# Hey Twickster...How Was This Warning Justified? **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [December 16, 2009, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549 "2009-12-16T23:26:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![SkipMagic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skipmagic/32/20706_2.png) [@SkipMagic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SkipMagic)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/21 "2009-12-17T04:49:51Z")
> [@SmartAleq](#): > > He did nothing of the sort. I disagree. > [@](#): > > He made a general comment that Lynn twisted to be personal to her, and included a gratuitous insult. For which she hasn’t been warned, I note. What was the insult? > [@](#): > > Also of note, if it’s against the rules to talk about Lynn being fat, she ought to be banned by now because […] That’s not what was said: > [@SkipMagic](#): > > As it is, however, hajario made a couple of pokes at someone’s weight in a thread not even discussing weight. Like it or not, weight is a pretty personal issue, and focusing on one throwaway line just to drag the (sensitive) topic up is borderline jerkish. Continuing to harp on it like he did was definitely jerkish. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/22 "2009-12-17T04:50:40Z")
**Giraffe** , I am a former smoker who also used to weigh over a hundred pounds more than I do now. The harassment that smokers put up with just does not compare with the ridicule and humiliation that overweight people endure. But even if that weren’t true and weight problems _were_ just a habit or a choice and not a compulsion or often terminal disorder, **hajario** seemed to be mean-spirited and off topic in more than one exchange. ---
**Author:** ![kayT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayt/32/3633_2.png) [@kayT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayT)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 6:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/23 "2009-12-17T06:24:13Z")
Lynn started the snark by accusing hajario of jumping to conclusions, when he wasn’t even talking about her. I can’t even believe hajario got warned for this. Why didn’t Lynn? Normally I would expect both of them to get told to stick to the topic or something, not an actual warning to the second snarker… ---
**Author:** ![Giraffe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giraffe/32/129_2.png) [@Giraffe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giraffe)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/24 "2009-12-17T06:31:53Z")
> [@Zoe](#): > > **Giraffe** , I am a former smoker who also used to weigh over a hundred pounds more than I do now. The harassment that smokers put up with just does not compare with the ridicule and humiliation that overweight people endure. I wasn’t trying to equate them, I was trying to show how the exchange looks when you shift the topic away from weight, which is clearly a sensitive topic for some people. To me (neither obese nor a smoker), both exchanges look about the same: one person volunteered details about a personal habit, someone else posted something disapproving, and then they exchanged a few snippy words. People are justifiably sensitive about a range of issues: obesity, smoking, driving, debt, drugs, guns, bankruptcy, interracial marriage, sexual identity, etc. etc. etc. It’s one thing to shield people from abuse (outside of the Pit, anyway), it’s another to shield them from hearing any negative reactions to information they offer regarding those issues. And one person’s midnight pie is another person’s credit card debt – are we going to smack down all disapprovers equally or does it depend on who it’s a hot button issue for? **hajario** was definitely snippy after **Lynn** got a little snippy with him, but it seems like a huge overreaction to give a formal warning for it. Just my two cents. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/25 "2009-12-17T06:32:48Z")
> [@SkipMagic](#): > > Different people involved (specifically, I’m assuming, a non-staff member)? I think a warning would have been warranted and issued; in fact, based on past experience, we would have heard complaints–publicly or privately–if a mod hadn’t stepped in to say something. In this case I see it as treating **Lynn** like every other poster instead of letting it slide because she’s a mod. Since you guys are now more in the habit of revealing post reporting info, could you verify if **Lynn** was actually the sole complaint maker here? **Giraffe** ’s analogy lines up with my reading of what happened and I think most objective readers would see the same. Maybe **hajario** got snooty but Lynn is the one who made it all personal. And I disagree that he took a couple of pokes at her weight. The only likely candidate I see is that damn italics he had to use on “I” in the middle of his last sentence. Not worthy of a warning given the sudden heat of the discussion, brought on by Lynn, ISTM. eta: I think snooty is a much better adjective ---
