# Hey meryl streep, you are a play-actor, nothing more **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 9, 2017, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718 "2017-01-09T14:46:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 29
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2017, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/561 "2017-01-16T22:09:05Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > I’m not seeing too much complaining that Republicans, in general, have come into power. That’s politics, and it’s going to happen now and then. What we’re “hysterical” over, (although I’d use a different term) is the election of a\* particular \* “Republican” who is a disgracefully incompetent, obnoxious, and ignorant embarrassment to the country and a danger to the world. I’m “not happy” with the Republicans in power, but I’m\*\*\* disgusted\*\*\* by Trump. That’s the difference. That’s fine, be disgusted with him all you want. There are indeed many things about him that reasonable people can find disgusting. But when it goes off the rails into accusations of fascism, Nazi-ism, and a desire to kick people out of the country because they’re outsiders and foreigners, then we’re into fantasy land, and far too many people have bought into that nonsense 100%. This is why so many celebrities are inconsolable and can’t sleep at night or go about their days feeling like someone has died, and why college kids cry and feel personally threatened because someone, anyone, on their campus might actually be a Republican and/or supporter of Trump. It’s ridiculous, and in my opinion is largely the result of the fact that the left’s primary weapon, political correctness, has been shown to be utterly impotent in the face of someone like Trump who tells it to go pound sand. This has left the country’s liberals with a feeling of helplessness that they’re wholly unused to, and that feeling of helplessness has led to panic because “anything can happen” as a result of having someone in the White House who isn’t afraid of the consequences of running afoul of them. This is why the concerted effort to oppose him nonstop in every way possible and keep him from becoming ‘normalized’, because the last thing they want is to lose the power of political correctness to bully people into doing things their way. And on preview I see that **Mr. Miskatonic** has come along to illustrate the hateful and erroneously inflammatory nature of many of the board’s left-wing posts against the right. In truth, the right hardly ‘fetishizes’ the military, and it looks that the ACA and sees that the president lied about keeping plans and doctors, and that true to expectation premiums are skyrocketing, and that millions have been saddled with insurance they can’t use because they can’t afford the co-pays and deductibles, and are therefore left to ‘die in the streets’. The fiction from the left is how wonderful it is that everyone has insurance now. The problem is that people are paying through the wazoo for it with money that otherwise would go to providing better lives for themselves and their families, while still being unable to use it for anything other than band-aid issues and wholly out of luck should they develop heart disease or cancer or anything else requiring a large financial outlay of their own. And on further preview we now have \*\* iiandyiiii\*\* coming along to pretend that the board’s widespread and frequently stated left-wing vitriol is offset by the occasional (not ‘constant’ and ‘repeated’, as **iiandyiiii** would have us believe) racist thread usually posted by a newcomer who doesn’t stick around long and is not representative of either the board’s conservative posters nor of most of the country’s conservative citizens. This is not remotely the case, as I’m sure everyone is aware even if they won’t admit it. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/562 "2017-01-17T00:14:06Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > And on further preview we now have \*\* iiandyiiii\*\* coming along to pretend that the board’s widespread and frequently stated left-wing vitriol is offset by the occasional (not ‘constant’ and ‘repeated’, as **iiandyiiii** would have us believe) racist thread usually posted by a newcomer who doesn’t stick around long and is not representative of either the board’s conservative posters nor of most of the country’s conservative citizens. This is not remotely the case, as I’m sure everyone is aware even if they won’t admit it. It’s pretty steady – I’ve been here 6 years, and I’ve been a part of those threads since I joined, apparently to the point that some Dopers have told me that I shouldn’t take part in them so often. Perhaps you haven’t noticed because you don’t take part in those threads. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/563 "2017-01-17T01:14:18Z")
> [@Mr.Miskatonic](#): > > Horseshit. Come over here to England and call it horseshit. When you’ve had to wait 6 months to see a consultant you’ll soon learn the error of your ways. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/564 "2017-01-17T01:25:40Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > Come over here to England and call it horseshit. When you’ve had to wait 6 months to see a consultant you’ll soon learn the error of your ways. What was the consultant for? ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/565 "2017-01-17T02:04:42Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > Come over here to England and call it horseshit. When you’ve had to wait 6 months to see a consultant you’ll soon learn the error of your ways. The English health system is undoubtedly not travelling too well at the moment _compared to the extremely high standards to which it has caused the English to become accustomed._. However, it has for decades delivered better healthcare outcomes overall than that of most 1st world nations including the US by a wide margin, and for about half the % of GDP compared to the US. Try telling someone in the US who can’t afford a consultant \*at all \*that if he or she were in the UK they would be getting to see a consultant free of charge in six months and see which they would prefer. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/566 "2017-01-17T03:06:04Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > I merely said that of hate-filled posts, most by far come from left-wing posters. In other words and as it pertains to this board, not all lefties are haters but most haters are lefties. Statistically speaking, of course, there are far more left-leaning (by mainstream US politics standards, at least) regular SDMB posters than right-leaning ones. So in terms of absolute numbers, naturally one would **expect** to see vitriolic posts by liberals outnumbering those by conservatives, even if the **proportion** of “haters” in the two groups were exactly the same. When it comes to **prevalence** of political vitriol in a poster’s output, though, ISTM that our right-wing Dopers on average are more “hatey” than our left-wing ones. ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/567 "2017-01-17T03:12:28Z")
