# He's gay, so he has HIV, so don't perform CPR on him. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 3, 2006, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hes-gay-so-he-has-hiv-so-dont-perform-cpr-on-him/346862 "2006-03-03T03:06:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2006, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hes-gay-so-he-has-hiv-so-dont-perform-cpr-on-him/346862/41 "2006-03-03T16:11:00Z")
I thought I remembered the cite from \*\*How We Die \*\* as saying that even if someone is already a hospital inpatient, if they have a heart attack they only have a 20% chance of living. ---
**Author:** ![FlyingCowOfDoom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyingcowofdoom/32/21776_2.png) [@FlyingCowOfDoom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlyingCowOfDoom)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2006, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hes-gay-so-he-has-hiv-so-dont-perform-cpr-on-him/346862/42 "2006-03-03T16:22:57Z")
> [@catsix](#): > > So you would fault me for not performing CPR without mask and gloves? If you are, let’s say, standing at a bus stop with one other person, and they keel over and die (clinically), you’re saying that you wouldn’t attempt to perform CPR because you don’t have the “proper equipment”? I, for one, would most certainly fault you. In fact, I’d call you a shitheel. –FCOD ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2006, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hes-gay-so-he-has-hiv-so-dont-perform-cpr-on-him/346862/43 "2006-03-03T16:36:43Z")
Well I can live with you finding fault with that. I’d rather have someone think I’m a shitheel than have a mouth full of vomit and a chance of catching hepatitis from a total stranger’s bodily fluids. ---
**Author:** ![stpauler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@stpauler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stpauler)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2006, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hes-gay-so-he-has-hiv-so-dont-perform-cpr-on-him/346862/44 "2006-03-03T16:37:32Z")
It’s all a bit Kitty Genovese, cat. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2006, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hes-gay-so-he-has-hiv-so-dont-perform-cpr-on-him/346862/45 "2006-03-03T16:55:45Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > If Bowman ever finds himself in need of CPR, i hope he finds someone just as compassionate and humane as he is. I have no doubt that this will come back to him one day. He may not connect it to this incident, but he will get what he deserves. ---
**Author:** ![Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ac8455/32.png) [@Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bippy_the_Beardless)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2006, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hes-gay-so-he-has-hiv-so-dont-perform-cpr-on-him/346862/46 "2006-03-03T16:58:06Z")
Don’t anyone jump at **catsix** unless you are certain your CPR and first aid skills are up to date. Though **cat** might want to look into getting hepatitis shots just for safety, after all maybe you’ll want to kiss someone without knowing their full medical history. ---
**Author:** ![FlyingCowOfDoom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyingcowofdoom/32/21776_2.png) [@FlyingCowOfDoom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlyingCowOfDoom)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2006, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hes-gay-so-he-has-hiv-so-dont-perform-cpr-on-him/346862/47 "2006-03-03T17:02:29Z")
Your justification is incomplete. Let me revise it for you: “I’d rather have someone think I’m a shitheel than **increase a person’s chance of survival by [80%](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cpr) and** have a mouth full of vomit and a **[miniscule](http://www.tulsacpr.com/Classes/faq.html)** chance of catching hepatitis from a total stranger’s bodily fluids.” I’ve personally administered CPR to total strangers on two seperate occasions using only the required equipment (my lungs and arms). I didn’t get any vomit or hepatitis, but I did possibly save two people’s lives. –FCOD ---
**Author:** ![threemae](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5f9b8f/32.png) [@threemae](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/threemae)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2006, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hes-gay-so-he-has-hiv-so-dont-perform-cpr-on-him/346862/48 "2006-03-03T17:11:24Z")
> [@Mellivora capensis](#): > > **threemae** , genuine non-combative question, why do first aid kits include assisted breathing apparatus, and why do first aid instructors insist that we use this apparatus? **Otaki** already nailed this one. Although HIV isn’t transmisible from “mouth-to-mouth” there are still a significant number of nasty pathogens that can be transmitted via mouth-to-mouth. ---
