# Hey bibliophage? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 16, 2001, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813 "2001-10-16T20:58:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![red\_dragon60](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ce73a5/32.png) [@red\_dragon60](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/red_dragon60)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/21 "2001-10-17T01:19:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Lynn Bodoni \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > _Originally posted by Fenris \* > > **Red\_Dragon** : I’m not a Mod, but my understanding is that moving a thread puts a HUG_E strain on the server. Far more than just closing a thread does. > > > > Given the board’s…um…wonky…behavior recently, maybe that was **Bibliophage’s** reasoning. > > > > Fenris \*\* > > Well, I’m not bibliophage, but that’s the reason that _I_ will close threads rather than move them. Also, when moving a thread, one usually makes a note of it in yet another thread, which will put still more strain on the server when it’s called up. > > I also get quite frustrated when I try to move a thread, and get timed out half a dozen times. Then I’m likely to just snarl something nasty, and lock it. > > Lynn > For the Straight Dope \*\* Lynn, we all know that if you really loved us, you would donate more time and money to buy a bigger server. This is really all your fault! 😉 P.S. Fenris- you revealed the Mods births. Of course you aren’t in the Clique. Remember in high school when someone would tell another person who slept with who? That’s you. but its um, board sleeping. Yeah. ---
**Author:** ![TVeblen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4bbf92/32.png) [@TVeblen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TVeblen)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/22 "2001-10-17T01:20:43Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Spider Woman \* > \*\*A bona fide pit thread. Is it your first since becoming a moderator? This must mean they’ll teach you the secret handshake now. > > ----:p/ x o x o x > ----///\\ \*\* ::sniffs proudly; dabs away tears:: He is truly One Of Us now: a heartless, repressive tyrant. Secret handshake? Check. Decoder ring? Check. Key to the liquor cabinet? Uhhh…oh, okay. Check. Joking aside, if the boards are hinky enough to make posting touchy it’s safe to assume moving, etc. is a pure bitch. The other night it took me 15 minutes to delete an accidental double-thread with no replies. That was _one thread_, with how many more to read and housekeep. And that didn’t involve posting a follow-up “where your thread went to” notice. Not trying to pile on here, **red\_dragon** , just echo the very real logistical challenges. Often closing threads is the only practical solution. Not ideal, but with a reasonable explanation given, at least workable. I’m having severe second-thoughts about **bib** and the liquor cabinet key though. Veb ---
**Author:** ![SmackFu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/53a042/32.png) [@SmackFu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmackFu)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/23 "2001-10-17T01:22:26Z")
The reason **I** didn’t mail bibliophage directly is because I wanted some actual discussion of the issue. I don’t think I’m stretching by saying that this case shows a preference for closing an off-topic post rathern than leaving it open. I brought it here to see if the rest of the Dopers feel the same way. I know I don’t. I’d rather see a discussion continue slightly off-topic than be cut off by a lock. ---
**Author:** ![CnoteChris](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/278dde/32.png) [@CnoteChris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CnoteChris)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/24 "2001-10-17T01:33:05Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Colibri \* > **Opening a pit thread about a moderator decision should be the last recourse, not the first, as some people seem to think.** Why should opening a pit thread be the last recourse? It seems to me that it should be one of the first modes of clarification. But since it’s in “The Pit”, it’s somehow bad? It’s what we’re _told_ to do “regarding administration of the SDMB”. **red\_dragon60** was well within his/her right to do so. The fact that since _all_ questions concerning moderators and moderators actions should go in the pit is the decision of the administration… and it’s about the only beef I have with them right now… not that I’ve had a bunch before, I didn’t. But… It seems to me most posters here are bright enough to figure out which forum a question about a moderator or moderator actions should go in and where. Conversely, I think a number of posters know where a bitch about a moderator or moderator actions should go too. Why all of them have to come to the Pit, which is the most hostile of all the forums, and get the inevitable **Spoofe** comment of, “I’m questioning this thread’s existence in the first place” is beyond me. It always happens this way. Why can’t questions like this, that are very reasonable in my opinion, be addressed in ATMB? There, it can be asked and hopefully answered by a mod or an administrator without all the glurge and browbeating. If a mod or admin is worried about it spiraling out of control and turning into a bitch, it could be closed soon after its being answered. That, or the poster could _then_ be told to take it to the pit if it begins to spiral. It just seems to send the wrong signal to me that any questioning of mods or admins, regardless of how benign it may be, should be sent to the pit. It’s a legitimate question, and should be addressed out in the open to keep others out there informed. Having _any_ question like this being dealt with in the pit tells me they don’t want to see it happen, which, in this case, I’d think is wrong- it’s a straightforward question that could be answered straightforward and without further comment. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/25 "2001-10-17T02:05:40Z")
> [@](#): > > Why can’t questions like this, that are very reasonable in my opinion, be addressed in ATMB? Well, it could be because, at the end of a year, the amount of crap that has been added to the board would be immense. And the corresponding load on the server would be immenser. Why can’t a long-time poster simply e-mail a mod, have a polite discussion, and there would be no additional crap posted to the boards? Is this hard to understand or fathom? ---
**Author:** ![CnoteChris](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/278dde/32.png) [@CnoteChris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CnoteChris)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/26 "2001-10-17T02:11:11Z")
Why not have it out in the open, for others to see and also understand? Why always e-mail when talking about questions of a mod or the administration? Or are you going after all posts that are essentially glurge and (to you) useless posts? If you are, have fun, posting to all the threads that meet your requirements of ‘crap’ will take you forever. Sheesh, MPSIMS alone will keep you busy for months. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/27 "2001-10-17T02:36:12Z")
> [@](#): > > Why not have it out in the open, for others to see and also understand? I just answered this above. If it truly is an earth-shaking, ground-breaking question, then please post it. If it is more of what is posted in the Pit on a daily basis, then take it to email. If a newbie does this, it can be excused. Longtime posters should try the email route first, and, if unhappy, come back and post a thread to the pit. ---
**Author:** ![TVeblen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4bbf92/32.png) [@TVeblen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TVeblen)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/28 "2001-10-17T04:34:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SmackFu \* **The reason I didn’t mail bibliophage directly is because I wanted some actual discussion of the issue.** Here’s a newsflash. “Actual discussion” can happen one-to-one. Of course that depends on your personal definition of “actual”. If grandstanding is involved then no, your purposes won’t be served. **I don’t think I’m stretching by saying that this case shows a preference for closing an off-topic post rathern than leaving it open.** _Stretching it?!_ “This case” is an accusation against **bib** personally and the board at large, purportedly based on a systematic, deliberate pattern of de facto censorship. Forget civil, reasonable explanations to the contrary. Conspiracies are so much more FUN. \*\*I brought it here to see if the rest of the Dopers feel the same way. I know I don’t. I’d rather see a discussion continue slightly off-topic than be cut off by a lock. \*\* Oh, bull. **Smackfu** , you’re the person who registered then immediately scoured the archives for every ancient controversey you could find. Your first acts were to dredge as many old conflicts as you could find and _re-post them_. Your first acts were exhumations and insistence on forensic rehashing to your satisfaction. Your antecendents are decidely trollish. For the rest…discussions in The Pit do NOT require invective or irrationality. Neither are encouraged, merely tolerated–as some notably civil, reasonable Pit threads have evinced. A practical acceptance of the level of invective involved with discussions of the housekeeping involved with this place doesn’t imply agreement–just acceptance that even unfair shit happens. ::deep breath:: I’m godawful wordy when enraged but _cheap shots are wrong_. **bibliophage** has been nothing less than a courteous, intellectually meticulous poster. Hec hasn’t changed an iota for taking on housekeeping duties and it’s a damned insult to imply otherwise. Veb ---
**Author:** ![CnoteChris](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/278dde/32.png) [@CnoteChris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CnoteChris)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/29 "2001-10-17T04:34:32Z")
You’re missing my whole point, **samclem**. My whole point _is_ that sometimes mundane and seemingly mindless posts about a moderator or an administer are going to be made around here. And what the fuck, why not treat it like the mundane type of questions that are asked and answered in the ATMB forum every day? _Why_ send it to the pit and have it generate the same kind of, “Why is this in the pit? Sheesh” or, “Hey Bib. A bona fide pit thread. Is it your first since becoming a moderator?” responses like the ones above? People are going to have mundane and pointless questions regarding moderators and administrators every day of the week around here. Why intimidate them by making them make their post in the pit? Oftentimes, they’re not intended to be bitches or