> [@Princhester](#): > > The English health system is undoubtedly not travelling too well at the moment _compared to the extremely high standards to which it has caused the English to become accustomed._. However, it has for decades delivered better healthcare outcomes overall than that of most 1st world nations including the US by a wide margin, and for about half the % of GDP compared to the US. > > Try telling someone in the US who can’t afford a consultant \*at all \*that if he or she were in the UK they would be getting to see a consultant free of charge in six months and see which they would prefer. And don’t forget, for something that is considered urgent or non-elective (think a heart attack or injuries sustained in a MVA) you will get world-class surgical and medical treatment IMMEDIATELY and at no cost to the patient. This is the case pretty much everywhere in the Western world except the US. (kam…who had eye surgery last week (one week on waiting list) and her daughter who had throat surgery today (one day on waiting list). Loving the Aus medical system totally). ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/568 "2017-01-17T04:54:47Z")
I was in the UK with the family a few weeks back. My son developed pain that was consistent with a condition that could have required reasonably quick treatment. We were in one of the UK’s poorer socio-economic areas. Seen by a triage nurse in maybe 15 minutes. Seen by a doctor within about another 15 minutes. Seen by a specialist within about another 5-10 minutes. Diagnosed, given relevant medication and out the door. Total bill? Zip. Nada. Nothing. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 5:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/569 "2017-01-17T05:57:13Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > No, it’s more like they know that under a government controlled system where bureaucracy reigns supreme, \*\*more people will have longer waits and get worse care for major issues \*\*(and perhaps with more people dying, not because they’re in the streets but because they’ve been deemed not worth the expense). > > Your comment is just another in the long line of inflammatory criticisms designed to shift debate from the actual issues and to generate anger and opposition toward the conservative position based on emotion rather than facts. Emphasis mine. You. Dishonest. _Shitbag._ You want to talk facts, yet you bring up a stupid, _incorrect_ talking point that [I shoved back up your ass in the last thread it came up in](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=19898163&postcount=270), not all that long ago. Listen, Dick-Tree McGee, you want to talk about “facts”? Stop fucking _lying_ about the facts! Stop pretending you give a shit about the facts when all you have to offer is a warmed-over right-wing talking point which was directly refuted in the last thread you dumped it in, [where you suddenly left after it became uncomfortably obvious how _wrong_ you were](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=19898462&postcount=277). ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/570 "2017-01-17T06:18:59Z")
> [@Princhester](#): > > I was in the UK with the family a few weeks back. My son developed pain that was consistent with a condition that could have required reasonably quick treatment. We were in one of the UK’s poorer socio-economic areas. > > Seen by a triage nurse in maybe 15 minutes. Seen by a doctor within about another 15 minutes. Seen by a specialist within about another 5-10 minutes. Diagnosed, given relevant medication and out the door. > > Total bill? Zip. Nada. Nothing. Og bless the NHS. The US could do worse than trying to model their health-plans on the UK system. (Hope your kidlet is OK now btw) 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 6:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/571 "2017-01-17T06:38:39Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > Emphasis mine. > > You. Dishonest. _Shitbag._ > > You want to talk facts, yet you bring up a stupid, _incorrect_ talking point that [I shoved back up your ass in the last thread it came up in](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=19898163&postcount=270), not all that long ago. Listen, Dick-Tree McGee, you want to talk about “facts”? Stop fucking _lying_ about the facts! Stop pretending you give a shit about the facts when all you have to offer is a warmed-over right-wing talking point which was directly refuted in the last thread you dumped it in, [where you suddenly left after it became uncomfortably obvious how _wrong_ you were](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=19898462&postcount=277). Thing is that SA’s position on this issue is a religious issue. It’s an article of free market faith. It’s utterly fact immune. It contains (as subtext) various implicit and IMHO highly odd value judgments. You will never get through to him. You might as usefully tell a deeply religious doper that their deity makes no sense and expect the doper to have become an atheist the next time they post. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 6:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/572 "2017-01-17T06:39:45Z")
> [@kambuckta](#): > > Og bless the NHS. The US could do worse than trying to model their health-plans on the UK system. > > (Hope your kidlet is OK now btw) 🙂 The kidlet is now a teenager. Time flies, eh? He’s fine, thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 7:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/573 "2017-01-17T07:09:36Z")