**Author:** ![threemae](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5f9b8f/32.png) [@threemae](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/threemae)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2006, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hes-gay-so-he-has-hiv-so-dont-perform-cpr-on-him/346862/49 "2006-03-03T17:14:19Z")
> [@FlyingCowOfDoom](#): > > I’ve personally administered CPR to total strangers on two seperate occasions using only the required equipment (my lungs and arms). I didn’t get any vomit or hepatitis, but I did possibly save two people’s lives. > > –FCOD That’s great for you. I’ll be the first to conceed that the chances of catching something serious from CPR are small, but it’s always a personal decision belonging to the (potential) rescuer and no-one who isn’t paid to do this has any responsibility to act. ---
**Author:** ![FlyingCowOfDoom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyingcowofdoom/32/21776_2.png) [@FlyingCowOfDoom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlyingCowOfDoom)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2006, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hes-gay-so-he-has-hiv-so-dont-perform-cpr-on-him/346862/50 "2006-03-03T17:37:12Z")
> [@threemae](#): > > That’s great for you. I’ll be the first to conceed that the chances of catching something serious from CPR are small, but it’s always a personal decision belonging to the (potential) rescuer and no-one who isn’t paid to do this has any responsibility to act. You are correct. It is a personal decision. There is no responsibility to attempt to save a fellow human being’s life. However, if you (in a general sense) choose not to attempt to save a stranger’s life because of the MINISCULE (the link I provided in the previous post states that there are no cases on record of a disease being contracted via CPR) chance of catching a treatable disease, IMO you are a shitheel. I hope you never need rescuing yourself, because chances are (in this world) that your would-be rescuer is going to be too worried about him/her self than your dead ass. –FCOD ---
**Author:** ![OtakuLoki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ac8455/32.png) [@OtakuLoki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OtakuLoki)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2006, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hes-gay-so-he-has-hiv-so-dont-perform-cpr-on-him/346862/51 "2006-03-03T18:36:18Z")
Actually, **FCOD** , one of the first, and most important tasks of any rescue worker (not Good Samaritan, but rescue worker) is to determine what actions can be taken with the _least_ risk to the rescue worker. For things like BBPs, this becomes a completely subjective assessment IMNSHO. I’ve dealt with people who’ve had serious psychological disorders grow up from simply having found out they’d been exposed to Hep B. It’s not as nasty as HIV, but it’s not a fun condition, either. And for some people it can become life-threatening. As can anxiety. As for vomiting, have you heard of sympathetic pukers? They’re far more common than you might think. In a sample of approximately 600 men, selected for above average health, physical conditioning, and having anti-nausea medications available for those who needed it, I’ve seen approximately 10-15% of that group go running for the bathroom, simply because they _heard_ someone gagging over the 1MC while in heavy seas. I’m not about to tell **catsix** that the concerns raised are unreasonable. I don’t know how strongly **catsix** would be squicked by the idea of having Jane Doe’s ejecta in **catsix** ’s mouth. I can accept that the concern may well be strong enough interfere with **catsix** ’s ability to perform CPR. It’s not a decision you can make for anyone. And you’re going way overboard on your condemnation of **catsix** ’s position. **catsix** is not stating a refusal to offer services while on the clock. **catsix** , is only saying that when off the clock, if without what **catsix** judges to be minimum safety equipment, **catsix** refuses to take actions that may leave **catsix** in the position of a poor swimmer, going out to rescue a non-swimmer - and then they both drown. I’m not going to worry about the risks for CPR if it ever comes up, too much, myself. But there are times that I don’t quite make it to sane. I have no condemnation for **catsix** ’s position. BTW, do you remember the American Red Cross’s stance on autologous blood donation for surgeries, going back about 10-15 years ago? IIRC, they were down on it, claiming it was wasteful, and a drain on resources. Besides no one had gotten Hep C from a blood transfusion. They can’t say that now. And there’s damned little comfort in being written up in the medical journals for your fifteen minutes of fame. Or do you think that the woman in France who’d just recieved her face transplant wouldn’t much prefer to have her own face, and not be famous? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hes-gay-so-he-has-hiv-so-dont-perform-cpr-on-him/346862.md?page=2)