**Author:** ![xash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/c6cbf5/32.png) [@xash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xash)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 9:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/26 "2009-12-17T09:53:38Z")
> [@SmartAleq](#): > > Also of note, if it’s against the rules to talk about Lynn being fat, she ought to be banned by now because she’s the one who brings up her fat, her digestion, how often she shits and what it smells/looks/smears like, mentions fucking CATHETERS in that post under discussion, for gods sake, and in general spends quite a lot of time and effort rubbing other people’s noses in her bodily functions. So, please, by all means, MAKE it a banning offense to say anything at all about the fat, eating habits and any and all other TMI regarding the corpus Bodoni, and in true Dope style make it retroactive–and get that big old ban stick out and smack Lynn upside the noggin with it, because she’s the biggest offender. **SmartAleq** , personal attacks are not permitted in ATMB. While you may discuss **Lynn** ’s posts in the other thread (as others have done), your post here is out of line for this forum. You have been warned. Please do not do this again. - **xash** Administrator ---
**Author:** ![ajb867](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f14d63/32.png) [@ajb867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ajb867)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 10:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/27 "2009-12-17T10:04:58Z")
Xash I might be confused but I thought moderators / adminstrators are not allowed to be pitted but their actions / postings can be discussed in ATMB? ---
**Author:** ![xash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/c6cbf5/32.png) [@xash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xash)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 10:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/28 "2009-12-17T10:32:26Z")
> [@ajb867](#): > > Xash I might be confused but I thought moderators / adminstrators are not allowed to be pitted but their actions / postings can be discussed in ATMB? My understanding is that moderator decisions (or their posts in their capacity as moderators) may no longer be disputed in the Pit, only in ATMB. However, I’m not aware of any rule that prohibits a mod or admin for being pitted for their posts in their personal capacity as members of this board. In this case, the subject (Lynn) made posts in her capacity as a member of these boards, not as a mod/admin. **Smartaleq** ’s post was not directed towards her moderator decision (or her posts in her capacity as admin), but to her personal posting habits (perceived or otherwise). **SmartAleq** is free to discuss her posts in ATMB, but doing so in the manner he did was out of line for this forum. Therefore, for example, you may dispute or discuss any moderator decision (or post) I make in my capacity as a mod, only in ATMB. But if you wanted to Pit my posts made in my capacity as a member here (on these boards), you are free to Pit me for that. Because the line may sometimes seem blurred, I always sign off when I’m responding in my capacity as admin. My sentence structure might have been ambiguous: “While you may discuss Lynn’s posts in the other thread (as others have done), your post here is out of line for this forum.” should read as… “While you may discuss Lynn’s posts **[made]** in the other thread **[in this thread]**(as others have done), your post **[that you made]** here **[in this thead in ATMB]** is out of line for this forum.” Does that clarify your question? - **xash** Administrator ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 10:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/29 "2009-12-17T10:37:57Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Since you guys are now more in the habit of revealing post reporting info, could you verify if **Lynn** was actually the sole complaint maker here? **Giraffe** ’s analogy lines up with my reading of what happened and I think most objective readers would see the same. Maybe **hajario** got snooty but Lynn is the one who made it all personal. > > And I disagree that he took a couple of pokes at her weight. The only likely candidate I see is that damn italics he had to use on “I” in the middle of his last sentence. Not worthy of a warning given the sudden heat of the discussion, brought on by Lynn, ISTM. > > eta: I think snooty is a much better adjective No, I didn’t make any sort of complaint. I didn’t report the post, nor did I even bring up the subject to any other person, either those on staff or those regular posters that I occasionally email/PM back and forth with. Let me repeat. I did not tell ANYONE about that post, and I certainly didn’t suggest any action be taken. Since hajario had quoted a small fragment of my post, I assumed that he was directing his comments to me. ---
**Author:** ![xash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/c6cbf5/32.png) [@xash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xash)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/30 "2009-12-17T10:42:07Z")
That sounds like such a contorted sentence :smack: On preview: referring to my second to last sentence in the post above. ---
**Author:** ![ajb867](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f14d63/32.png) [@ajb867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ajb867)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 10:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/31 "2009-12-17T10:55:16Z")
No worries Xash you clarified it fine for me. Thank you! ---