rips -they’re _questions_- why not treat them that way? It’s all I’m asking here, **samclem**. I’m also asking you or anyone else why it is you think we should take these kinds of questions to e-mail? Seriously, what’s more time consuming- asking a moderator on the board a question about this and that, that might well be answered by some other poster here, or e-mailing a mod every time a question regarding moderation or administration comes up? Talk about irritating them fast… have them open up a full mailbox every morning asking them essentially the same question. If you ask me, I think it would tick them off in no time. Believe me, I take it as a last resort to e-mail a mod… not my first. Have it here, in the open, for all to see… only in a forum where it can be handled reasonably, and nicely. You wanna talk about it nice? ATMB. You wanna bitch and complain? The Pit. Come to think of it, it saves a whole lot of bandwidth too, when you negate all these ‘nail on the hammer’ posts and ‘why is this here’ posts that always happen with these posts in the pit… dontcha think? With my idea, we essentially accomplish what you’re after, right? No extraneous posts to a mundane or simple question. Better still, it may stop someone from asking redundant questions to boot. ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 7:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/30 "2001-10-17T07:44:56Z")
> [@](#): > > SPOOFE, as you are in the Clique, you wouldn’t understand. I’m part of The Clique? I’m part of The Clique… I’m part of The Clique?!? I’m part of The Clique!!! _ **I’M PART OF THE CLIQUE!!!** _ Wait… When the hell did THAT happen? ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 12:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/31 "2001-10-17T12:32:05Z")
I have been assimilated by The Clique. That means, of course, that I must disavow all references to The Clique that I have made. Including this one. Please note that I did not write the above. In fact, the above doesn’t exist, and you can’t prove that it does. This line marks the beginning of this post. That is all. * * * [sub][scrolling marquee]…Clique meeting tonight at 8:00 Halifax time…[/scrolling marquee][/sub] ---
**Author:** ![SmackFu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/53a042/32.png) [@SmackFu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmackFu)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/32 "2001-10-17T13:47:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by TVeblen \* > \*\*Oh, bull. **Smackfu** , you’re the person who registered then immediately scoured the archives for every ancient controversey you could find. Your first acts were to dredge as many old conflicts as you could find and _re-post them_. Your first acts were exhumations and insistence on forensic rehashing to your satisfaction. > > Your antecendents are decidely trollish.\*\* Are you confusing me with someone else? I usually hang out in GQ. At least 95% of my posts are there. I don’t think I’ve ever started a thread in the Pit or GD (before yesterday). You seem to be injecting some personal feelings against me in your response, and I have no idea where it’s coming from. ---
**Author:** ![IzzyR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/2acd7d/32.png) [@IzzyR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IzzyR)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/33 "2001-10-17T14:39:25Z")
Not to take sides with regards to the OP (meaning the closing vs. locking issue) but I wonder if a moderator could clarify the reason for the thread’s being in the wrong forum. It was given as > [@](#): > > Requests for tips go in IMHO It is very comon for threads asking advice to be put in GQ (e.g. [this one](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=92202) and [this one](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=91619)). I myself have started a few of these (I recall offhand a medical question, some car radio questions, and a tree question). What is the difference between asking for help/advice and asking for a “tip”? The only distinction I can think of is that acceptable GQ questions might be those that require some degree of expertise, and “tips” might be about everyday issues that anyone could comment on. Is this correct? ---
**Author:** ![Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/50afbb/32.png) [@Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duck_Duck_Goose)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/34 "2001-10-17T15:13:05Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Fenris \* > \*\*Moving threads takes lots of effort for the server for some reason. Locking threads **doesn’t**. \*\* As I had it explained to me, long ago when I was just a little Doper, in terms of the server, moving a thread amounts to re-posting _every single post_ in the thread. The server’s been hinky lately, as Vebbie already pointed out. So thank you, Bib, for _not_ moving the thread and thereby adding to the strain on the hamster’s cardiovascular system. > [@](#): > > **…this case shows a preference for closing an off-topic post rathern than leaving it open…** Since you spend so much time in GQ, 😉 you no doubt have noticed how cramped for space it is in there. On a weekday morning, I’ve seen new threads slide off to the oblivion of Page 2 within, literally, _minutes_ of being posted. Given the hinkiness of the server, it makes more sense to simply lock an off-topic thread, to encourage it to get