> [@Princhester](#): > > Thing is that SA’s position on this issue is a religious issue. It’s an article of free market faith. It’s utterly fact immune. It contains (as subtext) various implicit and IMHO highly odd value judgments. You will never get through to him. You might as usefully tell a deeply religious doper that their deity makes no sense and expect the doper to have become an atheist the next time they post. Pretty much, but we don’t get a lot of those folks, and they don’t commonly continue to parrot demonstrably false claims long after those claims have been demonstrated to be false. The display of ideological cowardice here is just stunning. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 7:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/574 "2017-01-17T07:36:18Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > The display of ideological cowardice here is just stunning. I’m not sure how it’s ideological cowardice. It’s more like ideological courage. “Bravely” maintaining a position despite it being totally untenable. There’s perhaps another rather more unflattering word you could use instead of “bravely”, of course. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 7:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/575 "2017-01-17T07:39:01Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > Pretty much, but we don’t get a lot of those folks, and they don’t commonly continue to parrot demonstrably false claims long after those claims have been demonstrated to be false. The display of ideological cowardice here is just stunning. Bullshit. I remember years ago when during an argument about government health care one of our Canadian Dopers bragged about how it took his mother had to wait eight months to begin treatment for her cancer, and how happy he was about that because otherwise she couldn’t have gotten treatment at all. He seemed totally oblivious to the fact that many other people with cancer will die long before their eight months are up. Waits are already starting here in the U.S. because the ACA is driving specialists to quit because of both the regulatory burden the act places upon them and the fact that they can no longer determine a patient’s course of treatment but instead must abide by the dictates of what insurance companies or the government will allow. But all of this is beside the point, which is that conservatives do not indeed ‘want’ to see people dying in the streets for lack of health care. Rather it’s that they think private enterprise delivers a higher quality of care to a larger number of people overall than does a government system that provides so-so care for everyone. And a significant part of this is the recognition that more are likely to suffer and die under the so-so government system than will under the higher quality free enterprise system. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/576 "2017-01-17T07:41:48Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Bullshit. I remember years ago when during an argument about government health care one of our Canadian Dopers bragged about how it took his mother had to wait eight months to begin treatment for her cancer, and how happy he was about that because otherwise she couldn’t have gotten treatment at all. He seemed totally oblivious to the fact that many other people with cancer will die long before their eight months are up. > > Waits are already starting here in the U.S. because the ACA is driving specialists to quit because of both the regulatory burden the act places upon them and the fact that they can no longer determine a patient’s course of treatment but instead must abide by the dictates of what insurance companies or the government will allow. > > But all of this is beside the point, which is that conservatives do not indeed ‘want’ to see people dying in the streets for lack of health care. Rather it’s that they think private enterprise delivers a higher quality of care to a larger number of people overall than does a government system that provides so-so care for everyone. And a significant part of this is the recognition that more are likely to suffer and die under the so-so government system than will under the higher quality free enterprise system. Logic and facts are completely alien to you, aren’t they? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 7:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/577 "2017-01-17T07:42:55Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Rather it’s that they think private enterprise delivers a higher quality of care to a larger number of people overall than does a government system that provides so-so care for everyone. We know they think so, or at least desperately want to think so. The problem is that [they are wrong](http://www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/issue-briefs/2015/oct/us-health-care-from-a-global-perspective). > [@](#): > > U.S. spends more on health care than other high-income countries but has worse outcomes > > This analysis draws upon data from the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development and other cross-national analyses to compare health care spending, supply, utilization, prices, and health outcomes across 13 high-income countries: Australia, Canada, Denmark, France, Germany, Japan, Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland, the United Kingdom, and the United States. These data predate the major insurance provisions of the Affordable Care Act. **In 2013, the U.S. spent far more on health care than these other countries.** Higher spending appeared to be largely driven by greater use of medical technology and higher health care prices, rather than more frequent doctor visits or hospital admissions. In contrast, U.S. spending on social services made up a relatively small share of the economy relative to other countries. **Despite spending more on health care, Americans had poor health outcomes, including shorter life expectancy and greater prevalence of chronic conditions.** Emphasis added. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 8:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/578 "2017-01-17T08:19:15Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Bullshit. I remember years ago when during an argument about government health care one of our Canadian Dopers bragged about how it took his mother had to wait eight months to begin treatment for her cancer, and how happy he was about that because otherwise she couldn’t have gotten treatment at all. He seemed totally oblivious to the fact that many other people with cancer will die long before their eight months are up. > > Waits are already starting here in the U.S. because the ACA is driving specialists to quit because of both the regulatory burden the act places upon them and the fact that they can no longer determine a patient’s course of treatment but instead must abide by the dictates of what insurance companies or the government will allow. > > But all of this is beside the point, which is that conservatives do not indeed ‘want’ to see people dying in the streets for lack of health care. Rather it’s that they think private enterprise delivers a higher quality of care to a larger number of people overall than does a government system that provides so-so care for everyone. And a significant part of this is the recognition that more are likely to suffer and die under the so-so government system than will under the higher quality free enterprise system. You really are one ignorant fuckwit. But then, on the subject of health care, so are almost all American conservatives. I live in Canada and I have no idea what “government health care” is – I’ve never seen it. I have private doctors, private hospitals, private clinics, any of which I can see without limit or restriction, and the public insurance system pays for it in full. Maybe you can explain exactly what the fuck you think you’re talking about, so that someone who has lived with the benefit of single-payer his entire life – and just recently had a major health experience with it – can tell you why you’re totally full of shit. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 8:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/579 "2017-01-17T08:41:54Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > Maybe you can explain exactly what the fuck you think you’re talking about No, that is basically what American conservatives who oppose universal healthcare policies cannot do. I believe it’s true that most of them don’t actually **want** worse healthcare outcomes for more people. But that keeps them from facing the fact that their preferred policies **produce** worse healthcare outcomes for more people. You are not going to get someone like **Starving Artist** to confront that cognitive dissonance. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 8:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718/580 "2017-01-17T08:46:31Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Bullshit. I remember years ago when during an argument about government health care one of our Canadian Dopers bragged about how it took his mother had to wait eight months to begin treatment for her cancer, and how happy he was about that because otherwise she couldn’t have gotten treatment at all. He seemed totally oblivious to the fact that many other people with cancer will die long before their eight months are up. > > Waits are already starting here in the U.S. because the ACA is driving specialists to quit because of both the regulatory burden the act places upon them and the fact that they can no longer determine a patient’s course of treatment but instead must abide by the dictates of what insurance companies or the government will allow. I cite evidence, your response is an anecdote and an ad-hoc excuse. Wow, it really is like talking to a creationist. According to the available evidence, the US healthcare system does not have substantially lower wait times, and there’s no reason to believe that Obamacare did that when, for example, [this survey](http://www.commonwealthfund.org/interactives-and-data/surveys/2013/2013-commonwealth-fund-international-health-policy-survey) is from less than a month after the exchanges went active in the first place. And of course, they never had the freedom to determine the patient’s course of treatment in the first place; they _always_ had to abide by the dictates of what insurance companies would allow. Now the government is involved, but you have yet to provide any evidence that this is actually more onerous. And I fully expect none to be forthcoming. And never mind, once again, that before Obamacare, if I needed a specialist appointment and didn’t have thousands of dollars to blow, chances are good that my wait time was “until my cadaver becomes medically useful” - which is exactly the point your friend was making. Before Obamacare, if you had a pre-existing condition and weren’t super-rich, you weren’t getting treatment. This is why you have all these people now clamoring that they’re going to die if Obamacare is repealed: because they likely _will_. But of course, the free market is so much better at distributing resources than the government. I’m sure we’re all so much better off when the decision “who can get health care” is determined by “who has money” rather than “who really needs it”. Despite all the evidence to the contrary. I’m sure it’s so much better when the “death panel” rationing out health care and deciding which treatments are justifiable to pay for is beholden to his company’s profit margin above all else. > [@](#): > > But all of this is beside the point, which is that conservatives do not indeed ‘want’ to see people dying in the streets for lack of health care. Rather it’s that they think private enterprise delivers a higher quality of care to a larger number of people overall than does a government system that provides so-so care for everyone. And a significant part of this is the recognition that more are likely to suffer and die under the so-so government system than will under the higher quality free enterprise system. Then they are idiots, completely incapable of looking at the real world and learning any lessons from it. And when the rubber hits the road, and we’re looking at millions of people losing life-saving medical coverage because of their stupidity, it becomes increasingly implausible for intelligent people to cut them any slack for their actions, regardless of whether they’re born out of stupidity or malice. “We’re so dumb, we couldn’t figure out that our actions would kill a bunch of people despite them screaming and hollering about it” is really not a good look from our elected leaders. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718.md?page=28) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-meryl-streep-you-are-a-play-actor-nothing-more/776718.md?page=30)