**Author:** ![bbs2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e495f1/32.png) [@bbs2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bbs2k)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 10:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/32 "2009-12-17T10:58:38Z")
> [@xash](#): > > “While you may discuss Lynn’s posts **[made]** in the other thread **[in this thread]**(as others have done), your post **[that you made]** here **[in this thead in ATMB]** is out of line for this forum.” > > Does that clarify your question? So **SmartAleq** would have been fine if she started _another_ new thread, this time in the Pit, remarking about Lynn’s original post? ---
**Author:** ![xash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/c6cbf5/32.png) [@xash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xash)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 11:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/33 "2009-12-17T11:08:20Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Since you guys are now more in the habit of revealing post reporting info, could you verify if **Lynn** was actually the sole complaint maker here? In my view, mods and admins should not reveal the identity of any specific poster who reported any specific post. Doing so would undermine the effectiveness of the post reporting system. If this has happened in the past (and I’m not aware that it has), it should not have happened. The only exceptions would be if a poster chooses to disclose that they have reported a post, or if a mod/admin responds to confirm that they have (or not) received a report(s) for a specific post. If this happens in the future, please bring it to my notice. Thanks. - **xash** Administrator ---
**Author:** ![xash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/c6cbf5/32.png) [@xash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xash)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/34 "2009-12-17T11:31:15Z")
> [@bbs2k](#): > > So **SmartAleq** would have been fine if she started _another_ new thread, this time in the Pit, remarking about Lynn’s original post? To my knowledge, yes, this would be within the rules, as long as the thread is not about (and does not make reference to) mod action or inaction with regards to **Lynn** ’s or **hajario** ’s original post (that’s what this thread is for), nor about (nor make reference to) **Lynn** ’s position as mod/admin, nor call for mod action with regards to the original post, thread or posters involved (that’s what this thread is for), and the content of the post itself does not break any Pit rules (for which you may seek clarification from any Pit mods). - **xash** Administrator ---
**Author:** ![Agent\_Foxtrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc29f/32.png) [@Agent\_Foxtrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Agent_Foxtrot)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/35 "2009-12-17T14:26:20Z")
Seriously, the rules of this board have gotten so ambiguous that even the mods and admins can’t keep up. I’ve seen **twickster** on more than one occasion make a very dubious ruling, then abandon the thread when people start calling her on it. Take [this](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=540238) instance, for example: [Quote=twickster] > [@Enderw24](#): > > The next time the cop comes around your place, throw your bed bug riddled mattress at him. As the flesh eating creatures surround him and consume his still writhing body, he’ll realize he shouldn’t have fucked with you and your mob connections. > Then take pictures of the scene and tape it to your neighbor’s door, and with a rusty pocketknife scratch “YOU’RE NEXT” on the woodwork. Please avoid personal insults. twickster, MPSIMS moderator [/quote] People respond, “WTF? Seriously?” She explains: [Quote=twickster] > [@Epimetheus](#): > > What?!! A humorous story with the closest thing being a person insult is “bed bug riddled mattress”. How is that a person insult? The statement implies that the person and his mattress are bug-infested, lacking basic hygiene. I’ll admit it’s not a particularly vicious insult, so I didn’t give an official warning – just a reminder to eschew personal insults. Thank you for your cooperation. twicks, MPSIMS mod [/quote] …then disappears from the thread. She seems a little trigger-happy with the warnings and rulings. Just sayin’. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/36 "2009-12-17T14:58:43Z")
> [@Lynn\_Bodoni](#): > > No, I didn’t make any sort of complaint. I didn’t report the post, nor did I even bring up the subject to any other person, either those on staff or those regular posters that I occasionally email/PM back and forth with. > > Let me repeat. I did not tell ANYONE about that post, and I certainly didn’t suggest any action be taken. Since hajario had quoted a small fragment of my post, I assumed that he was directing his comments to me. Well, I asked because I think that if this had involved any other posters I can’t imagine a mod response stronger than “Cool it off, folks”. Again I’ll note that you were the one that got all het up about hajario “jumping to the conclusion” that people eat pie in the middle of the night when that was precisely what you said. If you didn’t complain, (in which case, I really doubt _anyone_ reported the post) then I can only assume **twickster** should recluse herself from modding any thread that touches on over eating or you, whichever is the one that causes her to be irrational. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/37 "2009-12-17T15:19:01Z")
