# Here are the defenses offered (so far) for Trump's “Grab them by the pussy" comment **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 9, 2016, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029 "2016-10-09T03:55:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/81 "2016-10-09T16:29:02Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > People don’t ordinarily consent to having their property taken. People regularly consent to sexual touch. Sexual touching and “grabbing” are two different things. Grabbing implies force and empowerment. Grabbing can be painful. Quit changing “grabbing” to “touching,” that’s not what was said. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/82 "2016-10-09T16:29:37Z")
> [@drewder](#): > > I don’t support trump and I never really have, however I do think it ironic that nobody cares about the actual rapes and sexual assaults of Hillary’s husband. Which ones? Links, please. Your guy Trump\* does\* care about the rumor-mongering. Which he will probably bring up tonight, in order to lose\* this \*debate in an even more spectacular way. What fun it will be to watch the last few Republican Rats trying to avoid a watery grave! ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/83 "2016-10-09T16:31:40Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Aside: When I started reading this thread, it was in Elections, and when I got to the end and scrolled up to the top of the page, it had been beamed over to the Pit and me with it. I didn’t even feel my molecules being disassembled and reassembled. That was a first…and very cool! Not really. Now there’s an evil version of you over in Elections stumping for the republican candidate as we speak. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/84 "2016-10-09T16:32:47Z")
> [@Bridget\_Burke](#): > > Which ones? Links, please. > > …What fun it will be to watch the last few Republican Rats trying to avoid a watery grave! You misspelled Paul Ryan. ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/85 "2016-10-09T16:33:22Z")
> [@drewder](#): > > I don’t support trump and I never really have, however I do think it ironic that nobody cares about the actual rapes and sexual assaults of Hillary’s husband. Bill isnt running. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/86 "2016-10-09T16:44:21Z")
> [@drewder](#): > > I don’t support trump and I never really have, however I do think it ironic that nobody cares about the actual rapes and sexual assaults of Hillary’s husband. My first act after I build my time machine is to travel to 1996 and not vote for Bill Clinton. Wait a tic, I _didn’t_ vote for him in 1996. Ha! Obviously this is evidence I will invent time travel in the future! ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/87 "2016-10-09T16:49:27Z")
Some of the thread/posts here and elsewhere have really kind of depressed me. A bunch of men who don’t seem to understand consent, or that just because someone is rich and famous doesn’t mean he can “do anything” to me, but Bullitt impressed me. Kudos. It’s 2016, people. We should not have to explain what consent means, and that “she didn’t fight me off” is not consent. Maybe in your day, whenever that was, a woman freezing up when someone in power grabbed her meant all systems go, but jesus christ. And i agree, almost everything the man has said since he announced he was running was worse than this, but most of that stuff was what he _wants to do_ as president, not what he _has done_ as a “star.” ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/88 "2016-10-09T16:49:53Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > All I am surprised by is that apparently on a scale of “bad” crass comments apparently rank much higher than racism, xenophobia, islamophobia, intentions to order mass deportations, friendship with dictators etc etc. Pretty much all of the previous things he’s said or done were about “the other”. Hispanics, Muslims, etc. This wasn’t about calling a woman named “Alicia Machado” a fat pig. This was about objectifying and sexually harrassing a woman named “Nancy O’Dell”. Most of the Republican politicians in question don’t have women named things like Alicia Machado in their families and social circles. LOTS of them have women named things like “Nancy O’Dell” in those areas. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/89 "2016-10-09T16:53:42Z")
> [@raventhief](#): > > It’s 2016, people. We should not have to explain what consent means, and that “she didn’t fight me off” is not consent. Maybe in your day, whenever that was, a woman freezing up when someone in power grabbed her meant all systems go, but jesus christ. This doesn’t even go into the fact that we socialize women, in our society, to “be nice” and “don’t make a scene” and “don’t embarrass people”. Which leaves them pretty much defenseless when someone is crass and rude enough to try to force not-quite-full-rape activity on them, especially if it’s semi-public (not “in sight” but near enough to get some kind of help), for fear of embarrassing the other person. ESPECIALLY if the other person is more powerful than you socially. ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/90 "2016-10-09T17:00:40Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > This doesn’t even go into the fact that we socialize women, in our society, to “be nice” and “don’t make a scene” and “don’t embarrass people”. Which leaves them pretty much defenseless when someone is crass and rude enough to try to force not-quite-full-rape activity on them, especially if it’s semi-public (not “in sight” but near enough to get some kind of help), for fear of embarrassing the other person. ESPECIALLY if the other person is more powerful than you socially. Absolutely! And to add even more, then people look at how a woman reacts in the wake of sexual assault, and then decide that if she didn’t act a certain way then it wasn’t a big deal. Well, she didn’t scream, or she didn’t fight him off sufficiently, or yell No in his face, or mace him, or whatever, so clearly it wasn’t a crime and she’s lying. Or some damn thing. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/91 "2016-10-09T17:14:30Z")
