# Hillary: If the election had been held 12 days earlier, I'd be POTUS **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 2, 2017, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737 "2017-05-02T19:07:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2017, 12:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/141 "2017-05-05T12:07:01Z")
She believes the problem isn’t that she did anything wrong. The problem is that she got caught. > [@Fenris](#): > > Actually, I’d be unquestioned ruler of the world. BOW BEFORE GRAND POOHBAH FENRIS, MASTER OF THE EARTH! Not so fast - let’s see your birth certificate. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2017, 12:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/142 "2017-05-05T12:32:17Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > Well it does when we have an electoral system which strongly favors fudning by political action groups and industry-supported “institutes” which skew the focus of issues, fund nonsense science to support their position, and spew out bogus factoids while attacking candidates who speak factually, all under the guise of “freedom of speech”. We need to recognize that corporations are not “people” and their “speech” does not include deliberate misdirection and mistruth or vast amounts of campaign funding, provide a genuinely level platform for multiple parties to address the public, provide an independent fiscal analysis of proposed programs and initiatives, and limit actual campaigns to publically funded events with a limited window of time instead of a two or more year long procession of increasingly bizarre and vicious challenges. > > Stranger Or, silence any opinion i disagree with and stack the deck to favor my side. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2017, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/143 "2017-05-05T13:13:41Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > That highlights another one of the problems with the campaign that wouldn’t actually be fixed by ‘12 days earlier’. Instead of addressing her problems or owning her positions, Hillary and her followers would just keep trumpeting “At least I’m not Trump”, which isn’t a winning strategy. And yet we’re told how many people voted for Trump because “at least he wasn’t Hillary”. I know, I know - life and politics ain’t fair. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2017, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/144 "2017-05-05T13:30:53Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I fully accept the legitimacy of Trump’s victory based on the current system. > > However, I would point out that the victory was narrow – 70,000 or so votes across three states. > > I use the word “technicality” to describe the electoral college system because fewer and fewer really believe it ought to exist at all in the 21st Century. And going forward, confidence in the original Constitution is only going to wane. So yes, I stand by calling it a “technicality”. You can call it anything you like, as long as you don’t mind being wrong. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2017, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/145 "2017-05-05T13:33:53Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I fully accept the legitimacy of Trump’s victory based on the current system. > > However, I would point out that the victory was narrow – 70,000 or so votes across three states. > > I use the word “technicality” to describe the electoral college system because fewer and fewer really believe it ought to exist at all in the 21st Century. And going forward, confidence in the original Constitution is only going to wane. So yes, I stand by calling it a “technicality”. Most people use the word technicality to imply (in a derogatory fashion) that the results are not what they should have been. Thay the winner is somehow nor really entitled to their win. Trump won. Or more accurately Hillary lost That’s it. If Hillary had won with and electoral majority but a popular vote deficit, pretty much everyone using the word"technicality today would roll their eyes at anyone that used it after a Hillary victory. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2017, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/146 "2017-05-05T13:36:25Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > And yet we’re told how many people voted for Trump because “at least he wasn’t Hillary”. > > I know, I know - life and politics ain’t fair. How many of those people do you think we’re up for grabs? ---
**Author:** ![Thing\_Fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@Thing\_Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thing_Fish)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2017, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/147 "2017-05-05T15:03:30Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Don’t encourage her. Because if she runs again, the Repubs will run the second-place finisher from _The Bachelor_ and she’ll still lose. > > Regards, > Shodan Are you predicting that Trump will not be renominated, or that he will become the first sitting President to appear on _The Bachelor_? ---
**Author:** ![Thing\_Fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@Thing\_Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thing_Fish)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2017, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/148 "2017-05-05T15:10:05Z")
> [@Pleonast](#): > > Blaming Hillary is a popular method for assuaging personal guilt about the election results. “It’s not my fault I didn’t vote, Hillary didn’t energize me.” Or, “don’t blame me for not voting for her, Hillary ran a bad campaign.” People don’t want to accept their own role in Trump’s victory, so they rationalize their actions by blaming Hillary. I think she was a terrible candidate and I spent all last fall urging people to vote for her. Lots of other folks here are in the same boat. I’m not sure who these “people” you’re referring to are, but I doubt that anyone who posts in this forum didn’t bother to vote. ---
