# Hey, Progressives and Liberals, Let's Pick Out A State To Take Over, Like Mississippi!
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318
**Category:** Great Debates
**Created:** [February 4, 2013, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318 "2013-02-04T16:51:38Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 2
### Author:  [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)
#### Post date: [February 4, 2013, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/21 "2013-02-04T19:53:42Z")
> [@silenus](#):
>
> Speaking on behalf of all Californians…
> pick Mississippi.
On behalf of ALL Californians? Is that you, Jerry?
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### Author:  [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)
#### Post date: [February 4, 2013, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/22 "2013-02-04T19:58:50Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#):
>
> Thanks for the explanation. I had no idea what was meant by progressive education; I grasped the rest of your platform well enough.
>
> Back to your main topic, do you believe that there are enough people of your political persuasion that are willing to place politics before every other aspect of their lives and move to another state as a political experiment, to actually have the effect you envision? I suspect there are not.
I do not know, but that is why I picked Mississippi. It has one the lowest population of any state that is not a) tiny, like Hawaii, Rhode Island and Delaware, where overcrowding problems would likely become an issue quickly or b) a frozen wasteland like Wyoming and Idaho, which would take only a couple of hundred thousand to “turn.” I’m kidding about “frozen wasteland” of course, and you know, if climate change continues apace, Wyoming and Idaho might become the new Mississippi, climate wise. I just don’t know enough to make a prediction. The future, she is a bitch to predict.
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### Author:  [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)
#### Post date: [February 4, 2013, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/23 "2013-02-04T20:04:12Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#):
>
> I do not know, but that is why I picked Mississippi. It has one the lowest population of any state that is not a) tiny, like Hawaii, Rhode Island and Delaware, where overcrowding problems would likely become an issue quickly or b) a frozen wasteland like Wyoming and Idaho, which would take only a couple of hundred thousand to “turn.” I’m kidding about “frozen wasteland” of course, and you know, if climate change continues apace, Wyoming and Idaho might become the new Mississippi, climate wise. I just don’t know enough to make a prediction. The future, she is a bitch to predict.
Do you anticipate a counter-movement by conservatives to counter this organized effort by progressives?
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### Author:  [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)
#### Post date: [February 4, 2013, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/24 "2013-02-04T20:13:42Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#):
>
> Do you anticipate a counter-movement by conservatives to counter this organized effort by progressives?
Of course not. Conservatives are conservative. They don’t like change, and that includes changes of address.
Now if you’re talking money, that’s different. Any progressive legislation that threatens to upset conservative apple carts will attract a lot of money to oppose it. Astroturf groups will be created, ad campaigns will happen … as occurred with that New England state that implemented Single Payer, or tried to, and insurance firms pumped millions of dollars into the state to persuade voters it was a bad idea.
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### Author:  [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)
#### Post date: [February 4, 2013, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/25 "2013-02-04T20:15:40Z")
BTW, I think this is a great idea. I still think it would be smarter to start with a state that is already more in the progressive camp, like MA, but that’s a minor quibble.
I fully support every political movement, be it progressive, green, libertarian or what-have-you, to do this. The several states are supposed to be laboratories for political experimentation.
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### Author:  [@Furious\_Marmot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Furious_Marmot)
#### Post date: [February 4, 2013, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/26 "2013-02-04T20:17:32Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#):
>
> That said, once some progressive laws get passed and lower and middle class people start having a hell of a lot more money and control over their lives, I believe the rate of change would accelerate greatly in Mississippi. After all, if you really think progressive/liberal ideas make the lives of average folks better, then it follows that implementing them will change minds. The REALITY of having more money and a better life would trump any fumings about “them damn progressive liberals” that conservatives come up with.
What laws, specifically, would give the poor people of Mississippi more money and control over their lives?
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### Author:  [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)
#### Post date: [February 4, 2013, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/27 "2013-02-04T20:19:20Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#):
>
> Of course not. Conservatives are conservative. They don’t like change, and that includes changes of address.
So White Flight was a progressive phenomenon? Sunbelt retirees are progressives?
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### Author:  [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)
#### Post date: [February 4, 2013, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/28 "2013-02-04T20:24:32Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#):
>
> Yes, CRAZY to want to model an education system after what is widely considered the best in the world. What am I THINKING? :dubious:
Do you not think there are school districts in the US that perform as well as the Finnish model? Of course there are.
Look, I like many things about the Finnish model. I’ve long thought we needed to make it so attractive to be a teacher that folks competed to get in. I think we should make good teachers earn at least twice what bad ones do (and determine good/bad based on evaluation, not test scores). I like mandatory recess/PE and arts and music.
But whenever somebody says “just do what country X” does (whether it’s for education, health care, crime, or anything) without even mentioning the rather obvious and huge differences between the countries - yeah, I find that a bit daft.
Anyway, to the OP question, I think it makes more sense to focus on states that are already rather progressive and are currently pushing for progressive reforms. Vermont’s single-payer health-care system being an obvious example. I think demonstrating that it works there is more likely to effect the national debate than trying to pull up dead-last Mississippi through massive migration. I wish Illinois, as another example, were allowed to keep or even expand their restrictive gun laws because their effectiveness or ineffectiveness could do a lot to move the national debate.
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### Author:  [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)
#### Post date: [February 4, 2013, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/29 "2013-02-04T20:25:56Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#):
>
> I knew I should have edited that first paragraph out. I was responding to the 2nd paragraph.