> [@twickster](#): > > **hajario** went out of his way to comment on one sentence from a much longer post with a self-righteous remark > [@Lynn\_Bodoni](#): > > Since hajario had quoted a small fragment of my post, I assumed that he was directing his comments to me. Wait…what??? The complaint is that since hajario quoted a “small fragment” or “one sentence” in Lynn’s post, it’s assumed that his comment is an attack on her? So…if he’d quoted the whole thing, he’d be making a generalized comment _not_ directed at her? Just when I thought the rules couldn’t get any screwier… Also, since when are snarky remarks banned? Every other fucking time I remember someone complaining about snarky remarks\*, we’ve been told that we follow in the footsteps of Cecil and that snarky remarks are ok as long as they’re not personal insults (and the famous “If ignorance were Corn Flakes you’d be Kelloggs” line referenced\*). Can we expect this new “No snark any time” rule to be enforced all the time in all forums? Or just in MPSIMS? Or is it another “one-time” rule like the “Thread titles have to be 100% accurate” or “No snarking on dead celebrities in MPSMIS” rules that are only enforced once to get someone and then forgotten? \*Yes, I know the brand/cereal is wrong. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/38 "2009-12-17T15:44:38Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Well, I asked because I think that if this had involved any other posters I can’t imagine a mod response stronger than “Cool it off, folks”. Again I’ll note that you were the one that got all het up about hajario “jumping to the conclusion” that people eat pie in the middle of the night when that was precisely what you said. If you didn’t complain, (in which case, I really doubt _anyone_ reported the post) then I can only assume **twickster** should recluse herself from modding any thread that touches on over eating or you, whichever is the one that causes her to be irrational. Two people, neither of them **Lynn** , reported the post. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/39 "2009-12-17T15:46:40Z")
> [@Fenris](#): > > The complaint is that since hajario quoted a “small fragment” or “one sentence” in Lynn’s post, it’s assumed that his comment is an attack on her? Well Fenris, when hajario said: > [@hajario](#): > > No wonder BMIs in this country are out of control. it was clearly a direct attack on Lynn. I mean the guy is obviously saying that she’s so fat that her BMI screws up the national average. What mean spirited hyperbole! ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549/40 "2009-12-17T17:37:04Z")
> [@xash](#): > > My understanding is that moderator decisions (or their posts in their capacity as moderators) may no longer be disputed in the Pit, only in ATMB. However, I’m not aware of any rule that prohibits a mod or admin for being pitted for their posts in their personal capacity as members of this board. In this case, the subject (Lynn) made posts in her capacity as a member of these boards, not as a mod/admin. **Smartaleq** ’s post was not directed towards her moderator decision (or her posts in her capacity as admin), but to her personal posting habits (perceived or otherwise). **SmartAleq** is free to discuss her posts in ATMB, but doing so in the manner he did was out of line for this forum. > > Therefore, for example, you may dispute or discuss any moderator decision (or post) I make in my capacity as a mod, only in ATMB. But if you wanted to Pit my posts made in my capacity as a member here (on these boards), you are free to Pit me for that. Because the line may sometimes seem blurred, I always sign off when I’m responding in my capacity as admin. > > My sentence structure might have been ambiguous: > > “While you may discuss Lynn’s posts in the other thread (as others have done), your post here is out of line for this forum.” > > should read as… > > “While you may discuss Lynn’s posts **[made]** in the other thread **[in this thread]**(as others have done), your post **[that you made]** here **[in this thead in ATMB]** is out of line for this forum.” > > Does that clarify your question? > > - **xash** > Administrator I don’t understand this at all, in light of what **SmartAleq** posted. **SmartAleq** was talking about how **Lynn Bodoni** talks about her bodily functions regularly; it had nothing to do with moderator actions. Also, would it be a defense against the personal insult warning that **SmartAleq** received if she posted a link to every time **Lynn Bodoni** has discussed her personal bodily functions on this board? In other words, I’m asking if a comment being the truth is a defense against a personal insult warning. And, to address the OP of this thread, that was a pretty weak warning for **Hajario**. I agree with other posters that an exchange like that should have earned both posters a “cool it, guys,” not an official warning. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hey-twickster-how-was-this-warning-justified/521549.md?page=3)