**Author:** ![Thing\_Fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@Thing\_Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thing_Fish)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2017, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/149 "2017-05-05T15:31:00Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > Clinton did make mistakes. But she’s quite correct in pointing to Comey’s choices as having been major influences on the November 8 outcome. Amazing how many people seem incapable of holding these two simple concepts in their head at the same time. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2017, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/150 "2017-05-05T22:41:36Z")
If it had been 11 days earlier, she would have lost even worse, what’s her point? She had the entire media, academic, and government establishment hacking at Trump for months. She can’t handle one bureaucrat? ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2017, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/151 "2017-05-06T04:35:12Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Yup. Guy who was AG at 30, Governor at 32 and President at 46 would have gone far regardless who he married. > > :dubious: > > Is it also unfair that she was married to one of the greatest politicians of all time, whose influence gifted her a Senate seat and jumped her up the line of Presidential hopefuls? > And she would be very stupid not to listen to the advice of Bill Clinton, hell she wrote in her first memoirs, that Bill valued the advice of former Presidents when he was in office, Nixon [gave him a lot of information on Russia before he died](http://www.nytimes.com/1994/04/25/us/for-clinton-and-nixon-a-rarefied-bond.html?pagewanted=all), which Clinton found to be first rate. > > As it is, you are right, she did shshh Bill, his advice to concentrate on working class [voters was brushed aside](http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/bill-clintons-lonely-one-man-effort-to-win-white-working-class-voters/article/2607228). I wonder why she brushed aside Bill’s advice. That’s really really bizarre if you ask me. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2017, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/152 "2017-05-06T04:48:36Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > But Hillary has to realize: “It’s over.” She had two cracks at the White House, and for various reasons (some her fault, others not), she failed. Ironically, Obama kept Hillary out of the White House twice, just like Bush kept McCain out of the White House twice. ---
**Author:** ![BigAppleBucky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigapplebucky/32/178_2.png) [@BigAppleBucky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigAppleBucky)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2017, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/153 "2017-05-06T14:42:07Z")
[![]( " - YouTube") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Et_mKloF6RA) ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2017, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/154 "2017-05-07T17:26:33Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > I wonder why she brushed aside Bill’s advice. That’s really really bizarre if you ask me. She’s very arrogant and thinks highly of herself, while this is pretty much required to run for president she seems to take it to an extreme (though not as extreme as Trump). I think she really believed that she was destined to be the First Female President, and that she just needed to keep doing what she wanted to do. I get the impression that she wasn’t worried about careful wording and strategy to start with, and by the time she did it was too late, and her advisors were too clumsy (like where they discussed with a newspaper her strategy for appearing more honest). The fact that she was embattled and in severe danger of losing the election, but stuck her head in the sand and decided to rally voters in NY and CA to rack up her popular vote total is a symptom of that, also one other issue: Her comments on DC vs Heller really points to this- it looks to me like she knee jerked and decided “it’s pro-gun so it’s bad”, out of the blue without really thinking about it, even though there was a massively better position she could take, because she is sure she’s right and her voters will go along with her… I don’t think she ever sat down with a strategist and decided that effectively taking a radical position on gun control was a good idea (‘I want to ban all handguns and storing firearms for self defense’), but that’s what opposing Heller actually means to anyone who knows about the issue. Hardcore pro-gun ‘Second Amendment Sam’ can tell his socially liberal but moderately pro-gun buddy Joe “Look, Heller says you can’t ban guns, Hillary says she wants to get rid of it, so clearly she wants to ban guns, do you really want her to pick a justice to ban guns?”. But the position “this was a great ruling, we’ve never been in favor of gun bans but this assures you they won’t happen, and affirms that Common Sense Gun Control is not a problem” doesn’t actually contradict anything she’s said. It doesn’t require her to pretend to be pro-gun, doesn’t require any actual change in her political position, but is much more reassuring to so many people. With that position, it’s a lot easier for ‘social liberal, moderate pro-gun’ Joe to ignore Second amendment Sam talking about Hillary banning guns as just extremist crazy talk, and for Joe to put gun issues on the back burner, figuring she may do some stuff he doesn’t like but nothing too bad. But as far as I can tell, she just didn’t think it was even worth thinking out a response to the issue, she just fired of the cuff and ran with it. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2017, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/155 "2017-05-07T18:06:09Z")