I briefly thought that might be the case, but wanted to make sure. I was a bit startled to see Finland cited as an ideal of libertarian education policy. 🙂
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### Author:  [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)
#### Post date: [February 4, 2013, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/30 "2013-02-04T20:33:23Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#):
>
> **Hey, Progressives and Liberals, Let’s Pick Out A State To Take Over, Like Mississippi!**
Wait, is this going to require **living** there? ☹
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### Author:  [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)
#### Post date: [February 4, 2013, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/31 "2013-02-04T20:42:29Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#):
>
> Wait, is this going to require **living** there? ☹
[Here](http://www.sos.ms.gov/links/elections/voter_information_center/tab1/Voter_Registration.pdf) is Mississippi’s Voter Registration form. You must be a current resident, and have lived in your current county for 30 days before the election. So, you could move there for a short while to vote, and then move back, trading a vote in your old state for one in Mississippi.
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### Author:  [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)
#### Post date: [February 4, 2013, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/32 "2013-02-04T21:45:59Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#):
>
> So White Flight was a progressive phenomenon? Sunbelt retirees are progressives?
Hmmm … good point. Still not sure how many conservatives would move to Mississippi to prevent them durned progressives from taking over. Hell, if they do that, we’ll just go to Alabama!
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### Author:  [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)
#### Post date: [February 4, 2013, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/33 "2013-02-04T21:48:27Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#):
>
> Wait, is this going to require **living** there? ☹
I lived on the Gulf Coast of Mississippi when I was a teenager. WONDERFUL PLACE, full of snakes, lizards, frogs and fish. The climate and land are beautiful, it just needs some progressiving up.
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### Author:  [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)
#### Post date: [February 4, 2013, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/34 "2013-02-04T21:50:49Z")
Folks - just finish off California. The Democratic party already controls the Assembly, the Senate and the Governor’s chair. With that control, plus the ability to add anything you want at the ballot box - you can come in and take it all with a little effort.
Seriously - I live here and have already come to terms with the fact that my vote won’t matter a bit in this state for many years - so get in here, and prove the naysayers wrong. Implement your taxes, programs, prison terms and worker’s rights programs. If it is as good as you say, California will rise again to the top.
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### Author:  [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)
#### Post date: [February 4, 2013, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/35 "2013-02-04T21:57:32Z")
> [@Furious\_Marmot](#):
>
> While I’m all for buying off people to get what one wants out of them, what are you going to offer to poor, conservative people in exchange for them switching sides on their deep-rooted, socially reinforced religious beliefs about abortion, homosexuality, etc.? A general promise of “better stuff for you poor folks” is not going to cut it. Their idea of a better public school system, for instance, is probably not the same as the one you have in mind.
Especially considering that to them, a much better place to live would be one with no liberals. Moving to Alabama, a lib might find himself…unwelcome. Severely.
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### Author:  [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)
#### Post date: [February 4, 2013, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/36 "2013-02-04T22:56:07Z")
This entire concept doesn’t jibe with progressivism/left liberalism. Progressives want to assert their way of life onto others using government force. They’re not the types to carve out a nook for themselves and live out the rest of their days in contentment.
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### Author:  [@Inbred\_Mm\_domesticus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inbred_Mm_domesticus)
#### Post date: [February 5, 2013, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/37 "2013-02-05T01:01:14Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#):
>
> Fun concept. It’s occurred to me with all the marijuana legalization and anti-abortion initiatives, that what makes a real difference in living conditions might just be the state you live in, rather than the nation you live in. Perhaps if liberals and progressives were to move to a state en masse we could swing enough political power to take over the state legislature and run things our way. A good, progressive, well funded public school system, pot legalized, same sex marriage legalized, universal health care, all sorts of good things.
>
> I have some candidates for states to take over which may surprise you:
>
> 1. Mississippi
> 2. California
> 3. Alabama
> 4. Connecticut
1. Colorado.
5a. Legalized marijuana,
5b. Boulder - “America’s progressive anus”,
5c. the constitution bans same-sex marriage but civil unions bill will pass and be signed this year (an influx of progressives may be able to turn this state into the freest state in the country and possibly freest place in the world),
5d. the rest of the state is sparsely populated,
5e. you want it cold? Go skiing. You want it warm? Stay on the front range.
If cold is bad you better strike Connecticut off the list. It’s not north midwest cold or anything but the northern part of the state can be brutal in Late Dec/January/February.
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### Author:  [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)
#### Post date: [February 5, 2013, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/38 "2013-02-05T01:07:38Z")
Nah. The libertarians are trying to do that with New Hampshire, I don’t know if it is working too well.
Besides, I don’t want to live in Mississippi or Alabama even if I could find a job in my field.
The best bet is to focus on naturally progressive states like Vermont or maybe CA and use lobbying power to get progressive legislation passed.
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### Author:  [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)
#### Post date: [February 5, 2013, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/39 "2013-02-05T01:08:41Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#):
>
> This entire concept doesn’t jibe with progressivism/left liberalism. Progressives want to assert their way of life onto others using government force. They’re not the types to carve out a nook for themselves and live out the rest of their days in contentment.
We only want to force ourselves on people when it is in other people’s best interest. We are like a rapist with a conscience.
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### Author:  [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)
#### Post date: [February 5, 2013, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-progressives-and-liberals-lets-pick-out-a-state-to-take-over-like-mississippi/649318/40 "2013-02-05T05:10:05Z")
Vermont is the obvious choice for progressives considering 1) it elected Bernie Sanders to the Senate, 2) is fairly small and lightly populated, 3) is culturally/socially/politically homogeneous thus not forcing to progressives to build unwiedly political coalitions, and 4) instituted single payer health care.
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