> [@raventhief](#): > > Absolutely! And to add even more, then people look at how a woman reacts in the wake of sexual assault, and then decide that if she didn’t act a certain way then it wasn’t a big deal. Well, she didn’t scream, or she didn’t fight him off sufficiently, or yell No in his face, or mace him, or whatever, so clearly it wasn’t a crime and she’s lying. Or some damn thing. And we men, unfortunately, tend to think that our societal privilege that allows US to react to things like that overtly negatively also extends to women, and it simply doesn’t. Not even NOW. There’s still an implicit gulf between “acceptable” female reactions to unwelcome advances and acceptable male reactions to the same. It’s eroding as time goes on, and more men are becoming aware that “acceptable” isn’t identical for both sexes, but it still exists, and not in some tiny little pocket of society. All you need to do to know this is so is to look at the prevalence of social media horror stories, especially from dating sites. Rejection of their advances is NOT taken well by a lot of men, and the go-to reaction seems to be absolute fury. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/92 "2016-10-09T17:22:24Z")
> [@drewder](#): > > I don’t support trump and I never really have, however I do think it ironic that nobody cares about the actual rapes and sexual assaults of Hillary’s husband. It appears that you have been asleep for the past 24 years (if you mean “accusations of rapes and sexual assaults”). ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/93 "2016-10-09T17:58:29Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > Oh please. Many many people have said things slike this. In my younger days when I was with the guys, we’d say things somewhat like that. I know I’ve sad things like, I’d jump her bones, and the like. And women - many of them have said similar things, like Hey, I’d wrap my legs around that, or I’d f### him in a heartbeat. > > Who doesn’t agree with this, and why not? Of course they have, but they’re not running for president. I don’t care about the “guy talk”, but a man who doesn’t have the brains to keep his mouth shut around reporters has no business in public office. ---
**Author:** ![Lucky\_Mike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de053/32.png) [@Lucky\_Mike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lucky_Mike)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/94 "2016-10-09T18:02:00Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > \*\*Bullitt \*\*got the point a ways back and said so. The example that changed his mind was when someone asked him (paraphrasing), “If a guy reaches into your pocket and grabs your wallet and you don’t punch him out, does that mean you consented?” And he said that made him think and thanks for helping him learn something. > > Why are y’all still pounding on him? Read the whole thread. Yup, aftershocks from an earthquake. My bad. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/95 "2016-10-09T18:03:48Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > but a man who doesn’t have the brains to keep his mouth shut around reporters has no business in public office. Especially when he’s miked up. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/96 "2016-10-09T18:15:55Z")
Regarding the OP, one of the best replies comes from J.K. Rowling: [“The men rushing to tell us all that they talk about women exactly the way Donald Trump did in his tape seem to think they’re helping.”](https://twitter.com/jk_rowling/status/785113577489309696) ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/97 "2016-10-09T18:21:10Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > So? Trump is not a career politician. Trump has been desperately wanting to get into politics since 1988; he just never could get anyone to take him that seriously until now. And the fact is that Trump has always been–as he is now, more than ever–_ **the ultimate politician** _, who will say any bullshit he can to get votes. ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Girl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7bcc69/32.png) [@Mighty\_Girl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Girl)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/98 "2016-10-09T18:24:26Z")
> [@raventhief](#): > > Some of the thread/posts here and elsewhere have really kind of depressed me. A bunch of men who don’t seem to understand consent, or that just because someone is rich and famous doesn’t mean he can “do anything” to me, but Bullitt impressed me. Kudos. > > It’s 2016, people. We should not have to explain what consent means, and that “she didn’t fight me off” is not consent. Maybe in your day, whenever that was, a woman freezing up when someone in power grabbed her meant all systems go, but jesus christ. > > And i agree, almost everything the man has said since he announced he was running was worse than this, but most of that stuff was what he _wants to do_ as president, not what he _has done_ as a “star.” As anyone who’s been mugged can tell you – as I’ve been – the victim is often so shocked that they take some time to even process it, and it not uncommon to keep the police out of it. Imagine with something so loaded as sexual assault, especially when perpetrated by someone powerful and credible. Women are often blamed and doubted. I am disappointed, but not surprised, that many men take shocked silence to mean consent. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/99 "2016-10-09T18:31:33Z")
I saw a meme go through my facebook feed this morning that said (paraphrased) it’s kind of funny that the republicans are all saying it’s totally okay to vote someone into presidency that advocates for groping any woman he wants to, but just a few months ago the republicans were saying what a terrible idea it would be if transwomen used the female restrooms because, wait for it, they might grope women. Well, which way do you want it? Is it okay or not? ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Girl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7bcc69/32.png) [@Mighty\_Girl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Girl)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2016, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029/100 "2016-10-09T18:34:24Z")
"Everyone had their reasons for still supporting Trump, and many weren’t bothered by the “locker-room talk.” “Come on, that’s how real men talk!” said a very frustrated man who wouldn’t give his name. “That’s how men talk!” A 17-year-old who has been volunteering for the Trump campaign, and who also didn’t want his name used, was explaining to a bystander that Trump’s comments weren’t predatory because they let him do it because he’s a star, and that is a form of consent. Read more: [The Scene at Trump Tower: Gathering of the Diehards - POLITICO Magazine](http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/donald-trump-supporters-trump-tower-214335#ixzz4Mc8sNQ8Z)" It would be nice if they wore a DT t-shirt, that way women would know to stay far away from them. Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/here-are-the-defenses-offered-so-far-for-trumps-grab-them-by-the-pussy-comment/768029.md?page=6)