Originally Posted by astorian “But Hillary has to realize: “It’s over.” She had two cracks at the White House, and for various reasons (some her fault, others not), she failed.” Hey, Reagan won on his third try. ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2017, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/156 "2017-05-07T18:42:34Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > I wonder why she brushed aside Bill’s advice. That’s really really bizarre if you ask me. I think we tend to forget just how improbable Trump’s victory was assumed to be in those months of yesteryear. Trump’s candidacy was looked at by many Dems as more of a gift than a threat. Most of the punditocracy was inside the liberal leaning media bubble and she was cruising to a 70-80% polling assured victory. What the hell did she need to listen to Bill Clinton’s old school advice for? It was in the bag, it was going to be a coronation. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2017, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/157 "2017-05-08T02:39:06Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > She’s very arrogant and thinks highly of herself, while this is pretty much required to run for president she seems to take it to an extreme (though not as extreme as Trump). I think she really believed that she was destined to be the First Female President, and that she just needed to keep doing what she wanted to do. I get the impression that she wasn’t worried about careful wording and strategy to start with, and by the time she did it was too late, and her advisors were too clumsy (like where they discussed with a newspaper her strategy for appearing more honest). The fact that she was embattled and in severe danger of losing the election, but stuck her head in the sand and decided to rally voters in NY and CA to rack up her popular vote total is a symptom of that, also one other issue: > > Her comments on DC vs Heller really points to this- it looks to me like she knee jerked and decided “it’s pro-gun so it’s bad”, out of the blue without really thinking about it, even though there was a massively better position she could take, because she is sure she’s right and her voters will go along with her… I don’t think she ever sat down with a strategist and decided that effectively taking a radical position on gun control was a good idea (‘I want to ban all handguns and storing firearms for self defense’), but that’s what opposing Heller actually means to anyone who knows about the issue. Hardcore pro-gun ‘Second Amendment Sam’ can tell his socially liberal but moderately pro-gun buddy Joe “Look, Heller says you can’t ban guns, Hillary says she wants to get rid of it, so clearly she wants to ban guns, do you really want her to pick a justice to ban guns?”. > > But the position “this was a great ruling, we’ve never been in favor of gun bans but this assures you they won’t happen, and affirms that Common Sense Gun Control is not a problem” doesn’t actually contradict anything she’s said. It doesn’t require her to pretend to be pro-gun, doesn’t require any actual change in her political position, but is much more reassuring to so many people. With that position, it’s a lot easier for ‘social liberal, moderate pro-gun’ Joe to ignore Second amendment Sam talking about Hillary banning guns as just extremist crazy talk, and for Joe to put gun issues on the back burner, figuring she may do some stuff he doesn’t like but nothing too bad. But as far as I can tell, she just didn’t think it was even worth thinking out a response to the issue, she just fired of the cuff and ran with it. She is maybe at the median of arrogance and self regard which is found in almost all politicians, notwithstanding the rantings you find in comments sections. I have never seen her go off in a fit of arrogance or conceit and I don’t think anyone here has. Words put in someones mouth don’t count. ---
**Author:** ![purplehearingaid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7bcc69/32.png) [@purplehearingaid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehearingaid)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2017, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/158 "2017-05-08T02:59:06Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > Hillary, please, just go away. I feel the same way about trump and pence , I want the 2 to go far away ! Trump keep talking about he is the president and Hillary keep saying she should had been the president ! I wish they both would shut up about this ! I don’t think trump can really believe that he won if he did he wouldn’t keep reminding himself that he did win ! People already know this so there is no need for trump to keep saying he is the god damn president ! :smack: How many days left does he have ! ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2017, 6:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/159 "2017-05-08T06:51:39Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > I wonder why she brushed aside Bill’s advice. That’s really really bizarre if you ask me. Not sure what Hillary thought, but [Schumer shared this brilliant gem:](http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/438481/chuck-schumer-democrats-will-lose-blue-collar-whites-gain-suburbs) > [@](#): > > “For every blue-collar Democrat we lose in western Pennsylvania, we will pick up two moderate Republicans in the suburbs in Philadelphia, and you can repeat that in Ohio and Illinois and Wisconsin.” ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2017, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737/160 "2017-05-08T12:35:53Z")
Hillary tweets congrats to Macron: > [@HRC](#): > > Victory for Macron, for France, the EU, & the world. > Defeat to those interfering w/democracy. (But the media says I can’t talk about that) That’s Trumpian in tone. Get over it, Hill. Get over it. Is there any truth to the rumor that she’s thinking about running again? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hillary-if-the-election-had-been-held-12-days-earlier-id-be-potus/785737.md?page=9)