalyptic), but that’s 30 years ago. Someone more current on it will be along in a second. ---
**Author:** ![davmilasav](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e9bcb4/32.png) [@davmilasav](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davmilasav)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/4 "2005-03-22T04:00:02Z")
Ummm, have you read the book? (Helter Skelter by Vincent Bugliosi.) Or barring that, rented the video? Bugliosi was the prosecuting attorney on the case. He couldn’t make the association either but when he did, damn if it wasn’t the most off-the-wall murder motive ever! Manson thought The Beatles were talking to him through their music. He decided that the songs “Piggies,” “Helter Skelter” and “Blackbird” were about Charlie’s bid to – dare I say it? – take over the world. Or at least the US. His plan was to murder some rich and famous people and blame the crimes on “the blacks.” This would result in a race war. Meanwhile he and his family would hang out at the Spahn Ranch. After the dust cleared, Charlie would lead us all to peace, freedom, sex, drugs, sex and more sex. The murders were particularly gruesome and phrases from the songs were written on the walls in the victims’ blood. This was the tip-off that Bugliosi needed to figure out what was going on. Seriously. Of course, it’s more complex than that but that’s the gist of the matter. The songs are on The Beatles’ album The Beatles aka The White Album. Helter Skelter is actually Brit slang for what we Yanks call a sliding board. ---
**Author:** ![Sublight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@Sublight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sublight)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/5 "2005-03-22T04:06:20Z")
I remeber a cartoon, I think in National Lampoon, that had Chuckie listening to the White album again right after it came out on CD. “So _that’s_ what he was saying? Huh. Well, my bad.” ---
**Author:** ![mike1dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@mike1dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mike1dog)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/6 "2005-03-22T05:03:38Z")
> [@](#): > > Helter Skelter is actually Brit slang for what we Yanks call a sliding board. Okay, I’m a “Yank”, but I’ve never heard of a sliding board. Is it something you slide down a hill when it snows? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/7 "2005-03-22T05:08:37Z")
> [@twickster](#): > > It was Manson’s understanding that the Beatles were communicating with him via the White Album – that it outlined the steps required to bring about the apocalypse. [sam kinison] “‘Why don’t we do it in the road,’ how plain does he have to say it, how plain does he have to say it?” . . . You were on **acid,** Manson! You would have got the same message from the Monkees! “‘Hey, hey, we’re the Monkees, people say we monkey around’ – how plain do they have to say it?” [/sam kinison] ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/8 "2005-03-22T05:19:26Z")
> [@mike1dog](#): > > Okay, I’m a “Yank”, but I’ve never heard of a sliding board. Is it something you slide down a hill when it snows? Me either. I think he means a slide, like what you’d find on a playground. ---
**Author:** ![davmilasav](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e9bcb4/32.png) [@davmilasav](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davmilasav)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/9 "2005-03-22T05:21:58Z")
> [@mike1dog](#): > > Okay, I’m a “Yank”, but I’ve never heard of a sliding board. Is it something you slide down a hill when it snows? I’ve never heard them called anything else. It’s that big, scary, metal thing in the playground that you climb up the ladder and then slide down. And if you’re dumb enough to be wearing shorts, you lose a layer of skin. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/10 "2005-03-22T05:25:56Z")
> [@davmilasav](#): > > I’ve never heard them called anything else. It’s that big, scary, metal thing in the playground that you climb up the ladder and then slide down. > > And if you’re dumb enough to be wearing shorts, you lose a layer of skin. :eek: … you mean a _slide_? Where and when are you from that it was called a sliding board? I’ve never heard that term before in my life. ---
**Author:** ![mike1dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@mike1dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mike1dog)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/11 "2005-03-22T05:26:10Z")
Yep, that’s a slide. ---
**Author:** ![Electronic\_Chaos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Electronic\_Chaos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Electronic_Chaos)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/12 "2005-03-22T05:28:55Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > … you mean a _slide_? Where and when are you from that it was called a sliding board? I’ve never heard that term before in my life. Yeah, “sliding board” sounds like something Mr. Burns would say. “Smithers, help me! I seem to be stuck on this sliding board.” ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/13 "2005-03-22T05:38:54Z")
> [@davmilasav](#): > > Manson thought The Beatles were talking to him through their music. He decided that the songs “Piggies,” “Helter Skelter” and “Blackbird” were about Charlie’s bid to – dare I say it? – take over the world. And he came sooooo close! :rolleyes: He _did_ make that schoolbus fly, though. ---
**Author:** ![Antonius\_Block](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/51bf81/32.png) [@Antonius\_Block](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antonius_Block)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/14 "2005-03-22T05:58:10Z")
A Helter Skelter in Britain is specifically a spiral slide built around a tower (usually found in an amusement park with paid admission) rather than the simple linear one found in a children’s playground. One climbs up stairs inside the tower, then goes down the slide on a mat. [Here](http://www.edu.dudley.gov.uk/teachandlearnresources/dudleycd/bcmuseum/funfair.jpg)[are](http://www.melright.com/steam/helter.jpg) [some](http://www.rampantscotland.com/features/graphics/helter424b.jpg)[examples](http://www.helterskelter.co.za/heltaskelter.jpg). ---