the heck out of the way of more worthy GQ-type threads. And, possibly, when this happens, there is in the mind of the moderator a faint hope that it may be a learning experience, not only for the OP, but also for everyone else who opens the thread. On the difference between “advice” and “tips”: Generally speaking, if it’s something you can look up on Google, as in “cite, please”, (“How can I get a better deal on a used car?” “What’s the best way to get scorched mashed potatoes out of my saucepan?”) then it’s Advice, and it goes in GQ. If it’s something that probably isn’t Google-friendly (“How can I get a better deal from a ticket scalper?” “What’s the best way to perform a blowjob?”) then it counts as an Opinion, and it’s Tips, and it goes in IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![Abe\_Babe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3ab097/32.png) [@Abe\_Babe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Abe_Babe)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/35 "2001-10-17T15:28:47Z")
> [@](#): > > _originally by TVeblen_ > He is truly One Of Us now. . . insert scene from the movie _[Freaks_ “One of us! One of us! One of us!” ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/36 "2001-10-17T17:02:02Z")
“And The Original Doper spake, saying 'Yea I say unto you that as it is on the Boards so shall it be upon the very Desk Of Cecil. The Moderators are mine hands upon Earth. With them and through them do I guide the world. Their words are as mine.” ``` Thus, as dogma, we know that a Mod acting in the service of Cecil, is filled with the Essence of Straight Dope and infallible. I would give all the Mods a hug, but in their wisdom, they have a restraining order. They have accepted a great duty, a duty that lesser folk would have shamelessly puppied out of. To the Mods do we owe all honor and praise, for they are Cecil's generals in the war on ignorance. ``` Seriously-I don’t know how you folks manage to moderate this thing. Thank you for all the hard work. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/37 "2001-10-17T18:17:22Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CnoteChris \* > \*\*I’m also asking you or anyone else why it is you think we should take these kinds of questions to e-mail? > > Seriously, what’s more time consuming- asking a moderator on the board a question about this and that, that might well be answered by some other poster here, or e-mailing a mod every time a question regarding moderation or administration comes up? > \*\* Because 95% of the threads I have seen about “[Moderator X] closed/moved” my thread!" could have been avoided entirely if the poster in question had taken the trouble to e-mail the moderator. They are simply a waste of time and bandwidth (whether you put them in ATMB or the Pit). And of course a question on a specific moderator decision can only be answered by that moderator, not other posters or other mods. On the few occasions I have had a problem, I have e-mailed a moderator and gotten a rapid and satisfactory response. I should also mention I have seen threads (sometimes questionable ones) unlocked because a poster (not the OP) e-mailed a moderator because they had some info to contribute or found the thread interesting. **CNote** , I am not saying that every dispute or complaint is going to be resolved by e-mail. And I’m not disputing anybody’s “right” to complain about it. I am pointing out that such minor problems as the one mentioned in the OP _are_ much more effectively dealt with by e-mail. And I can attest to that by personal expaerience. ---
**Author:** ![SuaSponte](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/67e7ee/32.png) [@SuaSponte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuaSponte)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/38 "2001-10-17T18:36:36Z")
I’ve never understood the big deal about locking v. moving threads. Personally, I’d rather have my threads locked than moved - it’s easier to find out what happened when the thread is still in the original forum, albeit locked, then when it has simply disappeared. And for those whose thread is locked for being in the wrong forum, there is a fabulous new technology to aid you in re-posting in the correct forum. It is called “cut-and-paste”. Sua ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/39 "2001-10-17T22:02:05Z")
You know, I missed this earlier… > [@](#): > > Why all of them have to come to the Pit, which is the most hostile of all the forums, and get the inevitable Spoofe comment of, “I’m questioning this thread’s existence in the first place” is beyond me. Fuck you, too, CNote. I made that comment in ONE thread, so drop this line of “inevitable” bullshit and stop talking out of your jumping-to-irrational-conclusions ass. ---
**Author:** ![CnoteChris](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/278dde/32.png) [@CnoteChris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CnoteChris)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2001, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813/40 "2001-10-17T22:38:50Z")
For a guys who’s tired right now, **SPOOFE** , you sure got some spunk. The “inevitable” comment isn’t always made by you, **SPOOFE** , it can, and often is, made by others. You just happened to be the one to bring it up in this thread, and it was the most obvious example I could find. Get some sleep bud. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-bibliophage/87813.md?page=3)