**Author:** ![HPL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3da27b/32.png) [@HPL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HPL)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 6:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/15 "2005-03-22T06:51:16Z")
I’ve seen those at amusement parks in the US, but they are never circlular/conical like that. Rather, they are usually just a long, uneven slope. But the british version seems cooler. ---
**Author:** ![betenoir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/258eb7/32.png) [@betenoir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/betenoir)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/16 "2005-03-22T07:38:56Z")
> [@Antonius Block](#): > > A Helter Skelter in Britain is specifically a spiral slide built around a tower (usually found in an amusement park with paid admission) rather than the simple linear one found in a children’s playground. One climbs up stairs inside the tower, then goes down the slide on a mat. This is what I was wondering. Because I didn’t think they were just ordinary slides. But my next question is…do they still have them? I mean, are they still called that? I can’t imagine a kid’s ride being called that in the US due to the Manson thing (although we didn’t call them that to begin with). Has it had a similar effect over there? Or is 6000 miles far enough apart? Or have they been totally supanted by those bloody bouncy castles? _bete begins plans for murder spree somehow involving bouncy castles_ ---
**Author:** ![Antonius\_Block](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/51bf81/32.png) [@Antonius\_Block](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antonius_Block)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 9:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/17 "2005-03-22T09:28:48Z")
> [@betenoir](#): > > This is what I was wondering. Because I didn’t think they were just ordinary slides. But my next question is…do they still have them? I mean, are they still called that? I can’t imagine a kid’s ride being called that in the US due to the Manson thing (although we didn’t call them that to begin with). Has it had a similar effect over there? Or is 6000 miles far enough apart? I’m not the best person to ask, being an expatriate, but I believe that they are still called “helter skelters” (with or without a hyphen). [This BBC page](http://www.bbc.co.uk/nottingham/content/articles/2004/10/06/features_miscellaneous_2004_10_goose_fair_rides_feature.shtml) (dated October 2004) offers you a virtual ride on the helter skelter at Nottingham’s Goose Fair, suggesting that it’s still current usage. I’ve always thought that the whole Manson “Helter Skelter” horror could have been avoided if he’d just had a British-American dictionary. If you’ve never seen the term before, it might seem sinister (shades of “hell” and “skeleton”, woOOoh!), but if your cultural reference point is as something that kids slide down at a FunFair, you wouldn’t associate it with Manson except as an afterthought (and I’d be willing to bet that most people who ride down a helter skelter have never even _heard_ of Charles Manson). A couple of analogous questions: [ul] [li] Should those who believe in astrology stop talking about the Signs of the Zodiac just because of California’s [Zodiac killer](http://www.crimelibrary.com/serial_killers/notorious/zodiac/river_1.html)?[/li][li] Nottingham’s Goose fair ([same link as above](http://www.bbc.co.uk/nottingham/content/articles/2004/10/06/features_miscellaneous_2004_10_goose_fair_rides_feature.shtml)) has a **Tsunami Rollercoaster**. Should they change the name because of the events of December 26, 2004?[/li][/ul] ---
**Author:** ![Cliffy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/59ef9b/32.png) [@Cliffy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cliffy)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/18 "2005-03-22T12:39:48Z")
> [@Sublight](#): > > I remeber a cartoon, I think in National Lampoon, that had Chuckie listening to the White album again right after it came out on CD. > > “So _that’s_ what he was saying? Huh. Well, my bad.” Dennis Miller also made this joke on SNL’s Weekend Update. –Cliffy ---
**Author:** ![Rube\_E.Tewesday](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f0a364/32.png) [@Rube\_E.Tewesday](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rube_E.Tewesday)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/19 "2005-03-22T13:44:39Z")
By the way, some guy named Cecil Adams had something to say about this. [http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a5\_003.html](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a5_003.html) ---
**Author:** ![davmilasav](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e9bcb4/32.png) [@davmilasav](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davmilasav)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2005, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678/20 "2005-03-22T13:54:39Z")
> [@xgxlx](#): > > Yeah, “sliding board” sounds like something Mr. Burns would say. > > “Smithers, help me! I seem to be stuck on this sliding board.” I’m from Western PA (check my Location tag) and grew up in the 70’s. I was born in 1969, and was 5 months old when the murders occurred. I googled “sliding board playground” and found plenty of references, so I’m not the only one who calls it that. However it was eeeeexcellent to be compared to Mr. Burns! 🙂 : As for the twisty slides, every McPlayland in my area has them. My HS band once got kicked off the playground for getting a trombone player stuck on a covered spiral slide. He was over 6’ tall and the turns were too tight. And I don’t know why this bugs me but FYI: I’m a girl. 😃 [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/helter-skelter-and-charles-manson-why-the-connection/295678.md?page=2)